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Upset & Need Help

StrawberryLemonade

StrawberryLemonade

Junior Guinea Pig
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I adopted a pair of baby girl guinea pigs a week and a half ago.

One of the girls was lightly sneezing and breathing with a heaviness, though her nose and eyes were clear. Looking online, I saw people saying infections can flare up from a change in environment. I took the pig to the vet on Monday. The vet told me her lungs were clear but he tends to put pocket pets on antibiotics regardless. It was Azithromycin.
And now here on Wednesday she's on death's door. I've put some hot water bottles in the cage with her, have and am further intending to syringe feed her some, and have given her some feces from her sister as a probiotic, but I'm panicking. She has crust around her nose and she's lost weight.
Looking online before, no one was mentioning giving antibiotics as a last resort sort of thing, but looking up antibiotics specifically now everyone's suddenly telling me they're not to be used? And I don't know what to do. Why did I trust the vet? Why did I overreact to sneezing? It may have just been an allergy.
Is there something I can do? I think I killed my pig...
 
It does sound like an upper respiratory infection, maybe turned to pneumonia, I would quickly get her on a different antibiotic. Which one I do not know maybe @furryfriends (TEAS) can help.

Obv I have no right bto be able to diagnose and can't cause I'm not a vet, but is there heavy abdominal breathing?

Why anyone would say don't use an antibiotic is puzzling me
 
SkyPipDotBernie said:
It does sound like an upper respiratory infection, maybe turned to pneumonia, I would quickly get her on a different antibiotic. Which one I do not know maybe @furryfriends (TEAS) can help.

Obv I have no right bto be able to diagnose and can't cause I'm not a vet, but is there heavy abdominal breathing?
Click to expand...

Yeah, she's been deep breathing.
 
I'm so sorry :( Azithromycin, often called Zithromax is a safe antibiotic to use with guinea pigs. You have not killed your piggy, you sought prompt veterinary treatment like any good owner would. Unfortunately piggies hide their symptoms until things are really bad and respiratory infections can make them go down hill very quickly. Are you able to get her back to a vet? That would really be the ideal action for her.
Try to clean the gunk from her nostrils, they can't breathe through their mouth like we can so it's important to keep the nostrils as clear as possible, if you do this, let the vet know you have done so, so they dont think their is only a small amount of mucous. Hopefully they will be able to rally her round with a different antibiotic maybe, fluids etc. She may need assistance eating, so they will hopefully also give you some syringes and critical care. I'll keep my fingers crossed for her and you.
 
Recommended Guinea Pig Vets

Here is. A link of recommended vets, I'm not sure where in UK you are, or even if you are. If they are closed, you should get through to an answer message, that will tell you out of hours vets available. Hopefully you cna find a vet experienced with guine apig. This is a huge problem with owning guinea pigs and other small pets, sometimes it's a struggle to find a vet that will diagnose correctly first time
 
Eriathwen said:
I'm so sorry :( Azithromycin, often called Zithromax is a safe antibiotic to use with guinea pigs. You have not killed your piggy, you sought prompt veterinary treatment like any good owner would. Unfortunately piggies hide their symptoms until things are really bad and respiratory infections can make them go down hill very quickly. Are you able to get her back to a vet? That would really be the ideal action for her.
Try to clean the gunk from her nostrils, they can't breathe through their mouth like we can so it's important to keep the nostrils as clear as possible, if you do this, let the vet know you have done so, so they dont think their is only a small amount of mucous. Hopefully they will be able to rally her round with a different antibiotic maybe, fluids etc. She may need assistance eating, so they will hopefully also give you some syringes and critical care. I'll keep my fingers crossed for her and you.
Click to expand...
Oh it is zyrhromax? I did not know the other name for it
 
You did amazing by not ignoring her symptoms and getting her to the vets promptly. Make another appointment asap and in the meantime carry on giving her the antibiotics you have and carry on with the syringe feeding. A couple of weeks back two of my girls had an URI the one had nothing more than a runny nose and occasional sneezing didn't lose any weight or stop eating but it still took 3 lots of antibiotics before it cleared up. My other girl was fine in the morning and by the evening was listless and not eating and I thought I was losing her but she made a quicker recovery than her sister did. It can take a few days for the antibiotics to kick in and start working but she needs to see the vet so they can check if she needs a different antibiotic or a different doseage. Keeping my fingers crossed for a quick recovery.
 
