• Discussions taking place within this forum are intended for the purpose of assisting you in discussing options with your vet. Any other use of advice given here is done so at your risk, is solely your responsibility and not that of this forum or its owner. Before posting it is your responsibility you abide by this Statement

Recurring ear infection

Status
Not open for further replies.
OrioniS

OrioniS

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
49
Reaction score
0
Points
120
Location
London, UK
My boy had ear infection 2 weeks ago and finished Baytril course of 10 days last Wednesday. Strangely, today I found that he has slight tilt again. Now that's eider what left of last ear infection (was very tough) or it's recurring again. Any thoughts?

I'll wait and see, last time it was roughly 3 days after first sign, he started developing de-orientation (side walk, dropping etc), high temperature (he was sweating). Maybe that 10 days was not enough, I still got some Baytrill, but they may be resistant now, .

PS. Anyone knows correct body temperature GP?
 
Baytril may well not be the best for him if it is coming back, its probably the infection returning, as the baytril did not kill off all of the infection. Ask your vet for a different antibiotic. And get him seen as soon as you can. Ear infections are painful.

As far as I'm aware guinea pigs do not sweat. There body temperature should be between 35.9 - 37.5 degrees C, (96.6 - 99.5'F) this data if from the veterinary small animal care and husbandary book. There will always be some degree of variation so i wouldnt say he has a high temperature until over around 38.5 - 39 degrees.

x.
 
I'm sorry that appears to be returning I wouldn't hesitate in taking him back to the vet from what I have read ear infections can be quite sinister if left.

My Fred is still on his Baytril after his episode, he also had a steroid injection to reduce the inflammation. I hope Fred's doesn't reappear once we stop the course how long after you finished the medicine did your pig's symptom's re-appear?

Do keep us updated, perhaps if the infection has re-occurred it maybe worth thinking about a culture and Antibiotic sensitivity test? Abi do you know if this is possible with ear infections or would it only be possible if there was a burst abscess in the eardrum?
 
Thanks guys,

Basically infection was severe (don't let me start on this one, stupid first vet), After Amir (second vet, brilliant) gave me 10 days course on 10% Baytril (this is strong stuff), just again should kick myself in the b***ks as I KNEW that this is too short period!

Abi_nurse: I'm not sure about that, just when I picked him up, he was hot and sweaty, kind of damp fur. Maybe is just me. We will have a baby soon (2 months) and my Missus is driving me "nuttery", "we have to save for this, we have to save for that". AND I have ill piggy! For Christ sake...

Sorry, just need to let steam out.

I know that is starting again, because he was sqeeking yesterday and day before very loudly, with apparent "no reason", and now he didn't even moved to greet me. Just stayed in the corner until I gave them some more hay. OK, for me there is always a reason. PAIN. I cannot talk to animals, but I can feel what they feel. Mostly. It was always with cats and dogs. My father used to say that I have a gift with them...

Bummer, just finished work. Is 7.30 in the morning. Going back at 19:30. and there will be a travel with them two to the vet. Good, big coffee, a bit of grouting (still need to finish toilet's tiling). Am I winging? Maybe... It's tough.

Wish them luck... I hope they don't need it, just you never know... I'll be back later, or tomorrow...

PS. That's inner ear, nothing outside visible...
 
Just came back from Vet. Treatment: Back on 10% Baytril for another 14 days. Keep topping up Pro-Biotic and wait to see if it clears. If that will not helps, another antibiotic. OK, sounds reasonable. Next infection is mild, so Baytril should cleared.

I'm just wondering, where is coming from (the infection itself). They had some Stronghold to keep mites at bay few days ago. There is no draft from the door (unless under the door... we let them run on the floor before, for 2-3 weeks, and is winter now...)

They hate new dry food (Burgens), but they love P@H pellets... Brilliant, some one hates me up there... :))
 
Lolek's story is not over yet. Beginning started with 10% Baytril 0.1ml twice a day for 10 days and Panacur for 28 days. Stupid me, that I didn't listen to myself after those 10 days to continue for full 14days (he was OK, but still kinda different (slightly watery eyes, still sensitive ear, something not right)), but Vet said 10 days, so be it. After 2 days, he started to tilt his head again and shake it like before - like he's got something in the ear. Back to Vet, ok... infection probably not cleared yet, but is milder than before. 10% Baytril 0.1ml twice a day, 14 days. 10 days later (which is today), he still is not right, head slightly tilted, when shaking it, he looses balance a bit, after administering antibiotic he is stronger, but near the next dose, he is getting same signs. To me, it's sounds like Baytril is keeping infection at bay, but not clearing it. Still sensitive ear, soon as you touch there he moves away like this is still painful. Problem is, that I'm running out of time and if he needs another AB what will it be? Septrim? Or other... He is for the last 3-4 weeks on Baytril. Not good.

