The thing with carrots?

[lauraboara]

Hi. I have read on here and in gp books that carrots (the orange root part rather than the tops) have to be fed in moderation because of high vit A levels. Could the wise ones explain the risk to piggies of the high vit A please?

My piggies love carrots and carrot tops but obviously I don't want to feed them incorrectly. What would 'moderation' be for carrots eg 1/2 a medium carrot every other day? Or is that still too much?:{

 

[Julesie]

I'd like to know this too.

I now worry that I overfeed on carrots if this is indeed true. My boys get a few small ones every day.

 

[Liane]

I also worry about this. I read somewhere that it can cause liver and kidney issues, and I was terrified because my boys really like carrots, but it gave no indication of what size portion they should have, and how often.

 

[mikulinek]

Hi,

Carrots rather than carrot tops should be fed in moderation. This is due to the high sugar levels and high vitamin A levels in the actual root vegetable. High levels of vitamin A can cause damage to liver and kidney functions. High sugar levels can leed to digestion issues as well as diabetes in piggies. The vitamin A levels are around 30 times the vitamin C levels and there are much better ways of getting the vitamin C into your piggies.

I've spoken to a piggy nutrition expert, and to my cavy-savvy vet, and the general view is that actual carrots should be fed no more than once a week and then we're talking a couple of slices - NOT a whole carrot.

Carrot tops, however, are still rich in vitamin C, contain fibre and are low in vitamin A so can be fed to your piggies more often (every two or three days).

I hope this is helpful

 

[lauraboara]

Thank you - that is really useful info - especially describing what the amounts per week should be.

 

[mikulinek]

The main problem I find is the constant balancing act. The thing with piggies is, because they're fairly smart, they get bored quite quickly and even their favourite foods will get left if you feed it to them too often.

We try to rotate things we know we can trust and still maintain a balance. It helps to draw up a chart of about two or three weeks that you can follow to make sure that your piggies are still interested in their fresh veg and you've got a good balance of vitamin C, fibre and the right levels of protein.

There are a few lettuces you can use to base things on (romain leaf, little gem but not iceberg or cos - too high in phosphates and water). Add to this some other leaves: cauliflower leaves (once a week or a little less often even);flat-leaf parsley (the same); curly kale (this has quite a bit of calcium so beware, feed maybe twice a month), basically try to keep the water, vitamin A, phosphate and calcium low but vitamin C and fibre high. Grass is a really good and safe way to feed fresh leaves and it's free

Now even romian lettuce is high in vitamin A, but it has almost equal levels of vitamin C so you can use it once a week but then you have to make sure that the rest of the fresh veg is extremely low in vitamin A for the rest of the week and so on...

Then for veggies themselves, try to replace carrot with the occasional piece of cucumber, pepper, banana skin (with a tiny bit of banana as a rare treat), watermelon rind (again, with a small amount of flesh as a treat), the occasional strawberry (once a month or less) or other similar fruit.

The important thing is to make sure that fresh veg/fruit etc. accounts for only 10% or so of your piggies' diet. then you can give them either 90% hay or 80% hay and 10% dried food. Dried food really is only if you aren't sure your piggies are getting everything they need from fresh food and hay.

Anyway, sorry for rambling on about stuff you probably already know - hope some of this is helpful

 

[mikulinek]

Oh I forgot to mention. Avoid feeding broccoli and/or cauliflower too much as cruciferous vegetables can be dangerous and cause digestion issues

 

[lauraboara]

Thanks that is a really useful guide. Sometimes you see pictures in books/internet of piggies surrounding a huge amount of veggies and whole carrots etc and I think it can give a misleading idea of how much veg should feature in their diet. My piggies love grass and herbs so I will try to keep variety with those and small amounts of the veg you suggest.

 

[CiaraPatricia]

Thanks that is a really useful guide. Sometimes you see pictures in books/internet of piggies surrounding a huge amount of veggies and whole carrots etc and I think it can give a misleading idea of how much veg should feature in their diet. My piggies love grass and herbs so I will try to keep variety with those and small amounts of the veg you suggest.

That's true, it makes you think they should have loads of veggies like carrots. Green leafy veg is best, I completely agree with mikulinek

 

[mikulinek]

It's true that there is a massive misconception about how to feed our piggies properly. The photos and films out there almost always depict a huge pile of fresh goodies.

The carrot thing has been a major misconception for piggies and bunnies for sooo long. With rabbits it's even harder to convince people that they shouldn't eat carrots...