SkyPipDotBernie said:
Why anyone would say don't use an antibiotic is puzzling me
Click to expand...

What I've seen online is how antibiotics can destroy the necessary bacteria inside a guinea pig's gut. That's why I'm panicking in part with the worry I've made things worse. My poor sweetie pig.
 
StrawberryLemonade said:
What I've seen online is how antibiotics can destroy the necessary bacteria inside a guinea pig's gut. That's why I'm panicking in part with the worry I've made things worse. My poor sweetie pig.
Click to expand...
Yea but that's why you give probiotics, I think 2 hours after the antibiotic. Not 100% sure. Baytril seems to be the most problematic on a guinea pigs gut, though I've never had problems from any antibiotic in guinea pigs.

Hope you're pig makes it through this all. Keep her nice and warm, no drafts or cold room will help
 
StrawberryLemonade said:
I adopted a pair of baby girl guinea pigs a week and a half ago.

One of the girls was lightly sneezing and breathing with a heaviness, though her nose and eyes were clear. Looking online, I saw people saying infections can flare up from a change in environment. I took the pig to the vet on Monday. The vet told me her lungs were clear but he tends to put pocket pets on antibiotics regardless. It was Azithromycin.
And now here on Wednesday she's on death's door. I've put some hot water bottles in the cage with her, have and am further intending to syringe feed her some, and have given her some feces from her sister as a probiotic, but I'm panicking. She has crust around her nose and she's lost weight.
Looking online before, no one was mentioning giving antibiotics as a last resort sort of thing, but looking up antibiotics specifically now everyone's suddenly telling me they're not to be used? And I don't know what to do. Why did I trust the vet? Why did I overreact to sneezing? It may have just been an allergy.
Is there something I can do? I think I killed my pig...
Click to expand...

Hi and welcome!

Please contact the emergency vets or contact your vet clinic asap if it is still open (depending on your country).

Azithromycin (zithromax) is a very strong antibiotic that can be used with pneumonia etc. so you have been prescribed the right kind of care as your piggy clearly has got a major respiratory issue and not just your run-of-the mill bacterial URI (respiratory infection).
Heavy/diaphragmic breathing is generally associated with the build-up of fluid in either lungs (pneumonia) or chest cavity (heart insuffiency) and is a serious symptom. I am sure that your vet has also checked the heart and not just the lungs before prescribing a strong antibiotic.

There are unfortunately some really nasty bugs around against which antibiotics do not necessarily work (pneumococcus, streptococcus, bordetellosis (kennel cough)). Please note that online research is not the best idea, information is often very conflicting as you often lack the background of grading the subjective experiences that are reported under similar symptoms - and you usually find all the horror stories that are most unhelpful. :(
NOT treating a potential respiratory infection with an antibiotic would have also been fatal or could have caused permanent damage - and that IS actually causing countless hapless pet shop piggies' lives! Any vet if in the least of doubt will treat with an antibiotic. If your vet is prescribing a very strong unlicensed antibiotic instead of a weak standard one, they will have a good reason for it; they won't do this lightly.

Please also be aware that the need to breathe comes before the need to drink and only thirdly the need to eat. Antibiotics can also impact on the gut microbiome and kill the appetite; this can happen with any antibiotic. While most piggies do tolerate azythromycin/zithromax well, if there is a bad reaction to it, it usually wipes the appetite completely in my own experience. I have had to nurse a couple of piggies through their own loss of appetite with syringe feeding, but they have both made it through and didn't lose their eyes (neither was fit for an eye removal op).

Have you switched from the usual weighing once weekly to weighing daily, as we strongly recommend with any piggy on medical treatment and stepped in with syringe feeding support as soon as you noticed a weight loss over 50g?
If not, please start syringe feeding top up asap. These guide here contain tips on what you can do with what you have easily available at home in an emergency and what you can/should do with a very ill piggy.
Emergency, Crisis and Bridging Care until a Vet Appointment
Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

PS: The best method of transferring live healthy microbiome is by 'poo soup' from a healthy companion; you can find the recipe in both guide links. More important is however instant feeding and watering support!
 
