Chronic Bloat Care?

[Piggy mum]

Hi
My guinea pig Pinky has had bloat on and off since Christmas time. The vet has kept him on ranitidine as a long term medication twice a day, and it works very well to keep his guts moving- if he doesn’t have it for a day he starts to bloat up again!
My concern is regarding his diet. When he was first poorly I was feeding him critical care to support, but discovered this was making the bloat worse, and found that anything with grains in it makes him feel really unwell.
So I have been feeding him grainless pellets and hay only every day, and this seems to be okay. I try to feed him veggies like pepper but he bloats up if I give them daily, so am only giving him these as a treat. He is taking ProC probiotic twice a day mixed with some water and just pellets and hay... I’m just worried that this isn’t a sustainable diet for him and that he may not be getting all the vitamins he needs even with the ProC. Any suggestions would be really helpful- he loves veggies so much but his tummy just can’t tolerate them!

 

[Wiebke]

Hi
My guinea pig Pinky has had bloat on and off since Christmas time. The vet has kept him on ranitidine as a long term medication twice a day, and it works very well to keep his guts moving- if he doesn’t have it for a day he starts to bloat up again!
My concern is regarding his diet. When he was first poorly I was feeding him critical care to support, but discovered this was making the bloat worse, and found that anything with grains in it makes him feel really unwell.
So I have been feeding him grainless pellets and hay only every day, and this seems to be okay. I try to feed him veggies like pepper but he bloats up if I give them daily, so am only giving him these as a treat. He is taking ProC probiotic twice a day mixed with some water and just pellets and hay... I’m just worried that this isn’t a sustainable diet for him and that he may not be getting all the vitamins he needs even with the ProC. Any suggestions would be really helpful- he loves veggies so much but his tummy just can’t tolerate them!

Would your vet also consider giving additionally emeprid and if necessary metacam? Emeprid is a gut stimulant that works on a different part of the digestive tract than zantac; it is now usually given in combination with zantac for digestive problems. Metacam is a mild anti-inflammatory as well as a painkiller.
My Pili Pala is on these drugs for the rest of her life after she's been diagnosed with IBS) irritable bowel syndrome. She also suffered from bloating episodes as well as a thickening of her lower bowel (for which she is getting cisapride which is easing he latter).
I have also found with other elderly sows of mine that developed mild but regular bloating issues that gripe water could help to break up the gas.

You are already doing a good deal by cutting out any grain. I would recommend to consider starting veg with a little fresh herb like coriander/cilantro - they pack a fair bit of vitamin C, trace elements and minerals in a small quantity. If it works, you may consider switching around with different varieties.
Generally probiotics and pellets are reinforced with vitamin C; most people are not aware that grass (and therefore hay) also contains some. But you can supplement with vitamin C.

It may be worth seeing whether a course of fibreplex may help somewhat with the tender digestion in lieu of the probiotic. I and other members have made good experiences with it where normal probiotics wouldn't do the trick with an iffy digestion. Probiotics, Recovery Foods And Vitamin C: Overview With Product Links

 

[rome_italy]

it is not that rare bloating with flour... I know more than one pet (and a lot of humans! me, too) who solved the trouble of bloating just cutting off the grainsfrom the diet or just avoiding the mix GRAINS+SUGARS (for example bread and jam; bread and fruits, etc).
As bell peppers have a lot of sugars, too, they can cause bloating if mixed with some pellets for example.
About the grass, it has wonderful nutricional values and a lot of vit C. As much as bell peppers according to this chart (which regards wheat grass) and other charts you can find online:
wheat grass Nutrition Facts & Calories
My piggies eat a lot of fresh grass (almost no vegs and some pieces of pellets only as a treat); I prefer giving them a light supplement of vit C in drops (I give them 12mg a day only; the daily recommended dose should be 20-30mg/kg), but it is probably not necessary and maybe it is only a waste of money. I do that because my grass is stored into the fridge for 2-3 days sometimes and vit C disappears easily with storage and exposure to the light, air, home temperature, etc.
When (and if ) you want to try the effect of the grass, give your piggies ONLY grass for that day. No vegs and very few pellets; you will see what will happen. Sometimes the mix is the cause of weird effects and it is even difficult to discover the culprit sometimes.
Last year I adopted a young sow who had had some bloating issues at the rescue, but following this diet she has never had other episodes (in the last year). I could hear some "noises" into her belly when I had the snow here in Rome and no grass was available, hence the diet was a little different. She had no appetite and her belly made some noises. (But there are piggies who bloat eating the grass).

If you want to go on with vit C, instead of buying products for pets, buy at the chemist's the drops for children whose flavour is very appreciated by the piggies; they are cheap and contain only vit C easily dosable (in very low doses too). In UK you have "Natures Aid-Vit C drops" which is cheaper than the Cebion drops the vets recommend here in Italy.

 

[DM030819]

How is he acting when bloated? I've unfortunately had a fair bit of experience with bloat, on one occasion it was fatal.

But I was even puzzled with the last pig who had it.

I'm used to pigs blowing up like balloons, going off food, being lazy and looking very uncomfortable. This guy was none of those, although the shape of his poops were effected.

So I think their behaviour and condition can have an effect.

I was doing the usual and giving gut med's, cutting out the offending veg (and all veg at one point).

But with his last episode I decided to just roll with it as he was still very happy physically. And I can say that he's been completely fine for a good 6 weeks at least now and he's eating a wider variery of veg too.