Anyway, I hope this stuff is helpful. Now that it's summer (allegedly) our boys will be getting a fair bit of grass which is really a great basis and something you can feed to your piggies fairly frequently. I'd say three or four times a week (a smallish handful, sort of what a small child could carry I suppose).

They can get dandelion as a treat maybe once a week to once every ten days (one or two leaves each time). With dandelion, try to pick the freshest, greenest leaves and be aware that their pee may be orange-brown afterwards (which is fine and normal). The same is true for clover (although it doesn't change their pee colour).

I better stop before I ramble on again.

 

[first_time_piggie_mum]

It's true that there is a massive misconception about how to feed our piggies properly. The photos and films out there almost always depict a huge pile of fresh goodies.

"Anyway, I hope this stuff is helpful. Now that it's summer (allegedly) our boys will be getting a fair bit of grass which is really a great basis and something you can feed to your piggies fairly frequently. I'd say three or four times a week (a smallish handful, sort of what a small child could carry I suppose)."

I read on a Peter Gurney site somewhere that grass could be fed un-limited as it was their natural foodsource in the wild....so why only a handful three or four times a week?....just curious to know why the conflicting advice on grass

 

[mikulinek]

I read on a Peter Gurney site somewhere that grass could be fed un-limited as it was their natural foodsource in the wild....so why only a handful three or four times a week?....just curious to know why the conflicting advice on grass

Good question. It's to do with their hay intake. If they're used to eating hay as their staple food (80% of their diet or more) then grass can be given in reasonable amounts fairly frequently but not unlimited becuase they won't be gatting the range of nutrients. Essentially what you'll be giving them is a fresher version of what they're already getting in hay, plus added vitamin C and water (a few other vitamins and minerals but in smaller amounts). If they're on a hay diet, then they will also need other fresh veg to supplement their vitamins.

Now, if your piggies are lucky enough to have access to grass non-stop all year round, then this can replace hay or, at least, to some extent. It's all about that really tricky balance.

As for the wild, that's a little misleading. The guinea pigs which we now live with at home (domesticated Cavia Porcellus) doesn't actually exist in the wild. It has close relatives from which it is descended and they will eat a variety of grasses, flowers and plants but our piggies need to have a more carefully constructed diet in the same way that domestic cats and dogs need a more balanced diet than say servals and wolves.

I hope that hasn't confused anyone more :{

Essentially, if your piggies are hay eaters (which most are) then you should view grass as a veggy supplement rather than hay replacement

 

[first_time_piggie_mum]

Thats actually made me feel a bit better, because I dont have grass in my garden so was picking it regularly for Rodders but was always guilty that I wasnt giving him enough mallethead It was his favorite food and the rumble/purr of contentment he made whenever I gave it to him was lovely

He got loads of hay, so in effect I waa supplementing it with the grass.

Thank you for the clarification

 

[Ananda]

My 2 pigs from the shelter at first only liked carrots and apples but I suppose that was the result of 6 months at the shelter...

Could a diet of a carrot a day say, be the cause for teeth problems? I am thinking of my 2 boars who died of this...

:...

 

[mikulinek]

My 2 pigs from the shelter at first only liked carrots and apples but I suppose that was the result of 6 months at the shelter...

Could a diet of a carrot a day say, be the cause for teeth problems? I am thinking of my 2 boars who died of this...

:...

Hi Amanda,

I'm very sorry to read about your boars

Carrots don't directly cause teeth problems per se. What can cause teeth problems is overfeeding on soft fresh vegetables, like carrots, which in turn means that your piggies don't eat enough hay.

The very best thing for keeping healthy, well trimmed/ground down teeth, is lots of hay. If a piggy is allowed to eat too much fresh food, he/she won't be hungry enough to eat enough hay. This means their teeth may get too long. This in turn makes in uncomfortable for them to eat properly so a vicious circle begins. A piggy with overly long teeth won't want to eat hay because it hurts. They'll fill up on water and soft food.... you can see the pattern.

A carrot a day could well cause liver problems though from the vitamin A and would be huge amounts of sugar - far more than a piggy should process. Similarly, apples have extremely high sugar levels. Too much sugar is very dangerous and can lead to serious health problems, including diabetes.

I hope that's helpful

 

[ChiefCookandBottleWasher]

All this would be really helpful and not at all confusing if it were not so completely different from what my vet (who is supposed to be a rodent/small pet expert) told me!

