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Specialist Buprecare

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HenryRalph

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hello!

Not sure if anyone will know, but my piggie ralph has been on buprecare 0.3mg orally 3 times a day for his stone, I ran out of it earlier and went to a different pet to pick some up. It says on the packet 'solution for injections' does anyone know whether buprecare is just one product and this is fine to give orally, or whether the vets has given me the wrong one?

I did say to the receptionist it was for oral use but I'm just hesitant whether to give it to him incase it's not right...

Please help if you know anything about this! Thanks :)
 
Buprecare is vetergesic and I have used it, but only in injectable form. I would definitely check first.
I have used Vetergesic orally for one of our girls but wouldn't know if it is the same solution orally and injectable.
 
I have just got hold of an out of hours vet and they said that its fine orally as its broken down by mucous membrane!

At least I can give it to him now :) thanks for your help!
 
I have just got hold of an out of hours vet and they said that its fine orally as its broken down by mucous membrane!

At least I can give it to him now :) thanks for your help!

brilliant! well done, we used to have to give our girl 2 drops a day by mouth. But it was already decanted down in a syringe for us... So never knew what it came from...
 
brilliant! well done, we used to have to give our girl 2 drops a day by mouth. But it was already decanted down in a syringe for us... So never knew what it came from...

That's the same as me, it was just in a little brown bottle before so had no idea what it looked like! Atleast it's all sorted now and he's had his dose :)
 
Thanks for keeping us updated, give little Ralph a cuddle for me
 
My vet prescribed me the injectable solution (same strength as you 0.3mg/ml) which I have been instructed to give orally. However I was instructed to give much less - 0.1ml for a 1kg pig 3x daily.

Word of caution to everyone about this drug - it appears that some pigs (such as my Carson) can have a bad reaction to it and literally become very flat and lifeless, Carson wouldnt eat or drink even via syringe.At the time I assumed it was his dental abcess making him so ill but in fact it was the pain relief! It took 48hours to leave his system and he was his old self nibbling hay when I saw him at TEAS earlier this evening.
 
It suited Cookie down to the ground she was on 0.03ml by mouth twice daily though a lower dose, we had to have emeprid (metachlopromide) with it as it can slow down the guts a little, this may be worth asking for to keep in alongside just in case. How is Ralph doing?
 
My vet prescribed me the injectable solution (same strength as you 0.3mg/ml) which I have been instructed to give orally. However I was instructed to give much less - 0.1ml for a 1kg pig 3x daily.

Word of caution to everyone about this drug - it appears that some pigs (such as my Carson) can have a bad reaction to it and literally become very flat and lifeless, Carson wouldnt eat or drink even via syringe.At the time I assumed it was his dental abcess making him so ill but in fact it was the pain relief! It took 48hours to leave his system and he was his old self nibbling hay when I saw him at TEAS earlier this evening.
I just read this @Pebble & I am certain this was what caused Petal's collapse too, some weeks after her hysterectomy :( She did pull through but I have checked the receipt & it was a different vet as mine was away & he gave a higher dose :(
 
@HenryRalph

Please confirm the dosage (in ml) you have been told to give - this is now a matter of some urgency.
x
 
My vet prescribed me the injectable solution (same strength as you 0.3mg/ml) which I have been instructed to give orally. However I was instructed to give much less - 0.1ml for a 1kg pig 3x daily.

Word of caution to everyone about this drug - it appears that some pigs (such as my Carson) can have a bad reaction to it and literally become very flat and lifeless, Carson wouldnt eat or drink even via syringe.At the time I assumed it was his dental abcess making him so ill but in fact it was the pain relief! It took 48hours to leave his system and he was his old self nibbling hay when I saw him at TEAS earlier this evening.