Any idea?

I'm going this Friday to Vet again. That's it. I had enough.
 
Last edited:
OK, now I'm p*** off, excuse my language.

Just got off the phone and I was told "I did explain you, there is not much we can do...". YES, WE CAN DO MORE. What about Septrim, what about any other antibiotic...!? Only thing "we" did was bloody BAYTRIL and Panacur!

Anyone has any idea what other antibiotic "we" can try?
 
Tia had an ear infection but luckily it was not in the inner ear. She looked hunched and suddenly developed a severe head tilt right before my eyes On looking in her ear there was pus which she shook everywhere so straight up to the vet. I asked for it to be cultured and it came back as Pseudomonas resistant to practically every class/type of antibiotic.

She (and her huspig as a precaution) received daily gentamycin injections from the vet for 7 days as that was the only one it was sensitive too and it has cleared up a treat. I had to disinfect everywhere she had been and adopt strict barrier measures between them and the rest of my pigs.

With a proper ear exam (under light sedation if necessary) it should be possible to tell if it is worth taking a sample/washing from the outer ear for culture nd also rule out ear mites.

Tia's huspig Ginger previously had ear mites and developed head tilt. He was given doramectin injections (similar to ivermectin) plus surolan drops to help clear the gunk in the ear that accompanied it. Spot on was considered of no use as it couldn;t penetrate the gunk to get to the mites (hence the injections) and the surolan also contains an antibacterial and mild steroid to hlep prevent any secondary infection and reduce inflammation.

One other anitbiotic for stubborn infections could be azithromycin - it's good for abcesses as it reaches the parts other anitbioics can;t reach - but I don;t know about the pharmacokinetics of whether it could penetrate well enough into the inner ear? If you can go to simon Maddock at Cat and Rabbit in Dunston, he uses this drug quite a bit in piggies and may be more helpful for you than your current vet.

I completely understand your frustration and hope you make further progress to resolving your little one's ear problem.

HTH
xx
 
I don't think that he got any mites left as 1. he had Canaural to start with (first vet scratched his ear trying to "administrate" it... 2. Both had Spot on with ivermectin 3. After 2 weeks I did shot Stronghold for puppies for both of them and after few days they stop scratching themselves that often.
Now, is only Lolek with his wet eyes and sad look. I've got Septrin today, so we will see after Monday if it does work, if not there will be another trip to vet for another AB.

Wish me luck...
 
OK, almost wheek passed since I wrote last time. After last Monday, I went to see Ann Taylor in Ewell (40 minutes drive) and after consultation, she decided to give my boar Metacam. Checked ears and found nothing, they are clear. He is very live, and unfortunately, he still has the tilt, not as much as before, but...

I'm still giving him Septrin and he's loving it. Maybe it's just me, but he is not the same any more. and the ear is still sensitive... She recon, that we need to wait and see what will develop (if anything). Right now, we are puzzled: He is alive and kicking (and very noisy as she said ;-), eat and drink normally, didn't lost much weight (still around 1.08 kg), but still has tilt, loses balance (unless that is caused by tilt) when shaking head and sometimes running. If infection is cleared and damage to inner ear is permanent, he will stay that way. At least he is alive and I found good vet who's selling Critical Care ;-)))) Time will tell.

I've learn that Baytril is NOT the best for inner ear infection, if your piggy has developed tilt and there is nothing visual in the ear itself, go strait on antibiotic in ORAL form (first 3 days are crucial), do not let your vet play with stuff like Canaural, it will NOT work. Other thing is that course of antibiotic should be 2 wheeks minimum and not 7-10 day course. If you start-stop course it will have a 75% chance that bacteria is immune to it already.

Problem with inner ear infection is that you cannot check, what type of bacteria you fighting with and there need to be mite/lice killing course as well to make sure that cause of infection is eliminated.

so, we are waiting...
 
Ok, yeah, I sound probably a bit difficult. I know that, but being persistent thought me that is nothing like sure answer for anything. Ann Tylor is 3rd vet I saw with my guinea, but she was like "OK, this is what we can do and that what we can do in the future in case of...". She went with me on guinea lynx web to check other antibiotics and there was nothing like "there is nothing else we can do.." type...

Lolek is still "tilted" and he is on Septrin for 5 days now, can't see any difference. Either infection is gone or is immune, can't check it. Only thing what makes me suspicious is that on the beginning he was responding to Baytril and his head WASN'T tilted until I've stopped first 10-days course.

I'm wondering is azithromycin can help. It helped guineas with deep infection...
 
My piggy has just finished a course of Zithromax for a deep seated abscess & so far it is looking good. It was prescribed by Simon Maddox at the Cat & Rabbit clinic, Northampton. Daisy had an op to remove it first but it was a huge abscess so after 5 days of Septrin Simon put her on Zithromax (azithromycin) to clear any remaining infection.