I asked her about fresh food because I had read so much contradictory stuff. She said that they should have unlimited access to grass and hay all year round (so far, so good) and that they should also have as much as they wanted of as big a variety of fresh veg as possible. She claimed that the only things to avoid were iceburg lettuce, rhubarb, potatoes and sweet potatoes and that the only thing that should be rationed was the dry pellets. I particularly queried carrots (as I heard somewhere that all root veg. were bad) but she said that was nonsense and that I should be particularly sure to feed carrots whole or in large chunks as this would be more interesting for them and be better for their teeth!

Therefore, I have been freely feeding them whatever things they fancy - which most certainly includes carrots - though not every day because they would just get bored.

If I have to ration all the things they like so sparingly, I will need to find more things that they are prepared to eat! Does anyone know which vegetables they can eat the leaves of (I mean ones where we do not normally eat the leaves)? I know that potato, tomato and rhubarb leaves are poisenous and that carrot and broccoli leaves are OK and I think I have heard that peas are too(?) but what about the rest? I am especially interested to know about beans, strawberries, blueberries, pumpkins and parsnips.

Hope you can help.

 

[mikulinek]

All this would be really helpful and not at all confusing if it were not so completely different from what my vet (who is supposed to be a rodent/small pet expert) told me!

I asked her about fresh food because I had read so much contradictory stuff. She said that they should have unlimited access to grass and hay all year round (so far, so good) and that they should also have as much as they wanted of as big a variety of fresh veg as possible. She claimed that the only things to avoid were iceburg lettuce, rhubarb, potatoes and sweet potatoes and that the only thing that should be rationed was the dry pellets. I particularly queried carrots (as I heard somewhere that all root veg. were bad) but she said that was nonsense and that I should be particularly sure to feed carrots whole or in large chunks as this would be more interesting for them and be better for their teeth!

Therefore, I have been freely feeding them whatever things they fancy - which most certainly includes carrots - though not every day because they would just get bored.

If I have to ration all the things they like so sparingly, I will need to find more things that they are prepared to eat! Does anyone know which vegetables they can eat the leaves of (I mean ones where we do not normally eat the leaves)? I know that potato, tomato and rhubarb leaves are poisenous and that carrot and broccoli leaves are OK and I think I have heard that peas are too(?) but what about the rest? I am especially interested to know about beans, strawberries, blueberries, pumpkins and parsnips.

Hope you can help.

I know how you feel. A lot of vets just don't know. That's not to say they're not good vets but they have to know so much about so many different species that sometimes they give our poor advice about one particular specie.

Believe me, your piggies should not be eating more than 10% fresh veg and certainly no more than 10% pellets. The rest should me made up of hay. Unless your piggies have acces to massive quantaties of grass that can completely or partially replace hay, then grass should be seen as a fresh veg.

As for leaves, carrot tops, parsley, corn ears, cauliflower leaves, spring greens are safe but should be varied. Kale should be fed sparingly as it has high levels of calcium.

The trick is to vary their intake; keep the vitamin C levels up; keep the vitamin A and calcium levels down; keep the sugar levels down (avoid a lot of fruit too often); feed a bit of everything and finally avoid poisonous/highly phosphorous foods.

I'm sorry it's so confusing and that's what this forum is here for really. None of us are/were experts but we learn "best practice" from each other. Most of this I know from forum members and from a couple of specialist vets and a guinea pig/bunny nutritionist/rodentologist.

 

[sophieandhoney]

Oh crikey I am feeding my guinea pigs all wrong then!

They are such difficult pets to feed!


I buy the bagged up lettuce and pre cut brocolli and carrots, sometimes they have baby sweet corn, celery and cucumber they always get pepper although Henry doesn't like it, I also give them a baby tomato each too.

They live on hay and get extra handfuls twice a day.

but I guess I need to cut down on the veg.

 

[guineagurl]

Oh! I did not know that they only need a little bit of carrot.... :o:{:o:{

 

[mikulinek]

To Sophie and Guineagurl:

Please don't get disheartened. Feeding piggies isn't that complex but it feels like that when you've been misinformed. The variety of fresh veg is good but it does need to be kept to 10% of their diet.

Actually, with carrots you can never ever feed your piggies actual carrots and they'll be fine. They don't need carrot and can get vitamin C from lots of other places. Some carrot is fine and healthy but (and I can't stress this enough) it should not be their main vegetable and they shouldn't get it it too often or in too high quantities. Carrots do have a lot of vitamin C but they also contain vitamin A and a looooooottt of sugar. Piggies don't really need sugar and shouldn't have too much of it. Carrot tops are much much better. Our two normally get carrot tops and that little couple of centimetres of carrot that gets chopped off with it.

