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Billy - What Do I Do!

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PAMELAKT

PAMELAKT

Adult Guinea Pig
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So Billy is still on his painkillers for his jaw and thyroid meds.

His weight has been stable ish at 950-970 for weeks & he is eating really quite well for him. However his weight is going slowly down & hes 919 this morning.

He has a cyst on his thyroid which is noticeable to the touch but not bothering him & you can't tell he has it unless you feel for it.

I know that if I take him to the vet they will say they want to take this thyroid out, he's 5 next month I just don't feel comfortable with putting him through that. But I can't just let him continue to lose weight.

What would you do?
 
Also get his thyroid levels checked again. It might be he needs a stronger dose of meds.
Under active thyroid causes weight loss.
 
Sorry, I can't remember from your previous post, but was it not possible to just remove the cyst? Removing the entire thyroid sounds extreme. Though at the same time I'm not advocating that you go for cyst removal either as it can still be an intensive procedure, when Cash had his removed it was much much more attached than we had first thought, taking (the highly experienced) vet longer to remove and prolonging his time under GA, which along with thyroid associated heart risks was why he didn't come out the other side.

I feel for you as this is a real catch 22. :soz:

Looking at his bloods again and seeing what his thyroid levels are doing in response to the meds is probably where I'd go from here, at least then you're getting a fuller picture of what's going on to inform your decisions. There may be other thyroid meds you can try, I think there were two options that were discussed when we were treating Cash.
 
I recently had a guinea pig with thyroid problems. He too had a cyst on his thyroid, but removing the whole thyroid was never an option discussed. My vet drained the cyst, which improved his symptoms, but he was also on medication. Don't assume the vet is going to suggest a thyroidectomy. I would go and ask for the meds to be reviewed. And even if the vet does think the op is an option (which I'm fairly sure it wouldn't - too small and fiddly), you can always say no! My advice - talk to the vet.
 
I know the vet wants to (John Chitty) as I have already been told he wanted to do that next. I will ask but I think he will just say the cyst will only come back, it has already been drained once. I hate all this ;(
 
John chitty is a well known exotic vet and should be more than capable. Two of mine recently had their thyroid removed, both at 5 years old, both did fine. I would first recheck thyroid blood levels and potentially up the medications to see if this helps before removing the thyroid itself. Removing thyroid a is very common procedure in cats and not as drastic as it sounds.

Hope all goes ok, whatever you decide.

x
 
Oh really! Can I ask what their weights were? They ideally wanted Billy to his 1Kg but he is way off now. I'm also worried as he has metacam & tramadol daily for his jaw issues & I worry about his little organs enough as it is.

I guess I will have to take him in, I just have this awful feeling I won't leave with him if I do ;(



Abi_nurse said:
John chitty is a well known exotic vet and should be more than capable. Two of mine recently had their thyroid removed, both at 5 years old, both did fine. I would first recheck thyroid blood levels and potentially up the medications to see if this helps before removing the thyroid itself. Removing thyroid a is very common procedure in cats and not as drastic as it sounds.

Hope all goes ok, whatever you decide.

x
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PAMELAKT said:
Oh really! Can I ask what their weights were? They ideally wanted Billy to his 1Kg but he is way off now. I'm also worried as he has metacam & tramadol daily for his jaw issues & I worry about his little organs enough as it is.

I guess I will have to take him in, I just have this awful feeling I won't leave with him if I do ;(
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Both were under 900g at the time, and one was spayed at the same time too. I wouldn't rush into it right away. Have a discussion with the vet so you can make an informed decision about it or up the meds first to see how he is with that? Don't make any big decision right now.

x
 
GPcrazy said:
Also get his thyroid levels checked again. It might be he needs a stronger dose of meds.
Under active thyroid causes weight loss.
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Just to clarify, under active thyroid does not cause weight loss, it causes weight gain. Hyperthyroidism (overactive)causes weight loss :) I know because I have an under active thyroid myself. @PAMELAKT so sorry Billy is losing weight, I agree with Abi Nurse as to how to proceed with his treatment. Fingers & paws crossed for him x
 
Poppy'sMum said:
Just to clarify, under active thyroid does not cause weight loss, it causes weight gain. Hyperthyroidism (overactive)causes weight loss :) I know because I have an under active thyroid myself. @PAMELAKT so sorry Billy is losing weight, I agree with Abi Nurse as to how to proceed with his treatment. Fingers & paws crossed for him x
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You are quite right. I too have hypothyroidism so do actually know that. I think I was having a mental moment when I wrote that :doh:
 
Thanks guys, I'll let you know what happens.

