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Dental Advice on change if eating behaviour

Ali_x

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Hi guys

Bit of advice/opinions please...

Arnold is my 1 year old boar, so recently, at the beginning of the week, I noticed his hard food wasn’t going down as much as usual, but he was still eating the same fresh food and hay, I put this down to the heat and decreased appetite. However by yesterday, he still hadn’t touched his pellets that I put in the bowl and I noticed he was eating less hay, although was eating some hay and grass out in the run.

I took him to see my exotic vet, she felt that it could be stress from heat (he is an easily stressed pig) also she noted his molars need Filing down, she said it wasn’t urgent at this point but will need doing, so I’ve booked him in for that. He is still eating his fresh food and tiny bits of hay, I’ve started to give him criti care today in between; for fibre and vitamins, he is pooing. He’s otherwise OK in himself, he actually looks and calls out for food at his meal times, although he isn’t eating all of what he normally loves eating and he is interested in what his brother is doing next door. (They’re divided in the middle of a C&C cage, as they fight!

I’m worried it’s a URI but she listened to his chest and wasn’t concerned about that, he’s got no discharge or sneezing, his bother who’s been in close contact is fine ... so I’m a bit perplexed

I’m taking him back to the vet Monday, if his eating doesn’t improve, he may have to have the dental earlier in case it’s that.

Does anyone have any ideas?

thanks!
 

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Piggies&buns

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Eating hay is the most important thing. Not only is it essential for gut function but also keeps the teeth worn down (grass also does this). The less hay they eat, the more the teeth overgrow. Veg and pellets are merely snacks so eating them but not eating hay means their food intake drops dramatically.
Weigh him daily and step in with syringe feeding him. If his weight is dropping, then he isn’t eating enough hay and more syringe feeding will need to be done.

If he had a uri then his breathing would be problematic, crackly, hooting.

It’s good you’ve got him booked in for his teeth to be looked at. If they are overgrowing, then it will cause hay intake to reduce and in turn causes further overgrowth

Not Eating, Weight Loss And The Importance Of Syringe Feeding Fibre
 

Ali_x

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Eating hay is the most important thing. Not only is it essential for gut function but also keeps the teeth worn down (grass also does this). The less hay they eat, the more the teeth overgrow. Veg and pellets are merely snacks so eating them but not eating hay means their food intake drops dramatically.
Weigh him daily and step in with syringe feeding him. If his weight is dropping, then he isn’t eating enough hay and more syringe feeding will need to be done.

If he had a uri then his breathing would be problematic, crackly, hooting.

It’s good you’ve got him booked in for his teeth to be looked at. If they are overgrowing, then it will cause hay intake to reduce and in turn causes further overgrowth

Not Eating, Weight Loss And The Importance Of Syringe Feeding Fibre
Thank you, that’s re assuring from a URI point of view, I didn’t think it was that and hoped it wasn’t that as I didn’t want to leave him until Monday if that’s the case

I have started syringe feeding him critical care,I’ll try and up it, it’s difficult, as he is a stressy guinea pig and he fights a lot! At the moment I’m managing about 10 x 1 syringes at a sitting 2 - 3 time’s a day, he is eating grass outside, just not touching his hay inside, I’m suspecting it could be more to do with his teeth, as I noticed he has intentions to eat the hay and then decided not to, which made me think it could be that his mouth is sore, so he’s booked in for Monday, may have to bring his dental earlier, in the mean time I’ll try and get as much syringe feeding done as I can so he doesn’t lose weight!
 

Ali_x

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I bought a handful of grass in from outside and he’s tucking in to that like there’s no tomorrow... maybe it’s easier on his teeth than hay as it’s softer
 

Ali_x

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Sorry guys me again!