This is really interesting, thank you, I have noticed for the past day that Ralph had seemed a bit more lifeless when I have had him out to give him his meds, which was confusing as he seemed to be getting so much brighter.. He is taking the meds through syringe a lot easier than he was a couple of days ago, almost though he hasn't got as much energy to fight it? He is still eating hay and I gave him some carrot last night, but I will keep an eye on him today to see if he still seems different... X
 
I would be very cautious with that dose! My own vet only ever gave 0.05 at a time, the amount Petal had a severe reaction to was 0.2 ml. I would hold on until @Pebble can advise further x
 
How much does he weigh? If he is <1kg, I am concerned this is a high dose and may be contributing to his developing lethargy. I do not think however he is having an adverse reaction like my Carson as that presents differently.

Most doses prescribed are <0.1ml - such as Sport billy at 0.03, and my own pig Tia (0.06ml) and Poppy's mum with the normal 0.05ml. With Carson we upped his dose to 0.1ml from 0.06 because we thought he was poorly due to inadequate pain relief - in fact we were making the situation worse because he was having an adverse reaction (as opposed to a side effect - where as we know, a high dose can and will make a piggie a bit lethargic)

For info: here is what happened with Carson this last week. The suddeness of his response (and his recovery following withdrawal of the drug) is what classifies this as an adverse reaction rather than just a "side effect"

Last saturday evening I discovered his dental abcess had come back and pus could be expressed. Sunday morning I spoke to the vet and he received 0./06ml of buprecare (plus abx, gut motility etc) with a view to getting him up to see Simon. At that point he was taking his meds/syringe food well and still eating some for himself. By sunday evening he was less lively and so we upped the buprecare to 0.1ml. By monday morning when he was given his third dose, he was completely flat - front and back legs splayed out and he wouldn;t support his own weight. He wasn;t eating or drinking anything and wouldn't swallow anything from a syringe. Throughout the day he was unmoving except to blink his eyes and occasionally shuffle for a more comfortable position. He had an appointment with Simon for tuesday morning and the plan was to take him up to TEAS monday evening but by monday I was considering PTS thinking it was the abcess. but something abut his behaviour didn't sit right with me in that he wasn't behaving as though he was stressed/in pain/dying....he was just "vacant"

In fact if I hadn't had an all day job interview then he would have been taken in monday morning to go to The Bridge. Luckily during monday I remembered he had responded like this previously when he had his abcess,but went on to make a full recovery and linked it to a one-off dose of buprecare given at the vets. So monday evening he didn;t get his dose of buprecare and went to my vets for subcut fluids prior to being given permission to travel. He wet up to Nton and Debbie fed him a little and often through the night. He was seen by Simon the following morning and things still looked pretty grim (although his mouth was fine and there was no sign of any further pus). By the evening Debbie reported he was becoming more responsive to syringe feeding and the following day (wednesday) when Simon saw him again he couldn;t believe it was the same pig! By thursday when I saw him he was his old self, supporting his weight, head up and eating for himself.


I think it is worth having a chat with your vet about the possible side effects of such a high dose of buprecare given how he is currently responding and also what happened to @Poppy'sMum with her Petal once her dose was upped to 0.2m which was clearly too much. I also would suggest not continuing with such a high dose 3x daily until the matter is resolved with your vets and you either have a lower dosage regime or an alternative analgesic.

Metacam (which is the most common pain relief but is an non-steroidal anti-inflammatory as opposed to an opiate like buprecare) may not be effective with deep seated pain but has less side effects so I'm assuming your vet is either also prescribing it or has ruled it out? As an alternative opiate - my vet uses tramadol which, unlike buprecare, hasn't affected any of my pigs. They in any case normally get cisapride and zantac to keep their guts moving because they are poorly and not eating their full complement of food.

HTH
x
 
Last edited:
OK - I have just seen your other thread and can now put Ralph's history into context. He has inoperable stones - some of which are in his ureter and his kidneys are compromised so you are looking at pallliative care. I'm sorry to hear this. Stones in the ureter/kidney are extremely painful and a higher dose of pain relief is required for this type of pain.

I'm assuming that metacam is not on the table because of its known long term effects on kidney function - although to be honest as it is palliative care, my vets would continue to use it providing it was being effective. I had a piggie with inoperable kidney stones who had a wonderful 6 months post diagnosis with increasing doses of metacam for pain relief until she said to me one day she wanted to go to The Bridge.

