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Boars Rapid weight loss, not pooping properly - very worried (he is at the vets)

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Thank you. I will try him with some more cc in about half an hour and make it nice and warm. Poor boy I really hope there is some improvement soon
 
well the good news is that over the last 24hours he has managed to put on 78g. The bad news is he is refusing to let me syringe feed him. I got a couple of mls down him this morning but he was really struggling and chirping at me. Left him for a bit, tried again but got a warning nip for my efforts. He has had a tiny bit of veg but I have not seen him eat or drink anything (he is downstairs now). Poops are virtually non existant - waiting for urine results

Really don't know what to think now. I jumped for joy when I saw was his weight was and now I am worried again because I can't get anything into him :(
 
78g is a fab gain, and i know how horrible it is but you really need to carry on force feeding if you are to maintain the weight gain, have you tried the towel wrapping technique?

x
 
I will try wrapping him in a towel in a bit and see if that works, it doesnt help that he throws his head around too x
 
Does he seem to be in pain - fluffed out or hunched up?

I wrap in a towel for feeding CC or giving meds so the guinea can't back away, I gently hold the head from above with my left hand while introducing the syringe with my right hand.

I hope Carrot is ok, good weight gain anyway :)
 
Until i was used to it, i used to sit lilly on the kitchen worktop and have his bum in the crook of my left arm and hold his mouth open with my left hand, using gently force if needed when he was struggling, and use my right hand to syringe, now i am so used to syringe feeding i can do it with him on my lap on the sofa. I know it is really hard and horrible, but just remember he is only a little thing with much less strength than you, if you need to use some force (obviously within reason) then do so, just remember your doing it for his own good and it could potentially save his life, it did lilly's so stick at it hun!

xx
 
I have just wrapped him in a towel to stop him struggling and although he wasn't overly impressed he did take 20ml of CC which is good.

I think he is just feeling sorry for himself and knows that every time I pick him up I am going to stick something in his mouth!

He is still spending most of the time in his bed but I have seen him come out once and have a little wander around.

One of his eyes seems a little crusty, I take it that happens if they are unwell?
 
Yes, crusty eyes can be an indicator of an unwell guinea. Their eyes produce a liquid normally that they groom away, if a guinea is unwell or very old, the grooming doesn't happen & crust builds up. You can wipe it away gently with a damp tissue or cloth. Does he have his eyes squinty or half closed when he is just sitting in his cage?
 
He is sitting with half closed eyes and he is all hunched up. he is on antibiotics and painkillers and back at the vets next week for a check up unless he gets dramatically worse.
 
Is he warm enough hun? What AB's and pain relief is he on? Metacam can make them a bit drousy.

xx
 
He had metacam at the vets but wasn't prescribed any to come home with. I have put some vet bed under their corner hidey house and there is a fleece pigloo that has a snuggle safe pad within a sewn in pouch - he is curled up inside that at the moment xx
 
Bless him, i remember lilly was very lethargic the whole time, have you had any blood or urine results back yet? How sure are they its kidney problems?

xx
 
I have just had a phone call from the vets and I am heartbroken. Carrot has Kidney disease/renal failure and there isn't really anything they can do for him. He hasn't moved from his pigloo and hasn't eaten or drunk anything for himself. I have been syringe feeding him but I think I am only going to prolong the inevitable.

I have managed to get some cc into him and some water but its a struggle, he doesn't want anything and he isn't pooping.

Does anyone have any experience of this. I don't want him to suffer, if it would be kinder to have him PTS rather than keeping him alive a bit longer by hand feeding him then I would rather let him go.
 
I am so sorry to hear that Claire really i am, did they say if he will be suffering? I have no advice really, but remember Amanda1801 had a piggie with renal failure, hopefully she wont mind me brining it up, but i couldn't find anything under the search, here is the thread from her darling boxy pig

http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/showthread.php?84317-Boxy-renal-failure&highlight=

I hope it answers some of your questions.

Big hugs x
 
He isn't suffering at the minute. He came out earlier and had a tiny nibble of broccoli and seemed happy to be sitting with me. He isn't drinking at all or eating for himself. Been syringe feeding him CC as per yesterday but he still isn't pooing. He is passing the most minute amount of poop which is more this foul gluey type jelly rather than poo.