I'm sorry I have no experience of head tilt/ear infection in piggies, but with regards to the balance problem, I can give a human view :) I suffered badly from a bout of Vertigo 2 years ago, I have an imbalance in my inner ear & Vertigo is awful, the ear problem caused me to be very unsteady on my feet for weeks afterwards. However the brain does learn how to compensate for the problem, & readjusts, so hopefully your piggy will get his balance back & live a normal life even with a slight head tilt. Hope that makes sense! :)
 
Last edited:
When Fred had his episode, running around in circles, falling over and flickering eyes - he came round quickly. When we visited the vet, the vet said Fred was lucky as he hadn't been left with a bad tilt it was very slight. The vet went onto say some animals are left with a tilt perhaps his tilt will never go away?
 
recurring of ear infection

could be an infection or it could be she got mud or water in there and pigs aren't above getting a fungus in there if ears are wet a lot. If she was mine I would give her a day or two to see if she gets it taken care of herself. Sometimes they get water in there from their pools and they will head tilt and shake their heads a lot also if a bug got in there. Ear infections are a little more insidious and they may have a head tilt but they don't usually walk around shaking it. If it is an ear infection you can ask your vet for an antibiotic...again I don't like Baytril even if it is the drug of choice cause its only good if you can get it in the pig and even cross country I have never found anyone that managed to get it in the pig. Must be some terrible tasting stuff as they foam at the mouth even. I prefer the Ampicillin which I can get them to eat.
 
malishajohnjerri said:
could be an infection or it could be she got mud or water in there and pigs aren't above getting a fungus in there if ears are wet a lot. If she was mine I would give her a day or two to see if she gets it taken care of herself. Sometimes they get water in there from their pools and they will head tilt and shake their heads a lot also if a bug got in there. Ear infections are a little more insidious and they may have a head tilt but they don't usually walk around shaking it. If it is an ear infection you can ask your vet for an antibiotic...again I don't like Baytril even if it is the drug of choice cause its only good if you can get it in the pig and even cross country I have never found anyone that managed to get it in the pig. Must be some terrible tasting stuff as they foam at the mouth even. I prefer the Ampicillin which I can get them to eat.
Click to expand...


"Lab Anim Sci. 1987 Oct;37(5):652-6.
An evaluation of ampicillin pharmacokinetics and toxicity in guinea pigs.

Young JD, Hurst WJ, White WJ, Lang CM.
Source

Research Service, VA Medical Center, Sepulveda, CA 91343.

Sodium ampicillin was administered subcutaneously to 350-550 g male Dunkin Hartley guinea pigs at doses of 6, 8 and 10 mg/kg tid for 5 days. Over a period of 12 days, the lowest ampicillin dose appeared to be tolerated well. However, significant body weight reduction and mortality occurred with the two higher dosage regimens. Cecal cultures of dead animals confirmed the presence of Clostridium difficile, an organism associated with antibiotic-induced enterotoxemia. Assay of serum collected from ampicillin-treated animals revealed ampicillin concentrations of approximately 10 micrograms/ml at 5 minutes post-dosing which fell precipitously to less than 0.2 micrograms/ml at 60 minutes. Determination of biliary ampicillin levels during the 60 minutes after administration of a single 10 mg/kg SQ dose revealed concentrations ranging from 18 micrograms/ml to 90 micrograms/ml. Estimates of total urinary ampicillin content after a single 10 mg/kg SQ dose were less than 500 micrograms/animal at 7.5 minutes, but increased to greater than 2000 micrograms/animal at 60 minutes after dosing. [*]Results of this study indicated that due to its short serum half-life, sodium ampicillin probably has little systemic therapeutic efficacy in guinea pigs. Because high concentrations of ampicillin accumulated in the urine and bile, the antibiotic probably would have therapeutic efficacy for urinary and intestinal infections. However, its associated toxicity at large doses probably precludes its use.[/*] In view of the rapid clearance of ampicillin in guinea pigs in comparison to other species, the pharmacokinetics of other antibiotics, especially those reported to be less toxic for guinea pigs, should be considered."

Basically small dosage is inefficient and bigger dosage will kill him. No thank you. 8) I'm still trying to get Zithromax on Monday as he is getting worst. The tilt is getting much larger than before. I know that Zithromax or octatetra- something can be his last resort and it can be fatal, but I need to try. Some pigs had adverse effect on them (especially Zithromax) but... It's just driving me nuts as I was telling 3 different vets that Baytril and Septrin is NOT WORKING. I know that they have a years of experience, but I know this small guy and I know if he is in pain or something is going on with him. Lucky, 3rd vet is considering Zithromax on Monday, she needs to find out dosage for it. My piggy is 1060 grams, anyone know how much is a Zithromax dosage for him?
 