With my other pigs with inoperable stones we have tended however to opt for tramadol because metcam just doesn;t deal with the pain as effectively. Buprecare is an alternative but given the side effects at higher dosages I think that Ralph needs to either have a properly determined dose that is sufficient to relieve his pain but not too much to cause the side effects (which of necessity will have to be a bit trial and error) or tramadol as an alternative.

HTH
x
 
Pebble, yes this was how my Petal reacted :( She went from eating & being mobile to literally just sat there, staring into space & when I picked her up, fluid ran out of her :( I second the Tramodol route, we've used it with Petal & it has certainly made a difference when Metacam wasn't quite enough x
 
How much does he weigh? If he is <1kg, I am concerned this is a high dose and may be contributing to his developing lethargy. I do not think however he is having an adverse reaction like my Carson as that presents differently.

Most doses prescribed are <0.1ml - such as Sport billy at 0.03, and my own pig Tia (0.06ml) and Poppy's mum with the normal 0.05ml. With Carson we upped his dose to 0.1ml from 0.06 because we thought he was poorly due to inadequate pain relief - in fact we were making the situation worse because he was having an adverse reaction (as opposed to a side effect - where as we know, a high dose can and will make a piggie a bit lethargic)

For info: here is what happened with Carson this last week. The suddeness of his response (and his recovery following withdrawal of the drug) is what classifies this as an adverse reaction rather than just a "side effect"

Last saturday evening I discovered his dental abcess had come back and pus could be expressed. Sunday morning I spoke to the vet and he received 0./06ml of buprecare (plus abx, gut motility etc) with a view to getting him up to see Simon. At that point he was taking his meds/syringe food well and still eating some for himself. By sunday evening he was less lively and so we upped the buprecare to 0.1ml. By monday morning when he was given his third dose, he was completely flat - front and back legs splayed out and he wouldn;t support his own weight. He wasn;t eating or drinking anything and wouldn't swallow anything from a syringe. Throughout the day he was unmoving except to blink his eyes and occasionally shuffle for a more comfortable position. He had an appointment with Simon for tuesday morning and the plan was to take him up to TEAS monday evening but by monday I was considering PTS thinking it was the abcess. but something abut his behaviour didn't sit right with me in that he wasn't behaving as though he was stressed/in pain/dying....he was just "vacant"

In fact if I hadn't had an all day job interview then he would have been taken in monday morning to go to The Bridge. Luckily during monday I remembered he had responded like this previously when he had his abcess,but went on to make a full recovery and linked it to a one-off dose of buprecare given at the vets. So monday evening he didn;t get his dose of buprecare and went to my vets for subcut fluids prior to being given permission to travel. He wet up to Nton and Debbie fed him a little and often through the night. He was seen by Simon the following morning and things still looked pretty grim (although his mouth was fine and there was no sign of any further pus). By the evening Debbie reported he was becoming more responsive to syringe feeding and the following day (wednesday) when Simon saw him again he couldn;t believe it was the same pig! By thursday when I saw him he was his old self, supporting his weight, head up and eating for himself.


I think it is worth having a chat with your vet about the possible side effects of such a high dose of buprecare given how he is currently responding and also what happened to @Poppy'sMum with her Petal once her dose was upped to 0.2m which was clearly too much. I also would suggest not continuing with such a high dose 3x daily until the matter is resolved with your vets and you either have a lower dosage regime or an alternative analgesic.

Metacam (which is the most common pain relief but is an non-steroidal anti-inflammatory as opposed to an opiate like buprecare) may not be effective with deep seated pain but has less side effects so I'm assuming your vet is either also prescribing it or has ruled it out? As an alternative opiate - my vet uses tramadol which, unlike buprecare, hasn't affected any of my pigs. They in any case normally get cisapride and zantac to keep their guts moving because they are poorly and not eating their full complement of food.

HTH
x

Thank you this has been really helpful! Ralph weighs 730g so yes, under 1kg.. Oh no it sounds like you've had some dramas :( hope he is all okay now!

