Diet advice for bladder stones

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Fluffypig123

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Hello all,

Sorry to post a thread for advice but I want to make sure I'm doing this right and I'm not 100% on the sample diet.

I have a 5 year old male (Mint) who has just had surgery to remove a bladder stone and his urine still has powder in it. He is also very prone to bloat and doesnt drink enough. Mint is also REALLY prone to bloat. Tiny Broccoli tree set it off last time.

We also have a 4 year old male with interstitial cystitis (Kenny)

Previously, we were feeding too many nuggets (science selective) Which is now realise is alfalfa based so we switched them to Selective grain free which is timothy hay and very limited amounts daily,

They have cucumber and pepper daily, with grass twice a day. Occasionally they have some coriander or a leaf of basil or a blueberry.

Its their daily staple diet I'm struggling with.

Please could you offer your advice as to what I should feed? I'm so worried about feeding calcium that I think we may actually be feeding too little now!

They also have those hay houses that are topped with carrot and they LOVE playing with them but ive since read carrots should t be given to calcium stone prone pigs or those with interstitial cystitis. I did notice when Kenny (the one with IC) had fresh carrot it used to set it off.

Should I not let them have these houses? I would be sad to stop giving them those houses as it keeps them both busy.

They have unlimited Science selective Timothy Hay with a meadow hay thats a bit softer for variety.

I just want to do whats best for them and I cant seem to get it right 😞
 
I’m sorry to hear of the stones

He can have lettuce, cucumber, bell pepper and a small amount of coriander daily. Keep grass in his diet as that is good.
Giving veg is important as it brings water into the diet, particularly when they aren’t good drinkers.
If you know something in that list is going to cause him bloat then obviously don’t give it.

Pellets, even low calcium grain free ones, bring a lot of calcium into the diet so ensuring they are kept limited can help.
You can also cut pellets out entirely.
Make sure to filter drinking water also.

The thing to be careful with Kenny is that with IC it isn’t so much the diet but rather changes to the diet that can set off a flare up

I actually don’t feed my piggies any pellets whatsoever and that gives me more leeway in the veg part of their diet. I then do feed a high calcium veg once a week or so without concern of it making things too high or too low. I also feed a bit more than one cup of veg and they also get many hours on the lawn each day.
It is about finding a balance which works for you and your piggies though (and yes being too low in calcium can be as problematic as being too high) - this is just the balance that works for mine.

If you choose to stop using the carrot cottages, there is an alternative without the carrot - hay cubes. Essentially the same thing as carrot cottage use without the carrot (and they are cube rather than house shaped!)

Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets
 
Piggies&buns said:
I’m sorry to hear of the stones

He can have lettuce, cucumber, bell pepper and a small amount of coriander daily. Keep grass in his diet as that is good.
Giving veg is important as it brings water into the diet, particularly when they aren’t good drinkers.
If you know something in that list is going to cause him bloat then obviously don’t give it.

Pellets, even low calcium grain free ones, bring a lot of calcium into the diet so ensuring they are kept limited can help.
You can also cut pellets out entirely.
Make sure to filter drinking water also.

The thing to be careful with Kenny is that with IC it isn’t so much the diet but rather changes to the diet that can set off a flare up

I actually don’t feed my piggies any pellets whatsoever and that gives me more leeway in the veg part of their diet. I then do feed a high calcium veg once a week or so without concern of it making things too high or too low. I also feed a bit more than one cup of veg and they also get many hours on the lawn each day.
It is about finding a balance which works for you and your piggies though (and yes being too low in calcium can be as problematic as being too high) - this is just the balance that works for mine.

If you choose to stop using the carrot cottages, there is an alternative without the carrot - hay cubes. Essentially the same thing as carrot cottage use without the carrot (and they are cube rather than house shaped!)

Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets
Click to expand...
Yeah at the moment, I cant figure our if they are too low in calcium or too high.

I like to give them a small amount of nuggets as I put them in a ball toy so it keeps them busy.

If wonder if I tried them on the pellets that are just timothy hay?

Ive also recently started them on the Sherwood Urinary tablets. Ive been mixing them with water and syringe feeding.

They just love to forage and I feel bad as all the dry forage mixes I google, says that bladder stone pigs shouldnt have it.

Just trying my best to keep them healthy and entertained.
 