One other thing - do you think it matters what time of day I give him the thyroid Med? He spent 4 days at the vets last month when he was poorly & they started this medicine in the evening so I have continued it I am wondering if I shoud give it in the morning? Do you think it makes any difference?
 
PAMELAKT said:
Thanks guys, I'll let you know what happens.

One other thing - do you think it matters what time of day I give him the thyroid Med? He spent 4 days at the vets last month when he was poorly & they started this medicine in the evening so I have continued it I am wondering if I shoud give it in the morning? Do you think it makes any difference?
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I think you could give it in the morning as long as you stick to a rough time every day x
 
I just wonder if maybe he burns more energy in the day so I should give then I don't know... it's so rubbish I've battled since December with his jaw issues & finally he can eat quite well & now his weight is just dropping anyway. Can't bare the thought of putting through any more!

IMG_9496.webp
 
The time of day itself doesn't matter too much, as long as it's consistent. But the foods he eats and the other meds he takes can affect the thyroid meds. I assume cavy thyroid meds are a bit different to human ones, but here's a website that explains how certain foods (especially calcium) can affect the absorption of the meds.

Thyroid Need-To-Know

This is also a really interesting site that suggests night time is better and improves the absorption of the meds.

The Best Time to Take Thyroid Medication
 
I very much take the view, just because we can, doesn't always mean we should. Any decision needs to be yours, based on getting as much information as possible from John. Just because you are dealing with John Chitty, please don't feel intimidated and pressurised to just go ahead with what he is suggesting, without asking as many questions as possible, so you can make a proper informed decision. Whatever decision you finally make, I really wish Billy well and hope he has lots more good quality life ahead of him.
 
Hi @PAMELAKT. I too have a guinea pig wither hyperactive thyroid & cyst. I discovered this after he had lost weight gradually over a 2 month period (about 150g). It was discovered he had a thyroid cyst & his thyroid reading was very high, 72 when 15 to 25 is considered normal. He was put on Methimazole which is a gel used by vets for treating cats. It's applied to the inside flap of ears. At first Mitch had 0.04ml applied to alternate ears daily. After a second blood test showed his reading had dropped to 58 his application was upped to 0.08ml per day. I have also been syringe feeding up to 75ml of mushed up pellets daily but am finally getting his weight stabilized with between 50ml & 56ml a day. His weight has increased from a low of 1008g to a high of 1110g. If I give him 50ml he loses a little but if I give him 56ml he gains a little. He's going back the week after next for another blood test & his applications may be adjusted again depending on the reading. I personally don't think a thyroid removal on a 5-year-old guinea pig is a good thing & would much rather to go down the route I'm going with Mitch. I forgot to mention earlier that when both blood samples were taken under anaesthetic that the cyst was drained on both occasions. The fluid drained was tested & gave a sky high reading. I had part of my thyroid removed in 1986 because of a cyst which turned out to not be cancer & I still on occasion have a tightness in that area of my neck when tired or under pressure.
 
GPcrazy said:
The time of day itself doesn't matter too much, as long as it's consistent. But the foods he eats and the other meds he takes can affect the thyroid meds. I assume cavy thyroid meds are a bit different to human ones, but here's a website that explains how certain foods (especially calcium) can affect the absorption of the meds.

Thyroid Need-To-Know

This is also a really interesting site that suggests night time is better and improves the absorption of the meds.

The Best Time to Take Thyroid Medication
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Oh my goodness this is so interesting - and a little annoying that I didn't read it last night as I gave him his thyroid medicine this morning to see if it made a difference. Grr! Thank you so much for sharing xx
 
furryfriends (TEAS) said:
I very much take the view, just because we can, doesn't always mean we should. Any decision needs to be yours, based on getting as much information as possible from John. Just because you are dealing with John Chitty, please don't feel intimidated and pressurised to just go ahead with what he is suggesting, without asking as many questions as possible, so you can make a proper informed decision. Whatever decision you finally make, I really wish Billy well and hope he has lots more good quality life ahead of him.
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Thank you - I do feel a little pressured, I know he is the most wonderful vet & totally trust him - but Billy has been through alot as it is & I would feel so awful if I put him through something he didn't need. The last couple of times he has had a vet procedure it has taken a good week before he has perked up, its such a worry!
 