Last edited:
I didn't know Zithromax was dangerous?

If it helps Daisy weighs around 920g & her dosage for the abscess was 0.9 ml once a day :)
 
Dose for zithromax is 1 ml per kilo, so therefore guinea pig weighing 900g would have 0.9 ml, guinea pig weighing 850g would get 0.85mls etc so for your piggie you are looking at just over a 1 ml once a day.

If your vet wants clarification from another vet, then he can call Simon Maddock - 01604 478888
 
furryfriends (Excellent Adventure Sanctuary) said:
Zithromax isn't dangerous, she was talking about the other drug
Click to expand...

Hehehe... Not "she" but "he" :red, fully grown male adult :(|)

Yes, I was talking about Zithromax. Anne Taylor (3rd vet) told me, that she used once before and piggy had bad reaction on it. There was few other people with bad experience, but I think it happened because of bad allergic reaction anyway. Some people have allergic reaction on penicillin, so that piggy had bad reaction on Zithromax. Unfortunately, I don't know that. What I know, is that if I'll not try, he will die in pain and agony.

I'm going Monday to clinic to pickup Zithromax, I hope it will work. Thank you ladies, for dosage, I'll tell her (she will probably already know, but...). The Cat & Rabbit Care Clinic... 1h 25m to get there... if this will be last chance... or at least I can talk to him.
 
OrioniS said:
Hehehe... Not "she" but "he" :red, fully grown male adult :(|)

Yes, I was talking about Zithromax. Anne Taylor (3rd vet) told me, that she used once before and piggy had bad reaction on it. There was few other people with bad experience, but I think it happened because of bad allergic reaction anyway. Some people have allergic reaction on penicillin, so that piggy had bad reaction on Zithromax. Unfortunately, I don't know that. What I know, is that if I'll not try, he will die in pain and agony.

I'm going Monday to clinic to pickup Zithromax, I hope it will work. Thank you ladies, for dosage, I'll tell her (she will probably already know, but...). The Cat & Rabbit Care Clinic... 1h 25m to get there... if this will be last chance... or at least I can talk to him.
Click to expand...

So sorry for presuming you were female :red Huge apologies!

I have used Zithromax a number of times with fantastic results. In fact it seems to be much better tolerated than so many other antibiotics. Obviously all medications are going to carry some risk though. I really hope it helps your piggie.
 
Apologies accepted ;-)

I have a strong feeling, that not many males on this forum are ;-)

I've got animals around me since I was few years old, so for me is very normal to act a bit emotional together. We don't have to hunt to live any more, so I prefer to be on the same side with them ;-) And English is not my first language as you can see, so I'm just trying to do my best. In most situations...

Either Zithromax will work, or not, or my piggy is already cured, just its tilt is permanent now :( We will see tomorrow...
 
OK, Now I've got another problem: He stopped eating after Zithromax, oral suspension 0.25cc. I'm gutted... 2 dosages and that. As well loosing hair more than before, is this stuff really too strong or what?
 
Last edited:
I'm kinda confused: I've got 200mg/5ml suspension and I need to give him 0.25ml, If I do what you saying: 1ml of Zithromax for 1kg Piggy, that will be 40mg of Zithromax. I've read that usual dosage for kids id 10mg per kilo, if I'm right: 200mg per 5ml in the bottle is 40mg per 1ml is 10mg per 0.25ml ? Which is correct for kids. What about guinea pigs? How much mg of Azithromycin is advisable for them?

Any Ideas?
 
Correction: I was told that I need to give him 0.25mg twice a day, but this is 20mg of Azithromycin per day! Instruction says that kids under 45kg should take single dosage of 10mg of Azithromycin per day. My piggy is not near 45kg ;-) I don't think I should give him the second dose. Does anyone agree with me or I'm just getting mad?!
 
Isn't the Zithromax already made up for you?

Mine was already made up by the vet, I had to give 0.9ml once a day as my piggy weighs 900g. A 1.0 ml syringe can be used, you fill to the correct level on the side.
 
I'm guessing you have a bottle of powder to which water has been added.

Simon normally splits the powder into three bottles as the zithromax doesn't keep for very long and that saves wastage.

Therefore with a bottle containing a third of the powder you add 3 mls of tap water, or if you are making up all of the powder you would add 9 mls of tap water. You then dose at the rate of 1 ml per kilo once per day.
 
yes, I got powder to mix. Yesterday, after careful checking, I've decided to go against 2x 0.25ml and I think I was right, my piggy is more live and EATING now and tilt is much smaller, so I'm watching and waiting...

furryfriends: What strength are you talking about? 200mg/5ml ? In this case this is 40mg per 1ml, 4x stronger then recommended for kids under 45kg...
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top