So following on from my last post... he’s still not eating as much hay as he should be, he is however eating grass when I put it in for him

In between this I’m syringe feeding him Some critical care... what I’m confused about though is his poo pattern, so his poos have been decreasing, I put that down to less oral intake but twice now I’ve found that when I put him out in the run (he’s normally an inside piggy) that he just seems to poo loads in one go, so he hadn’t done any poos over night last night at all, I made an appt for him to see the vet today when I got home from work, I got home about an hour ago and checked on him and he had a massive pile of poos in his run?

Any ideas why he’s not pooing inside and pooIng loads outside? His diet is also still low inside, I’ve put his food bowl in the run out of interest to see if he eats pellets outside, there could be other causes for the lower diet intake, like his teeth, I just can’t understand the poo situation!

any ideas?

Below is a pic of the munchkin, looking mischievous as aleays
 

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Wiebke

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Sorry guys me again!

So following on from my last post... he’s still not eating as much hay as he should be, he is however eating grass when I put it in for him

In between this I’m syringe feeding him Some critical care... what I’m confused about though is his poo pattern, so his poos have been decreasing, I put that down to less oral intake but twice now I’ve found that when I put him out in the run (he’s normally an inside piggy) that he just seems to poo loads in one go, so he hadn’t done any poos over night last night at all, I made an appt for him to see the vet today when I got home from work, I got home about an hour ago and checked on him and he had a massive pile of poos in his run?

Any ideas why he’s not pooing inside and pooIng loads outside? His diet is also still low inside, I’ve put his food bowl in the run out of interest to see if he eats pellets outside, there could be other causes for the lower diet intake, like his teeth, I just can’t understand the poo situation!

any ideas?

Below is a pic of the munchkin, looking mischievous as aleays
Hi!

Your boy is very handsome.

Please continue with syringe feeding support and daily weighing. The poo output and size reflects what has gone in 1-2 days ago; most people overlook that there are waste poos from 2 runs through the gut and overlook that the digestive process takes its time. If there are less and smaller poos, then there has been obviously less food passing through his system.
Weight - Monitoring and Management
Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

That is why weighing daily at the same time is so vital; it gives you an instant update of whether you are feeding enough or need up the amount/frequency of feeding.

If your is tending towards softer foods, then he may have a developing dental problem; but that is for your vet to decide.

PS: I have merged your two threads on the same ongoing issue. We ask you kindly to please keep all information on any ongoing case together for your own benefit. We are all doing this for free in our own free time; none of us can always read every thread and keep all the details in their head for days or weeks on end. The more you splash your information around, the more haphazard the nature of our support will get because we cannot look up on what has gone on and said before and you will end up with either a repetition of our standard advice or with increasingly confusing /contradictory recommendations.
Having to search for the missing information and merge it will bite into the time we can spend on supporting other members on here. Unlike social media we are not a quick hip shot advice place where you start lots of different posts - but we need your cooperation on allowing us to support you coherently for as long as it takes. Thank you.
You can set your own alert notification at the start of your ongoing support thred.
 

Ali_x

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Update: so he went to the vet yesterday and she doesn’t think it’s a gut problem; she said his back molars will need filing down but she doesn’t think they’re causing this immediate problem; she thinks it’s jaw pain. He’s booked in for x-rays Thursday, in the mean time he’s on Metacam

So I gave him a dose of Metacam last night and boom! He’s like a changed quinoa pig this morning, he’s eaten hay overnight and this morning, he’s drank, he has poo’d loads and he’s eaten his favourite breakfast, which is celery, which he hadn’t touched in the last few days... can’t believe it! Will see what the x-rays show, as he’s under GA for that, I’ve asked them to file his back molars at the same time

He’s gone from 1.07kg to 1.03kg, I syringe fed loads yesterday but as he’s eating well today I probably won’t give him any critical care
 

Ali_x

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Update: so after having had x-rays and teeth filed, they found elongated roots underneath and one side of his jaw is slightly misaligned! So the plan was for daily pain relief, so he’s on Metacam and some abx, we they also found an ear infection

So he came home on Thursday afternoon, by Friday morning, he wasn’t eating much at all, still not eating hay but eating soft things like grass, he had been having his Metacam for a few days, and I gave him his abx. By Friday afternoon he hadn’t poo’d for 24 hours, so I spoke to the vet and because it was the weekend; Plus I was working all of it and wouldn’t be able to syringe feed much, we decided to admit him and he has been in the vets all weekend.

