Can I keep 3 boars?

[Lunar_Creature]

Hello!
I´m not sure if this is the right thread for asking this, please redirect me to the correct one if not.

The situation looks as follows: I had 2 boars, one of them died recently, my sister's guinea pig was pregnant (by accident) at the time, and she offered that I can have the male baby if there is one as companion for my now single boar.
Fast forward some time, her guinea pig gave birth to two males and one female, not wanting to risk any more pregnancies when the males were old enough I took both of them and placed them with the adult boar.
The question is: Can I somehow make a trio work or will I have to give one of them up?
I've read that it's very difficult for 3 boars to get along. So far the adult seems to be the boss, one of the babies is a bit dominant, and the other one is rather submissive.
They seem to like each other, but I'm worried that they might have a falling out once the babies become teenagers.
The reason why I don't want to give one up is because I'm worried i won't be able to find someone who will provide them with the right care, for context I live in a pretty small country so I don't know if there's that many people interested in guinea pigs in the first place.
Any advice is appreciated, thank you in advance.

 

[Piggies&buns]

Welcome to the forum

Boars don’t tend to do well in anything other than pairs. Some people get lucky with a trio, but generally they are very difficult to get to work - and as it comes down to compatibility and forming a hierarchy between them, there is not really anything you can do to make it work; it either will or it won’t.
You may be able to keep them together while they are babies, but once they hit their teens it will become increasingly likely that you will have to separate them - having two dominant boars is when fights will occur.
Unfortunately most boar trios will never be successful mostly due to character incompatibilities but also space is a consideration.

While space will not make them get on, lack of space will cause them problems. Boars are very territorial and need huge amount of room as a pair but trying to keep them as a trio means their space needs become even greater than normal cage sizing requirements.
To have a big enough space for three boars, the cage will need to measure at least 300x100cm. You will need at least three of everything in the cage and no hides with only one exit (one exit hides means they can fight inside if one piggy feels trapped with no other way out)

You will also need the means and plan to split them up as soon as fights occur.
Do bear in mind that while you may be able to make a pair and a single out of a failed boar trio, it is also possible that all three fight and you could end up needing three separate cages.

Often it can be better to observe which two get on best and keep them as a pair, splitting them off from the other one before a fall out occurs.
If you can split them into a pair and a single; ensure the pair have a cage which is 180x60cm and the single has a cage which is at least 120x60cm.
A single piggy needs to be kept alongside the pair at all times so they can interact between the bars. That will stop a single piggy becoming lonely.

So really you will just have to see how things go but have a plan to split them up if problems occur

A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
Adding More Guinea Pigs Or Merging Pairs – What Works And What Not?

 

[Wiebke]

Hello!
I´m not sure if this is the right thread for asking this, please redirect me to the correct one if not.

The situation looks as follows: I had 2 boars, one of them died recently, my sister's guinea pig was pregnant (by accident) at the time, and she offered that I can have the male baby if there is one as companion for my now single boar.
Fast forward some time, her guinea pig gave birth to two males and one female, not wanting to risk any more pregnancies when the males were old enough I took both of them and placed them with the adult boar.
The question is: Can I somehow make a trio work or will I have to give one of them up?
I've read that it's very difficult for 3 boars to get along. So far the adult seems to be the boss, one of the babies is a bit dominant, and the other one is rather submissive.
They seem to like each other, but I'm worried that they might have a falling out once the babies become teenagers.
The reason why I don't want to give one up is because I'm worried i won't be able to find someone who will provide them with the right care, for context I live in a pretty small country so I don't know if there's that many people interested in guinea pigs in the first place.
Any advice is appreciated, thank you in advance.

Hi

It is great that you want to give those baby boys a happy home. We provide a second opinion sexing service if you wish to make sure when the boys come to you.
Boar Separation: Sexing - Separation age & weight - Moving on (incl. dad aspects)

You have got great advice from @Piggies&buns . It all depends on the personality constellation once the babies develop their adult identity and go through the intense hormones spikes once their testicles descend. The more boars go through teenage together, the higher the risk of fall-outs.
Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated Bonding Dynamics and Behaviours

With three boars you are realistically looking at most trios with youngsters ending up with a 2+1 constellation with either two dominant boars fighting it out re. leadership and one less dominant one stuck in the middle; two more dominant boars ganging up on the third or one dominant boy terrorising his two submissive brothers to an excessive extent. However, about the same percentage of trios where you end with three boys not getting on with each other is balanced out with a functional trio.

What you simply cannot predict is the outcome. Ideally, you make sure that you have either a large enough boar cage that you can divide into a doubles and one single cage or three single cages with interaction through the bars.
A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars

You may also find this link here interesting, as it follows the development over a lifetime from cradle to the grave so you can understand a bit more the challenges: Journey through a Lifetime: The Ages of Guinea Pigs

 

[Mrs Tiggy Winkle]

Hello! I'm just adding my piece since you do live in a small country. Guinea rescues in Germany don't warn so much about boar threesomes or foursomes not getting along. I don't why it seems easier in Germany Maybe boars who are neutered early (which I think means before the testicles descend) never quite develop into a real male hormone-wise? I don't know if vets in Iceland neuter (castrate) baby boars. Apparently they don't in the UK. But they do in Germany.