Stewybus said:
Hi @PAMELAKT. I too have a guinea pig wither hyperactive thyroid & cyst. I discovered this after he had lost weight gradually over a 2 month period (about 150g). It was discovered he had a thyroid cyst & his thyroid reading was very high, 72 when 15 to 25 is considered normal. He was put on Methimazole which is a gel used by vets for treating cats. It's applied to the inside flap of ears. At first Mitch had 0.04ml applied to alternate ears daily. After a second blood test showed his reading had dropped to 58 his application was upped to 0.08ml per day. I have also been syringe feeding up to 75ml of mushed up pellets daily but am finally getting his weight stabilized with between 50ml & 56ml a day. His weight has increased from a low of 1008g to a high of 1110g. If I give him 50ml he loses a little but if I give him 56ml he gains a little. He's going back the week after next for another blood test & his applications may be adjusted again depending on the reading. I personally don't think a thyroid removal on a 5-year-old guinea pig is a good thing & would much rather to go down the route I'm going with Mitch. I forgot to mention earlier that when both blood samples were taken under anaesthetic that the cyst was drained on both occasions. The fluid drained was tested & gave a sky high reading. I had part of my thyroid removed in 1986 because of a cyst which turned out to not be cancer & I still on occasion have a tightness in that area of my neck when tired or under pressure.
Click to expand...
This is so interesting thank you - and good to hear I am not the only one dealing with this as I keep reading it is not that common! I need to check when I get home but I think Billy is on the same medication as this however in a tablet form. He gets 1/2 tablet a day.
I was told by the vet on my last visit a few weeks ago that the medication works well on cats but in guinea pigs it only works for a few weeks so he would need the thyroid removed. Surely there are other thyroid medications that can be used?! I think my vet has the view that if they are putting him out to drain a cyst or take blood they may as well remove the thyroid at the same time - this is what they have told me previously...
 
Mitch has had a bit of a setback & is going to the vets this afternoon. His breathing is laboured & I suspect water on the lungs so he will need a diuretic. I'm hoping I have caught it in time. I'll update later x
 
Stewybus said:
Mitch has had a bit of a setback & is going to the vets this afternoon. His breathing is laboured & I suspect water on the lungs so he will need a diuretic. I'm hoping I have caught it in time. I'll update later x
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Oh no I am sorry to hear that - wishing you both lots of luck x
 
I have another question - I wondered if changing his thyroid medicine to the mornings may be worth tryint to see if it made a difference and gave him it this morning, however since reading the recent posts on here I want to switch back to evening.

What do I do - wait until tomorrow night now to give him his next dose or give him it again tonight having already had it this morning? He had it at about 6.15am so if I gave him it tonight I could do so as late as possible. !?!?!?!?!?!

Annoyed I did that now...
 
I did similar with Mitch's gel & dropped it from evening to morning over 3 days ie 5pm, 2pm, 11am then 8am. In reverse just give it about 3 hours a day later x
 
Stewybus said:
I did similar with Mitch's gel & dropped it from evening to morning over 3 days ie 5pm, 2pm, 11am then 8am. In reverse just give it about 3 hours a day later x
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I can't give it 3 hours later as I will be at work all day..... I might give it to him quite late tonight, then he will have had about 17 hours in between?
 
I've got no advice, but I've always loved Billy and I hope he gets over this and lives a pampered life x

Was Rosie the sheep yours - my favourite forum piggie when she was ruling the pages with her sheepness
 
Posyrose said:
I've got no advice, but I've always loved Billy and I hope he gets over this and lives a pampered life x

Was Rosie the sheep yours - my favourite forum piggie when she was ruling the pages with her sheepness
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Aww thank you that's lovely, he is quite a special boy I'm so sad he's got these issues.
Rosie wasn't mine... not sure who that is?
 
I'm rooting for Billy! So sorry you're in this situation, it's so tough when these things happen.
The boys and I send you hugs and licks! (Erm, I'm giving the hugs...)
 
Interestingly, I decided I would be home earlier this afternoon so would give thyroid med then & wean it back to evening - however I have weighed him this morning & he has gained 15g! So I will continue with the mornings over the weekend & see what happens....!
 
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