Dry forage and pellets make up the same part of the diet - so you may be able to give one but not both.
In terms of fresh forage, dandelion is a mild diuretic so can be helpful in encouraging bigger urination which keeps the bladder flushing through.
Dried anything obviously has all the water taken out so it isn’t helpful from encouraging a wet diet point of view

Do you filter their water?
Water and pellets are the major contributors to calcium in the diet

You don’t have to cut pellets out but all pellets contain calcium regardless of whether they are 100% grass or not so you would need to check content.
Removing pellets and then concentrating on the veg part of the diet can be an option, not only can the removal of pellets provide leeway within the veg portion of the diet, the veg itself provides additional fluid intake. Additional fluid means stronger urination which keeps the bladder flushing through and removes sediment from the bladder. Poor drinkers don’t help themselves really! You can add an extra slice of cucumber per day; or very carefully offering additional water from A syringe a few times a day.
I’ve added in our nugget guide below - the up to date version is at the end of its thread
Pellet/Nugget Brands Comparison Chart

As i say though things will be a bit trickier for you given changing Kenny’s diet may not do him favours.

If you are going to switch pellet then I would say to try Piggie Parcels urinary pellets (piggie parcels is a company run by a member of this forum). Piggie parcels pellets are highly recommended, no fillers
Etc.
This is because they contain glucosamine which helps support the bladder.
Guinea Pig Pellet - Joint and Urinary Support Formula 1kg

There is no evidence that the Sherwood support will do anything. It seems to just contain cranberry which doesn’t help piggy bladders in the way it does human bladders.
Glucosamine is a good supplement to give as it does support bladder health - it helps replenish the natural glucosamine layer in the bladder which can be damaged by sludge and stones. Sherwood urinary support does not contain glucosamine.
Therefore giving either a glucosamine supplement or trying the piggie parcels pellets can help the health of the bladder. What you cannot do is give both though - there is plenty of glucosamine in the pellets on their own so you should not give an additional supplement if they are fed the pellets.

It is a balance that has to be found and unfortunately it is going to work differently for every piggy.
Do remember that any diet changes take several weeks to have an effect on the body
 
I’m
Piggies&buns said:
Dry forage and pellets make up the same part of the diet - so you may be able to give one but not both.
In terms of fresh forage, dandelion is a mild diuretic so can be helpful in encouraging bigger urination which keeps the bladder flushing through.
Dried anything obviously has all the water taken out so it isn’t helpful from encouraging a wet diet point of view

Do you filter their water?
Water and pellets are the major contributors to calcium in the diet

You don’t have to cut pellets out but all pellets contain calcium regardless of whether they are 100% grass or not so you would need to check content.
Removing pellets and then concentrating on the veg part of the diet can be an option, not only can the removal of pellets provide leeway within the veg portion of the diet, the veg itself provides additional fluid intake. Additional fluid means stronger urination which keeps the bladder flushing through and removes sediment from the bladder. Poor drinkers don’t help themselves really! You can add an extra slice of cucumber per day; or very carefully offering additional water from A syringe a few times a day.
I’ve added in our nugget guide below - the up to date version is at the end of its thread
Pellet/Nugget Brands Comparison Chart

As i say though things will be a bit trickier for you given changing Kenny’s diet may not do him favours.

If you are going to switch pellet then I would say to try Piggie Parcels urinary pellets (piggie parcels is a company run by a member of this forum). Piggie parcels pellets are highly recommended, no fillers
Etc.
This is because they contain glucosamine which helps support the bladder.
Guinea Pig Pellet - Joint and Urinary Support Formula 1kg

There is no evidence that the Sherwood support will do anything. It seems to just contain cranberry which doesn’t help piggy bladders in the way it does human bladders.
Glucosamine is a good supplement to give as it does support bladder health - it helps replenish the natural glucosamine layer in the bladder which can be damaged by sludge and stones. Sherwood urinary support does not contain glucosamine.
Therefore giving either a glucosamine supplement or trying the piggie parcels pellets can help the health of the bladder. What you cannot do is give both though - there is plenty of glucosamine in the pellets on their own so you should not give an additional supplement if they are fed the pellets.

It is a balance that has to be found and unfortunately it is going to work differently for every piggy.
Do remember that any diet changes take several weeks to have an effect on the body
Click to expand...
thank you for your response.

Unfortunately we have a new issue on our hands.

We lost Kenny the other day. It turned out that he had small bladder stones in his urethra. So I'm convinced its something I'm doing and I feel awful 😞

So we now have Mint on his own at the moment and I'm trying to find ways to keep him ocupied.