If you're interested, I could try and speak to my local rescue or somebody local who is very experienced with boar groups and see if they have any advice beyond what @Wiebke and @Piggies&buns have said. I won't manage immediately though due to chronic problems with fatigue etc.

I looked after 3 boars who lived together, while the "somebody local" was in rehab for 10 weeks. I've posted a bit about them here
My guineas and also post no. 47, (2 posts above the linked one).
When those boars came to stay with me, they lived in my guinea accommodation rather than their own C&C. I know my accommodation at the time was just shy of enough space for 3. (It had been adequate originally and then the recommendations changed, so it was adequate for 2.75 guineas.) Anyway, when the 3 boars came to stay, they didn't fight despite my set-up being a) different and b) on the small side. But two of them were seniors, which probably made a difference. And I'm certainly not recommending too small accommodation, just saying I had luck and it didn't bother the boar trio.

 

[Roselina]

Good luck …you’ve had the very best advice to help you make a decision
Let us know

 

[Merab]

All the best.
I hope everything works well for you as you are clearly a very caring owner

 

[Wiebke]

Hello! I'm just adding my piece since you do live in a small country. Guinea rescues in Germany don't warn so much about boar threesomes or foursomes not getting along. I don't why it seems easier in Germany Maybe boars who are neutered early (which I think means before the testicles descend) never quite develop into a real male hormone-wise? I don't know if vets in Iceland neuter (castrate) baby boars. Apparently they don't in the UK. But they do in Germany.

If you're interested, I could try and speak to my local rescue or somebody local who is very experienced with boar groups and see if they have any advice beyond what @Wiebke and @Piggies&buns have said. I won't manage immediately though due to chronic problems with fatigue etc.

I looked after 3 boars who lived together, while the "somebody local" was in rehab for 10 weeks. I've posted a bit about them here
My guineas and also post no. 47, (2 posts above the linked one).
When those boars came to stay with me, they lived in my guinea accommodation rather than their own C&C. I know my accommodation at the time was just shy of enough space for 3. (It had been adequate originally and then the recommendations changed, so it was adequate for 2.75 guineas.) Anyway, when the 3 boars came to stay, they didn't fight despite my set-up being a) different and b) on the small side. But two of them were seniors, which probably made a difference. And I'm certainly not recommending too small accommodation, just saying I had luck and it didn't bother the boar trio.

Early neutering prevents the huge testosterone spikes that come with the descent of the testicles and the teenage hormones, which makes a huge difference in terms of socialising. They are more like old boars when the testosterone production has petered out (over 4-5 years) and they are much more mellow and happy to have companionship than dominance - not that all old boys want to be with others but those that do can live in bachelor trios, quartets or larger groups.

Unfortunately, baby castration is categorically not practised (believe me, I have tried) in the UK and other English speaking countries.
Finding a vet in Iceland who has trained for that kind of operation on babies around 250g (separation age at 3 weeks, since fertility starts between 3-5 weeks on average but can happen even sooner - hence our weight qualifier - and it comes way before sexual maturity with descended testicles at 4-6 months of aga) may be a step too far.

 

[Mrs Tiggy Winkle]

Unfortunately, baby castration is categorically not practised (believe me, I have tried) in the UK and other English speaking countries.

Yes, Wiebke I know, you've mentioned that before. I wrote it for @Lunar_Creature on the off chance that there are vets in Iceland who can do baby castration.

Early neutering prevents the huge testosterone spikes that come with the descent of the testicles and the teenage hormones, which makes a huge difference in terms of socialising. They are more like old boars when the testosterone production has petered out (over 4-5 years) and they are much more mellow and happy to have companionship than dominance - not that all old boys want to be with others but those that do can live in bachelor trios, quartets or larger groups.

Thanks for the explanation!

 

[Mrs Tiggy Winkle]

If you're interested, I could try and speak to my local rescue or somebody local who is very experienced with boar groups and see if they have any advice beyond

@Lunar_Creature Now that @Wiebke has fully explained the difference between vet training re. guineas in English vs. German-speaking countries, the meaning of that for boar threesomes and foursomes has finally trickled down into my brain So I won't speak to my local rescue after all because they probably wouldn't be able to give me any more info than Wiebke, in fact probably less. Boar groups are obviously possible in Germany because there are so many baby castrations. Baby castrations don't exist in the English-speaking world so bonding boars is much harder and trickier and a twosome really the only thing you can do. If by any chance baby castrations exist in Iceland, then things could work out among your 3 boars, but otherwise follow Wiebke and @Piggies&buns on this.

 

[Mrs Tiggy Winkle]

Sorry for the hijack Lunar_Creature

@Truffolo On another thread you commented to me: It's interesting that in some countries neutering is done early and possibly more routinely than in the UK. Did you find that the boars you had neutered recovered quickly? Also we're they more compatible with other neutered males - if you had pairs of boars or knew of boars paired up?
I'm finally getting back to it. Some of the reasons behind differences in age of neutering is on this thread. I think especially the following quotation explains it really well.

Early neutering prevents the huge testosterone spikes that come with the descent of the testicles and the teenage hormones, which makes a huge difference in terms of socialising. They are more like old boars when the testosterone production has petered out (over 4-5 years) and they are much more mellow and happy to have companionship than dominance - not that all old boys want to be with others but those that do can live in bachelor trios, quartets or larger groups.

As for my own experiences, I'll write that on my own thread My guineas