Definitely contact the vet again. You did nothing wrong putting your piggie on antibiotics- although guinea pigs don't tolerate some antibiotics, there ARE safe antibiotic options for pigs and the antibiotic you have been given is safely given in other pigs. It possible, however, that the antibiotic given was not a good match for the bacteria in question and a different one may be needed. Most vets don't take a culture routinely to pinpoint the most on-target antibiotic, which means there is some trial and error involved. She should be improving rather than worsening if the meds were a good match, that is why it's important to give the vet this feedback. Don't feel you did anything wrong by taking her to the vet or putting her on antibiotics- you did the right thing.
 
Wiebke said:
Hi and welcome!

Please contact the emergency vets or contact your vet clinic asap if it is still open (depending on your country).

Azithromycin (zithromax) is a very strong antibiotic that can be used with pneumonia etc. so you have been prescribed the right kind of care as your piggy clearly has got a major respiratory issue and not just your run-of-the mill bacterial URI (respiratory infection).
Heavy/diaphragmic breathing is generally associated with the build-up of fluid in either lungs (pneumonia) or chest cavity (heart insuffiency) and is a serious symptom. I am sure that your vet has also checked the heart and not just the lungs before prescribing a strong antibiotic.

There are unfortunately some really nasty bugs around against which antibiotics do not necessarily work (pneumococcus, streptococcus, bordetellosis (kennel cough)). Please note that online research is not the best idea, information is often very conflicting as you often lack the background of grading the subjective experiences that are reported under similar symptoms - and you usually find all the horror stories that are most unhelpful. :(
NOT treating a potential respiratory infection with an antibiotic would have also been fatal or could have caused permanent damage - and that IS actually causing countless hapless pet shop piggies' lives! Any vet if in the least of doubt will treat with an antibiotic. If your vet is prescribing a very strong unlicensed antibiotic instead of a weak standard one, they will have a good reason for it; they won't do this lightly.

Please also be aware that the need to breathe comes before the need to drink and only thirdly the need to eat. Antibiotics can also impact on the gut microbiome and kill the appetite; this can happen with any antibiotic. While most piggies do tolerate azythromycin/zithromax well, if there is a bad reaction to it, it usually wipes the appetite completely in my own experience. I have had to nurse a couple of piggies through their own loss of appetite with syringe feeding, but they have both made it through and didn't lose their eyes (neither was fit for an eye removal op).

Have you switched from the usual weighing once weekly to weighing daily, as we strongly recommend with any piggy on medical treatment and stepped in with syringe feeding support as soon as you noticed a weight loss over 50g?
If not, please start syringe feeding top up asap. These guide here contain tips on what you can do with what you have easily available at home in an emergency and what you can/should do with a very ill piggy.
Emergency, Crisis and Bridging Care until a Vet Appointment
Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

PS: The best method of transferring live healthy microbiome is by 'poo soup' from a healthy companion; you can find the recipe in both guide links. More important is however instant feeding and watering support!
Click to expand...
Thank you for giving such a thorough response. Thank you everyone else for your supportive comments.

My piggie has lost weight. I'm going to try nursing her mashed pellets with a syringe as I can---I've been giving her small amounts at about half hour intervals. Her weight had started at around 3/4 of a pound.
 
StrawberryLemonade said:
What I've seen online is how antibiotics can destroy the necessary bacteria inside a guinea pig's gut. That's why I'm panicking in part with the worry I've made things worse. My poor sweetie pig.
Click to expand...
There is a grain of truth here- SOME antibiotics are not safe for guinea pigs. They destroy gut flora needed for digestion and lead to bloat. Guinea pigs should not be given these antibiotics. However, other antibiotics are safe for guinea pigs and can safely be given. Zithromax is an antibiotic that is given to guinea pigs- it's not on the 'not safe' list. She may have a harsh chest infection, but her illness is not because you gave her an unsafe med. The med she has been given would not cause this.
 
So very sorry that you lost Strawberry.
You did everything you possibly could for her.
Guinea pigs hide illness very well and sadly it’s often too late for us to save them.
Be gentle with yourself as you grieve.
If you want to you can post a tribute to her on the Rainbow Bridge thread - when you feel ready
 
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