I spoke to the senior exotic vet today and he said Arnold is pooing and peeing but not eating much, he thinks it’s definitely all pain related and wants him in another night to carry on strong pain relief and syringe feeding. I hope that when he’s home he will start eating.

The vet said that this is normal after dental work and when there’s any jaw problems, that there is pain and they have to re work their jaw, problem is I can’t get him to eat the hay!

So I’m picking him up tomorrow, the vet said by tomorrow; I need to try him at home to see if he eats more where he’s comfortable being and he will have had 3 days of strong pain killers by then!

Has anyone else had this experience with dental/jaw related problems and a slow recovery?

Thanks
 

Bill & Ted

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If a dental is not carried out correctly, and any tiny spikes are left then the piggie will not eat. We see this many, many times on the forum. How experienced are your vets at doing guinea pig dental and what success have they had?
The most experienced Guinea Pig dental vets in the Country are Simon and Kim Maddock at the Cat and Rabbit Clinic in Northampton. We travel from Cornwall and we are not alone, owners travel from all over the country. We have experienced GA dentals done by exotic and general local vets and they have made a complete mess of my Ted’s teeth. Simon and Kim use a conscious dental method, it takes around 10 minutes filing and the piggie is eating straight away. Because no anaesthetic is used it’s very reasonably price too at £60 plus a one off registration fee. They perform around 30 plus dentals a week on guinea pigs and are fabulous and very knowledgeable vets all round. If you can get there then I can thoroughly Recommend them.
Hope you can get Arnold sorted x
Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic | Northlands Vets
 

Ali_x

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This is very insightful, Thank you! I haven’t asked how experienced they are, I took him to Anton Mill vets in Andover and he was seen by Rebecca, who’s an exotic but John Chitty who is the senior exotic vet and owner has been over seeing his care this weekend, and It was him I spoke to and he has looked at his x-rays so I would have thought he would have checked that? Or I would hope anyway

So when I initially took him in as his appetite had decreased, Rebecca looked at his teeth and said that they would need filing but didn’t think it would cause an immediate problem, I got them filed as he was under GA for the x-rays anyway. John was very certain that the pain was due to this jaw misalignment problem he has, which showed up on the x day, there hasn’t been any trauma at any point, so not sure what’s caused this.

If I get him back and there’s still no improvement, then I’ll consider speaking to the vet you have recommended. John Chitty at Anton Mills is very experienced in all things exotic, so I would hope he would cover everything but you never know... fingers crossed!

X
 

Ali_x

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If a dental is not carried out correctly, and any tiny spikes are left then the piggie will not eat. We see this many, many times on the forum. How experienced are your vets at doing guinea pig dental and what success have they had?
The most experienced Guinea Pig dental vets in the Country are Simon and Kim Maddock at the Cat and Rabbit Clinic in Northampton. We travel from Cornwall and we are not alone, owners travel from all over the country. We have experienced GA dentals done by exotic and general local vets and they have made a complete mess of my Ted’s teeth. Simon and Kim use a conscious dental method, it takes around 10 minutes filing and the piggie is eating straight away. Because no anaesthetic is used it’s very reasonably price too at £60 plus a one off registration fee. They perform around 30 plus dentals a week on guinea pigs and are fabulous and very knowledgeable vets all round. If you can get there then I can thoroughly Recommend them.
Hope you can get Arnold sorted x
Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic | Northlands Vets
This is very insightful, Thank you! I haven’t asked how experienced they are, I took him to Anton Mill vets in Andover and he was seen by Rebecca, who’s an exotic but John Chitty who is the senior exotic vet and owner has been over seeing his care this weekend, and It was him I spoke to and he has looked at his x-rays so I would have thought he would have checked that? Or I would hope anyway

So when I initially took him in as his appetite had decreased, Rebecca looked at his teeth and said that they would need filing but didn’t think it would cause an immediate problem, I got them filed as he was under GA for the x-rays anyway. John was very certain that the pain was due to this jaw misalignment problem he has, which showed up on the x day, there hasn’t been any trauma at any point, so not sure what’s caused this.