I am going to keep an eye on him over the weekend and see how he goes

xx
 
claire8234 said:
I have just had a phone call from the vets and I am heartbroken. Carrot has Kidney disease/renal failure and there isn't really anything they can do for him. He hasn't moved from his pigloo and hasn't eaten or drunk anything for himself. I have been syringe feeding him but I think I am only going to prolong the inevitable.

I have managed to get some cc into him and some water but its a struggle, he doesn't want anything and he isn't pooping.

Does anyone have any experience of this. I don't want him to suffer, if it would be kinder to have him PTS rather than keeping him alive a bit longer by hand feeding him then I would rather let him go.
Click to expand...

I am so sorry.

We had this exact situation in the summer with my daughter's guinea pig Cloud. He had kidney stones in his actual kidneys & the blood test showed kidney failure, we couldn't do anything more for him & I knew he was still in pain despite the highest possible dose of Metacam. We had been hand feeding while we waited for the results to come back & then our exotics vet talked us through the options. He said that we could keep going as we were but if we felt he was in pain then the kindest thing was to pts. I knew he was in pain, he was sitting hunched up & squinty eyes & he was not enjoying the CC hand feeding despite having put on a little bit of weight again. We decided we had to let him go, it was probably the hardest conversation I have ever had to have with my daughter (aged 12). The vet did the pts by a whiff of gas then injection.

This is just our experience, I'm not encouraging you one way or the other but I feel your pain here :(.

With the very best wishes to you & Carrot, shiny
 
Shiny

Thank you for your honest reply. He is doing the same thing, his eyes are half closed and he is all hunched up. he hates being fed the CC and I think all that the syringe feeding is doing is delaying the inevitable. I would rather have him PTS and gain some peace from knowing that he isnt suffering or in pain any more.
 
Shiny

Thank you for your honest reply. He is doing the same thing, his eyes are half closed and he is all hunched up. he hates being fed the CC and I think all that the syringe feeding is doing is delaying the inevitable. I would rather have him PTS and gain some peace from knowing that he isnt suffering or in pain any more.
 
Like I say, I'm not trying to influence you, you know him best & I'm sure you're best placed to make a decision for him. I just wanted you to know you're not alone in this situation. It is always a tough time when any animal is ill like this x
 
Hi Clare

This is a horrible time for you and Carrot - I have read a couple of your other threads but will put a consolidated reply here for you. Carrot has been diganosed with kidney disease. It doesn;t sound like he has kidney failure - as that is the end-stage of kidney disease.

At the moment, Carrot is in pain - which is demonstrated by his being hunched up with spiky fur. Kidney pain from the inflammation is EXTREMELY painful as any human will testify. Therefore Carrot needs adequate (and regular) pain relief as a matter of urgency.......metacam is OK but I have found tramadol works better for kidney pain (although it is an opiate and can slow down the gut and Carrot already has problems with his gut so your vet might not be too keen)

Because he is in pain, he is not eating properly.

Because he has not been eating properly, his guts have slowed down and the jelly like substance you reported in your other thread is indicative of the fact that his guts have almost stopped. He urgently needs metoclopromide and zantac to stimulate his gut to start moving again. He also needs force feeding with 20-30ml of critical care every 4 hours day and night until normal gut function is restored. If he doesn;t like critical care then mush up his pellets with vit C and probiotic into a slurry and feed him that.

This vicious cycle doesn;t just occur when a piggie has kidney disease - it can occur whenever a piggie is suffering from pain (eg dental issues, post-op surgery, cystic ovaries, infection etc) and is not given adequate pain relief and food to keep the gut going.

Bringing a piggie back from gut stasis is not for the faint-hearted or inexperienced, but it can be done provided you have the correct meds and are prepared for the round the clock feeding until the gut starts working properly....(and it hasn;t been left too late). It is extremely stressful and tiring and sometimes I have asked my vets to take my piggie in for a couple of days to give me a rest.

At the moment, he is extremely poorly - not because of the kidney problem but because of the pain/not eating/gut stasis. If you can get him emergency treatment for these issues then there is a good chance his condition will stabilise.