They can process sugar in small amounts and, a bit of everything is the healthiest approach.

To be honest. I really try not to give them too much of anything and give them a lot of variety.

I know that sounds hard but, as long as you can stick to what's safe and healthy, you and your piggies can share the veg which is much more economical.

I hope this thread has helped and I hope it isn't overwhelming.

 

[Poppy'sMum]

All this would be really helpful and not at all confusing if it were not so completely different from what my vet (who is supposed to be a rodent/small pet expert) told me!

I asked her about fresh food because I had read so much contradictory stuff. She said that they should have unlimited access to grass and hay all year round (so far, so good) and that they should also have as much as they wanted of as big a variety of fresh veg as possible. She claimed that the only things to avoid were iceburg lettuce, rhubarb, potatoes and sweet potatoes and that the only thing that should be rationed was the dry pellets. I particularly queried carrots (as I heard somewhere that all root veg. were bad) but she said that was nonsense and that I should be particularly sure to feed carrots whole or in large chunks as this would be more interesting for them and be better for their teeth!

Therefore, I have been freely feeding them whatever things they fancy - which most certainly includes carrots - though not every day because they would just get bored.

If I have to ration all the things they like so sparingly, I will need to find more things that they are prepared to eat! Does anyone know which vegetables they can eat the leaves of (I mean ones where we do not normally eat the leaves)? I know that potato, tomato and rhubarb leaves are poisenous and that carrot and broccoli leaves are OK and I think I have heard that peas are too(?) but what about the rest? I am especially interested to know about beans, strawberries, blueberries, pumpkins and parsnips.

Hope you can help.

Peas in the pod are fine, as are green beans (french/runner) but never the other parts of the plant. I don't know about blackberries etc, would love to know the answer as we have loads of blackberries every year & could feed them leaves too (if we had any still )

 

[mikulinek]

Hi Poppy's Mum:


Blackberries and blueberries can be fed occasionally. They're safe but they are high in sugar.

 

[Coconut]

Ahhh so runner beans are alright to feed? How much per week is alright to feed them? And is it better to just give them how they are or should they be cooked, or... ?

 

[mikulinek]

Ahhh so runner beans are alright to feed? How much per week is alright to feed them? And is it better to just give them how they are or should they be cooked, or... ?

Don't cook them. They can eat cooked beans but cooked beans will lose some vitamins. Runner beans are OKish but in general, you should avoid pulses like beans etc. Peas in pods are better. The thing with pulses is they can cause a lot of wind which is pretty unpleasant and sometimes dangerous for piggies. I wouldn't feed them much (one or two beans each) or more than once every week or even every two weeks. Peas can be fed a little more frequently.

 

[*SRH*]

All guinea pigs love carrots but sadly, if they eat two large portions of carrots a day, it would be like us eating a very fatty meal twice a day.

Carrots, should really be given no more than three times a week, and between three guinea pigs, it should be a medium to small sized carrot.

In the summer, they should probably have less as they will probably get extra grass and dandelions.

Once in a while, having a larger portion of carrots will not do any significant harm, carrots are in fact a healthy treat and would be tastier and better for their health than a commercially produced treat.

Hope this helped.

 

[gogoguineas]

Great information, thanks everyone!

Can I just throw fresh beetroot into the equation? and other root vegetables like butternut squash and swede? I have given mine a few slices of fresh beetroot last night as I was told if fed occaisonally the acid in it can neutralise calcium and help keep bladder stones at bay. I haven't tried the other two i mentioned but was curious.....:{

 

[*SRH*]

All three of them are fine in moderation.

Neither are the best foods for guinea pigs although beetroot can be helpful.
If you want to give butternut squash or swede it should be done no more than once a week.

Guinea pigs should never beetroot leaves, they can be toxic for guinea pigs!

 

[gogoguineas]

All three of them are fine in moderation.

Neither are the best foods for guinea pigs although beetroot can be helpful.
If you want to give butternut squash or swede it should be done no more than once a week.

Guinea pigs should never beetroot leaves, they can be toxic for guinea pigs!

dont worry, i cut off the top and the bottom (cos it was ugly lmao!) then just sliced it up. They liked it!

 

[Doeylicious]

This thread is truly excellent and has possibly answered a lot of my 'why are my pigs getting too much protein?' issue

I am going to draw up a veggie chart and have fun filling my new veg drawers in my fridge. And sack the carrots!

 

[TwoPiggies]

eeeek my piggies love carrot. My rabbits never get carrot but I didn't know about the pigs! O they will not be pleased tomorrow!