If I get him back and there’s still no improvement, then I’ll consider speaking to the vet you have recommended. John Chitty at Anton Mills is very experienced in all things exotic, so I would hope he would cover everything but you never know... fingers crossed!

X
 

Bill & Ted

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This is very insightful, Thank you! I haven’t asked how experienced they are, I took him to Anton Mill vets in Andover and he was seen by Rebecca, who’s an exotic but John Chitty who is the senior exotic vet and owner has been over seeing his care this weekend, and It was him I spoke to and he has looked at his x-rays so I would have thought he would have checked that? Or I would hope anyway

So when I initially took him in as his appetite had decreased, Rebecca looked at his teeth and said that they would need filing but didn’t think it would cause an immediate problem, I got them filed as he was under GA for the x-rays anyway. John was very certain that the pain was due to this jaw misalignment problem he has, which showed up on the x day, there hasn’t been any trauma at any point, so not sure what’s caused this.

If I get him back and there’s still no improvement, then I’ll consider speaking to the vet you have recommended. John Chitty at Anton Mills is very experienced in all things exotic, so I would hope he would cover everything but you never know... fingers crossed!

X
yes I have heard of John Chitty and he is a very good vet. See how little Arnold gets on. If you think you are not making progress then I would definitely see Simon Maddock in Northampton. So many owners struggling to get their dental piggies eating again and one trip to see Simon or Kim have proved very fruitful, me included. My exotic vet made such a mess in lock down. I have been taking Ted up to Northampton for regular conscious dentals for 3 years now and he is doing really well.
Good luck x
 

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Hey guys, an update from this and some further advice.... so Arnold had a 3 day stay at the vets last weekend, he came home Monday and I was advised to continue with soft food and, Metacam, abx for his ear infection

His diet intake was still low, even in the vets with the strong pain killers, he was interested in food and picking at things but not a great amount so I was syringe feeding in between, he was eating grass instead of hay, his poos were getting softer, not runny but soft

I phoned the vet again on Wednesday morning to query the current plan and say that I was concerned that his appetite wasn’t getting better, despite all these interventions

She advised that ear infections can take a long time to clear up, she advised to continue abx for at least 2 weeks. Also she thinks he’s mandible is still painful, so to continue on pain relief, the senior exotic vet John Chitty Also supported this, I expressed my concerns about the loose poos and queried whether it’s the abx, she said it was likely more the Metacam. I have been giving him probiotics and syringe feeding critical care. He’s had x rays, he isn’t showing any signs of a URI, airway and chest is clear.

So today he seems a lot more withdrawn, he’s completely resisting the syringe feeding and is showing me that he really doesn’t want it, it almost feels cruel force feeding, as he’s so adamantly against it, he’s burying his head in my arms, almost like he wants to be left in peace. He’s lost weight obviously, I’ve tried to up the syringe feeding but he’s so resistant, I can never get more than 10 mls in a sitting and I work long days as a nurse, so I can’t be there through the day feeding him, I’ve got no one else who can do it either, so I’m in a real dilemma.