Providing they receive adequate regular pain relief, guinea pigs diagnosed with kidney disease can live almost normal lives for many months - depending upon whether they are in early stages and how quickly the disase progresses. However there will come a time when the kidneys ulitmately fail - -this is often signified by the sudden appearance of a very bloody wee - and you need to be vigilant as the kindest thing you can do for a pig in acute kidney failure is to PTS immediately so they don;t die a painful death
I have had several guinea pigs diagrosed with kidney issues and provided thy are given adequate pain relief, and monitored to ensure they eat enough and their guts are working properly, they have all lived very happily for at least 6 months after diagnosis before being helped to The Bridge.

HTH
x
 
Pebble

Thank you for your reply. He has had very bloody wee on and off for a while now which is why he went to the vets a few months ago. I feel so stupid and so guilty for not ensuring he had painkillers when I bought him home from the vets the other day. I just assumed I had been given everything I needed for him. He has hardly pooped since monday despite me feeding him with CC every few hours. I have never heard of zantac or metoclopromide and was not advised he would need these.

Poor boy - I feel like I have failed him

xx
 
Claire

You have not failed him at all - you have been in regular attendance at the vets, following their instructions and syringe feeding him as much as you can and have also come on here for help - he is very lucky to have you as his slave.

The sad fact is that "the vicious cycle" (as I call it) is all too common. There are not enough vets who have the experience or knowledge to routinely prescribe ongoing pain relief or gut stimulants for sick guinea pigs......some don;t even know about critical care!

The most important thing is that the vet is willing to consider other options - suggest you print out my earlier post and take it in. I will PM you the dosages. Blood in the urine is often seen in early stages of kidney disease and is one of the ways it gets diagnosed....but it is often intermittant and does not necessarily signify the end stage. Has the vet found stones in the kidneys or iare they just going on the blood/urine results?

Don;t beat yourself up - Carrot needs you in one piece please! Most improtant thing is to talk it all through with your vet tomorrow and get him some pain relief.

Hugs

x
 
Thank you Pebble.

I had to ask the vet for Critical care as she didn't even mention it so yes not many vets good with guinea pigs who arent eating. He has had the intermittent blood in his wee for a while and had had an xray which showed he doesnt have stones.

Feeding him is a huge battle, he has to be wrapped in a towel and still squirms (obviously because he is in pain and wants to be left alone). I have managed to get some mushy pellets into him a while ago so at least he has had something. I had some leftover metacam so hes had that which is better than nothing.

I am very tired from being up round the clock looking after him so extremely emotional to say the least!
 
Persist with the food, unless he's really avoid the syringe (usually means hes full unles you've got nothing in him). If he will eat veg, baby corn is high in fat so may put some weight on him. I've just had 3 of my pigs sick, 2 with life ending illnesses (not yet but eventually) and my third got better but had similar problems to yours...

he was given baytril (yes I know it's not the best but i just let the vet treat him), erm and this other medicine that apprantly would produce an appitite and get his gut moving... after being given that, he gained weight and started eating, you can put the slushy food on a plate in the cage between feeds, my pig ate his like this.

I give my pigs 0.2ml of under 6 month calpol for pain, obviously if he's under vet care, then don't because you don't know what it will effect with, plus it can mess with the liver/kidneys if give to for too long. My vets don't seem to mind me medicating my pigs on my own. Obviously I don't when they're medicating them but you know...

Have you tried to put him on his back, in the crook of your arm, like a baby? Cally ate best this way for my boyfriend, but on my lap, where i grabbed his cheeks and popped the syringe into the corner of his cheek for me. It is tiring, I had a row with my boss about needing to leave early to feed him heh.
 
I am very sorry Claire big hugs to you, you did everything you could for him and he knew how hard you tried and how loved he was.

He is having fun at RB now, pain and suffering free.

Big hugs


xxxxxxx
 
Oh no - I'm so sorry. I've been following this post and had really hoped for a happy outcome. Sending big hugs x
 
Big Hugs and wheeks, he obviously took the decision out of your hands, remember him when has fit and healthy and having fun.
 
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