He loves playing with plastic cups and his tteat ball but obviously as per what you said, pellets are limited. I did buy some Timothy hay pellets that havent arrived yet as it just said the ingredients were 100% timothy hay, from this company: Timothy Hay Pellets

Do they still have to be really limited? Obviously I'm not going to pile them in but if it means I can use a little more to keep him busy?

Those pellets you linked, they have Mint and other bits in them that i read are high in calcium?

I'm sorry, I'm just so terrified and feel awful that I'm the cause of Kennys death and mints stones and now we have the boredom aspect to deal with as well for Mint.

None of our local rescues have any male
Guinea pigs to foster (I dont want to get in the cycle of never ending guinea pigs) and mints not castrated so it limits our options 😔

Mint gets very gassy (especially recently) so I have to be careful with giving more watery veg.
 
I’m so sorry for your loss

Please don’t blame yourself. It can be hard to get the balance as there is no set answer or perfect diet, plus once genetics are thrown in which obviously you can’t do anything about, the situation can be far from simple. You are also dealing with a bloat prone piggy and Kenny having had IC adds another layer of complication.
You are doing everything you can do.

Yes, all pellets need to be kept limited to no more than one tablespoon per day. All pellets contain calcium, even the 100% Timothy pellets. Even low calcium varieties contain more calcium than kale (the highest calcium veg).

There doesn’t seem to be any information on the website of the pellets you have linked in to know what their calcium and phosphorous content is.
The closest comparison is probably haybox (that is grass but not specifically Timothy) and their calcium content is 0.6, given the calcium content of Timothy grass itself then I would expect the ones you have ordered to be fairly similar to the haybox ones. There are variances between brands - but consider the commercial brands most recommended such as science selective grain free are also around 0.6.

The benefit to the ones you have found is that they are 100% Timothy so don’t contain the fillers of other commercial brands.
However an issue I can see with them is that it is highly likely they are not fortified with any vitamin c (I say this as they seem to be marketed for rabbits who don’t need vit c fortification given they produce their own, whereas piggies don’t produce it so need it from food). This isn’t necessarily a problem per se but it does mean all his daily vit c intake needs to be met by his veg portion as you wont have the pellets forming the back up/bridging intake.

The piggie parcels pellets are absolutely fine to give - including from a calcium point of view. They also have the benefit of being designed specifically for bladder prone piggies (by a knowledgeable guinea pig owner) so contain glucosamine. (Along with the other benefits of being filler free, grass based and vit c fortified).

Are you in a hard or soft water area?
Do you filter his drinking water?

I’ve added an enrichment guide below and our bereaved piggy guide as they contain ideas on how to look after and keep a bereaved piggy occupied.

Hopefully a friend will come up in rescue soon.

Enrichment Ideas for Guinea Pigs
Looking After a Bereaved Guinea Pig
 
Fluffypig123 said:
I’m

thank you for your response.

Unfortunately we have a new issue on our hands.

We lost Kenny the other day. It turned out that he had small bladder stones in his urethra. So I'm convinced its something I'm doing and I feel awful 😞

So we now have Mint on his own at the moment and I'm trying to find ways to keep him ocupied.

He loves playing with plastic cups and his tteat ball but obviously as per what you said, pellets are limited. I did buy some Timothy hay pellets that havent arrived yet as it just said the ingredients were 100% timothy hay, from this company: Timothy Hay Pellets

Do they still have to be really limited? Obviously I'm not going to pile them in but if it means I can use a little more to keep him busy?

Those pellets you linked, they have Mint and other bits in them that i read are high in calcium?

I'm sorry, I'm just so terrified and feel awful that I'm the cause of Kennys death and mints stones and now we have the boredom aspect to deal with as well for Mint.

None of our local rescues have any male
Guinea pigs to foster (I dont want to get in the cycle of never ending guinea pigs) and mints not castrated so it limits our options 😔

Mint gets very gassy (especially recently) so I have to be careful with giving more watery veg.
Click to expand...
I’m sorry for your loss. You’ve done everything you can for Kenny, please be compassionate with yourself as you grieve.
 
I'm very sorry for your loss and situation 💜

When my boy had a stone, my vet recommended me to give RodiCare® uro as a part of the after treatment after surgery. Its not a medication, its just herbs. My boy didn't make it through the surgery, so I didn't try it. But I've tried other of Alfavets products and think they are great. UroCare has good reviews on Amazon also.
 
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