I’ve asked one of my friends if they can take him tomorrow to the vet as I’m on a long day at the hospital Saturday and Sunday this weekend, I don’t know know what they will do if he gets admitted again, they’ll feed him get him fluids and strong pain killers and then we will back to square one again! In the mean time, I’ve stressed him out as he really doesn’t like being in the vets

It’s difficult

Don’t know if anyone has been in a similar situation to me, it sometimes helps to hear other people’s experiences

Thanks everyone
 

Bill & Ted

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I’m so sorry for you, you are in such a difficult situation with long hours and trying to feed him regularly too. Antibiotics do dampen the appetite so he will probably not feel very hungry. I would try and keep feeding him and keep him going. 10 ml is not a bad amount at a time, if you can get 6 feeds in a day like that you are doing well. My Ted would only ever take around 10ml, it’s hard work. Can you tempt him into eating his favourite veggies cut up into tiny sticks etc?
Fingers crossed he will start eating soon. Soft poos are often a symptom of dental piggies. They don’t tend to eat enough hay and foods full of fibre soft their poos can be a bit soft, it can also be the antibiotics too
If you are at all worried about his teeth then I would recommend you see Simon or Kim Maddock at Northampton, they will give you an answer as to his dental problems and correct any Spurs with conscious filing there and then
 

Bill & Ted

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Have you tried dry porridge oats, they are great fillers for poorly piggies and grated sweet potato too x
 

furryfriends (TEAS)

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I run a sanctuary for guinea pigs with dental issues and I would really urge you to get your guinea pig seen by Simon Maddock at the Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic in Northampton, if at all possible. Simon sees guinea pigs, with dental issues, from all over the UK. I am currently boarding one from the Isle of Wight, who has made amazing progress since being here, despite her having treatment for months, at the previous vet.
 

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I run a sanctuary for guinea pigs with dental issues and I would really urge you to get your guinea pig seen by Simon Maddock at the Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic in Northampton, if at all possible. Simon sees guinea pigs, with dental issues, from all over the UK. I am currently boarding one from the Isle of Wight, who has made amazing progress since being here, despite her having treatment for months, at the previous vet.
My Ted boarded at Debbie‘s @furryfriends (TEAS) for 3 months while he needed regular treatment (twice monthly dentals) after a botched dental by a local exotic vet near me in lockdown this spring. He was so well cared for by Debbie while he had his dentals with Simon who is only a few miles away.
 

Ali_x

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I’m so sorry for you, you are in such a difficult situation with long hours and trying to feed him regularly too. Antibiotics do dampen the appetite so he will probably not feel very hungry. I would try and keep feeding him and keep him going. 10 ml is not a bad amount at a time, if you can get 6 feeds in a day like that you are doing well. My Ted would only ever take around 10ml, it’s hard work. Can you tempt him into eating his favourite veggies cut up into tiny sticks etc?
Fingers crossed he will start eating soon. Soft poos are often a symptom of dental piggies. They don’t tend to eat enough hay and foods full of fibre soft their poos can be a bit soft, it can also be the antibiotics too
If you are at all worried about his teeth then I would recommend you see Simon or Kim Maddock at Northampton, they will give you an answer as to his dental problems and correct any Spurs with conscious filing there and then
Hey guys, an update from this and some further advice.... so Arnold had a 3 day stay at the vets last weekend, he came home Monday and I was advised to continue with soft food and, Metacam, abx for his ear infection

His diet intake was still low, even in the vets with the strong pain killers, he was interested in food and picking at things but not a great amount so I was syringe feeding in between, he was eating grass instead of hay, his poos were getting softer, not runny but soft

I phoned the vet again on Wednesday morning to query the current plan and say that I was concerned that his appetite wasn’t getting better, despite all these interventions

She advised that ear infections can take a long time to clear up, she advised to continue abx for at least 2 weeks. Also she thinks he’s mandible is still painful, so to continue on pain relief, the senior exotic vet John Chitty Also supported this, I expressed my concerns about the loose poos and queried whether it’s the abx, she said it was likely more the Metacam. I have been giving him probiotics and syringe feeding critical care. He’s had x rays, he isn’t showing any signs of a URI, airway and chest is clear.