Ralph is also taking cisapride and was on loxicom, but my vet has now given me metacam instead, so he is taking the 3 different meds along with critical care 3/4 times a day.

It does sound like the dosage is quite a lot considering his weight, and I have definitely noticed a change in him when he is having buprecare, I will speak to my vet about tramadol as that sounds a lot better! In the mean time would you suggest giving it to him maybe twice a day instead of the three times he is currently having?

Thank you for your help x
 
Giiven his 730g weight - I personally would reduce the dose to 0.05ml twice a day but you really need to invovlve your vet You shouldn;t need to take him in - a phone call should do it

Good he's on cisapride.

PS loxicam and metacam rone and the same.
x.
 
Giiven his 730g weight - I personally would reduce the dose to 0.05ml twice a day but you really need to invovlve your vet You shouldn;t need to take him in - a phone call should do it

Good he's on cisapride.

PS loxicam and metacam rone and the same.
x.

Yeah I think I will reduce it to 0.05ml and see how he seems, and will give the vet a ring on Monday. Thank you! X
 
Errrmmm....please contact the vet - even if out of hours - before you make any decisions on reducing dosage.
Given the info I have supplied I'm sure you can convince an emergency vet on the phone to agree to you reducing the dosage.

The Guinea PIg forum adheres to very strict conduct .....the comments the H & I bods give is provided for you on the understanding you WILL discuss with your vet before implementing.
x
 
Errrmmm....please contact the vet - even if out of hours - before you make any decisions on reducing dosage.
Given the info I have supplied I'm sure you can convince an emergency vet on the phone to agree to you reducing the dosage.

The Guinea PIg forum adheres to very strict conduct .....the comments the H & I bods give is provided for you on the understanding you WILL discuss with your vet before implementing.
x

Okay will do - will be contacting the vet before making any decisions!

Also, I will be talking to the vet tomorrow, but I've noticed that he is losing quite a lot of hair and has bald bits on his back now and his skin looks very dry and flakey - wondered whether you have experienced this before as being a side effect of one of the meds or something totally unrelated.. Reading online it sounds like it could be mites but I will be contacting the vet tomorrow about it anyway - poor Ralph it's one thing after another! X
 
Just to clarify a few things.
Buprenorphine (buprecare or vetergesic it may be known as) can be given up to dosages of 0.05mg/kg safely. We use this dose routinely and have had no issues whatsoever. (This is 0.17ml per kg) However...

Buprenorphine is a partial opioid drug (similar to morphine type drugs) Because of this it has few side effects.
- slowing the guts down
- mild to moderate sedation
- appetite depression

I have not personally ever used it subligually (onto the gums). This is a tried and test route in cats so not sure how effective it is in piggies but if others have seen good results then fair play. Higher dosages can and do cause sedation which is normal. I recently had my sow who had been spayed on it for a day or two after (via injections) and yes she was very sedated, but analgesia was more important and I tapered the dosages off as she began to eat.

I hope this makes a little sense.

x
 
Just to clarify a few things.
Buprenorphine (buprecare or vetergesic it may be known as) can be given up to dosages of 0.05mg/kg safely. We use this dose routinely and have had no issues whatsoever. (This is 0.17ml per kg) However...

Buprenorphine is a partial opioid drug (similar to morphine type drugs) Because of this it has few side effects.
- slowing the guts down
- mild to moderate sedation
- appetite depression

I have not personally ever used it subligually (onto the gums). This is a tried and test route in cats so not sure how effective it is in piggies but if others have seen good results then fair play. Higher dosages can and do cause sedation which is normal. I recently had my sow who had been spayed on it for a day or two after (via injections) and yes she was very sedated, but analgesia was more important and I tapered the dosages off as she began to eat.

I hope this makes a little sense.

x

Thank you for that, that's really helpful :)

The vet has dropped his dose to 0.08ml now twice a day so will see how he does on that now, hopefully he will seem more energetic again! He has put on nearly 100g in about 10 days too which is good as he still has his appetite.

X
 
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