So today he seems a lot more withdrawn, he’s completely resisting the syringe feeding and is showing me that he really doesn’t want it, it almost feels cruel force feeding, as he’s so adamantly against it, he’s burying his head in my arms, almost like he wants to be left in peace. He’s lost weight obviously, I’ve tried to up the syringe feeding but he’s so resistant, I can never get more than 10 mls in a sitting and I work long days as a nurse, so I can’t be there through the day feeding him, I’ve got no one else who can do it either, so I’m in a real dilemma.

I’ve asked one of my friends if they can take him tomorrow to the vet as I’m on a long day at the hospital Saturday and Sunday this weekend, I don’t know know what they will do if he gets admitted again, they’ll feed him get him fluids and strong pain killers and then we will back to square one again! In the mean time, I’ve stressed him out as he really doesn’t like being in the vets

It’s difficult

Don’t know if anyone has been in a similar situation to me, it sometimes helps to hear other people’s experiences

Thanks everyone
I’m so sorry for you, you are in such a difficult situation with long hours and trying to feed him regularly too. Antibiotics do dampen the appetite so he will probably not feel very hungry. I would try and keep feeding him and keep him going. 10 ml is not a bad amount at a time, if you can get 6 feeds in a day like that you are doing well. My Ted would only ever take around 10ml, it’s hard work. Can you tempt him into eating his favourite veggies cut up into tiny sticks etc?
Fingers crossed he will start eating soon. Soft poos are often a symptom of dental piggies. They don’t tend to eat enough hay and foods full of fibre soft their poos can be a bit soft, it can also be the antibiotics too
If you are at all worried about his teeth then I would recommend you see Simon or Kim Maddock at Northampton, they will give you an answer as to his dental problems and correct any Spurs with conscious filing there and then
I wish I could feed him round the clock, I feel like I would have given him a fighting chance then, I was able to manage with the feeds I was giving before because he was still eating some fresh food And grass but he’s not even doing that now, so completely reliant on my syringe feeding! I gave him 10 ml before work this morning and some fluids, he has nibbled on some fresh food but hasn’t touched his grass or hay

I’ve got in from work tonight and given him another 10 mls, some fluids and some antibiotics, I will get up in the night once to do another feed and then again before work tomorrow and then when I get home I’ll do the same thing tomorrow, I’m off Monday so can feed around the clock then... will see if that 24-48 hours will make the difference

I would like to take him to the recommended vets in Northampton, but feel like he’s not well enough for that journey right now, if I can get him better or more stable then I will:.. although he has seen a really good senior exotic vet so I would find it strange that he would have got it wrong... I would hope not

I’ve been in tears last night and today because I felt like he had given up...he is taking the feed, a bit reluctantly, he is putting up a fight but he’s swallowing and chewing the feed when it’s in and I’ve got an overwhelming sense of guilt that things weren’t done right at the vet and I’m not able to feed him and enough, so basically I feel like I’m letting him die, and I just feel overwhelmingly stressed and guilty... I will have to do what I can and hope he pulls through


Thank you for your advice

Xx
 

Ali_x

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I run a sanctuary for guinea pigs with dental issues and I would really urge you to get your guinea pig seen by Simon Maddock at the Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic in Northampton, if at all possible. Simon sees guinea pigs, with dental issues, from all over the UK. I am currently boarding one from the Isle of Wight, who has made amazing progress since being here, despite her having treatment for months, at the previous vet.
Hi, I have e-mailed the care clinic in Northampton to see what they think, I don’t think he’s well enough at the moment to do any kind of travelling and he’s a stressful guinea pig so I’m being cautious about stressing him out too much at the moment, I’m going to try my best to pull him through in the next 24-48 hours and get him stable , he’s lost a lot of weight though and has lost a lot of interest in food, I’m giving him Metacam, critical care, prebiotics and vitamin c, as well as fluids, he actually loves the fluids and is taking that really easily
 
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