One of the discussions I had with the vet was about feeding veg to him. If we couldn't solve his problem then we were going to cut it out forever. She said that he would get plenty of Vitamin C in other ways, through his pellets and hay so lack of Vit C shouldn't be a problem if you have to cut out veg.

 

[Piggy mum]

How is he acting when bloated? I've unfortunately had a fair bit of experience with bloat, on one occasion it was fatal.

But I was even puzzled with the last pig who had it.

I'm used to pigs blowing up like balloons, going off food, being lazy and looking very uncomfortable. This guy was none of those, although the shape of his poops were effected.

So I think their behaviour and condition can have an effect.

I was doing the usual and giving gut med's, cutting out the offending veg (and all veg at one point).

But with his last episode I decided to just roll with it as he was still very happy physically. And I can say that he's been completely fine for a good 6 weeks at least now and he's eating a wider variery of veg too.

One of the discussions I had with the vet was about feeding veg to him. If we couldn't solve his problem then we were going to cut it out forever. She said that he would get plenty of Vitamin C in other ways, through his pellets and hay so lack of Vit C shouldn't be a problem if you have to cut out veg.

He tends to have a strange limp when he gets bloated and he sits around a lot, not wanting to walk very far at all. At first I thought the limping meant he’d hurt his feet somehow but when the vet checked his feet there were no issues but he was like a balloon! He tends not to blow up like a balloon because I catch it when I notice him limping, his tummy just gets very hard.

 

[Piggy mum]

Would your vet also consider giving additionally emeprid and if necessary metacam? Emeprid is a gut stimulant that works on a different part of the digestive tract than zantac; it is now usually given in combination with zantac for digestive problems. Metacam is a mild anti-inflammatory as well as a painkiller.
My Pili Pala is on these drugs for the rest of her life after she's been diagnosed with IBS) irritable bowel syndrome. She also suffered from bloating episodes as well as a thickening of her lower bowel (for which she is getting cisapride which is easing he latter).
I have also found with other elderly sows of mine that developed mild but regular bloating issues that gripe water could help to break up the gas.

You are already doing a good deal by cutting out any grain. I would recommend to consider starting veg with a little fresh herb like coriander/cilantro - they pack a fair bit of vitamin C, trace elements and minerals in a small quantity. If it works, you may consider switching around with different varieties.
Generally probiotics and pellets are reinforced with vitamin C; most people are not aware that grass (and therefore hay) also contains some. But you can supplement with vitamin C.

It may be worth seeing whether a course of fibreplex may help somewhat with the tender digestion in lieu of the probiotic. I and other members have made good experiences with it where normal probiotics wouldn't do the trick with an iffy digestion. Probiotics, Recovery Foods And Vitamin C: Overview With Product Links

When he had the acute bloat and was blowing up like a balloon he had metaclopramide, but the vet said as a long term medication she thinks the ranitidine would be better for him as she doesn’t think it’s his stomach that’s the issue but the lower part of his bowel? I do have metacam and give it to him at times when his tummy is very hard but I haven’t been using it all the time as he doesn’t always appear to be in pain. I was using fibreplex when he kept getting blown up like a balloon around Christmas but it was getting so expensive I thought I’d try ProC! Maybe like you say he needs something a little stronger every now and then!

 

[Wiebke]

When he had the acute bloat and was blowing up like a balloon he had metaclopramide, but the vet said as a long term medication she thinks the ranitidine would be better for him as she doesn’t think it’s his stomach that’s the issue but the lower part of his bowel? I do have metacam and give it to him at times when his tummy is very hard but I haven’t been using it all the time as he doesn’t always appear to be in pain. I was using fibreplex when he kept getting blown up like a balloon around Christmas but it was getting so expensive I thought I’d try ProC! Maybe like you say he needs something a little stronger every now and then!

If the problem is in the lower bowel, your vet may consider cisapride (which is an unlicensed medication, so you may need to sign a form) to see whether that is calming down the guts. It sounds rather similar to what my Pili Pala has got; unfortunately the most effective treatment for irritable bowel syndrome (IBS) are steroids, which are a strict no no for any rodents.

Emeprid and metoclopramide are not the same although they are both classed as gut stimulants. Metoclopramide is good for emptying the bowels quickly, but is not exactly helpful for tender guts.

 

[Piggy mum]

If the problem is in the lower bowel, you vet may consider cisapride (which is an unlicensed medication, so you may need to sign a form) to see whether that is calming down the guts. It sounds rather similar to what my Pili Pala has got; unfortunately the most effective treatment for irritable bowel syndrome (IBS) are steroids, which are a strict no no for any rodents.

Emeprid and metoclopramide are not the same although they are both classed as gut stimulants. Metoclopramide is good for emptying the bowels quickly, but is not exactly helpful for tender guts.

Thank you I’ll consider asking about that medication on his next vet visit. And I’ll give the coriander a go!

I don’t know if it’s anything significant but I notice that his poops tend to almost ‘sit’ at the entrance to his bottom (if you see what I mean!) and then he tends to do 4 or 5 poo at once, but they always look normal. whether this is an effect of the ranitidine I don’t know, but the cisapride sounds like a good option. It’s nice to know I’m not alone in this situation xx

 

[Wiebke]

Thank you I’ll consider asking about that medication on his next vet visit. And I’ll give the coriander a go!

I don’t know if it’s anything significant but I notice that his poops tend to almost ‘sit’ at the entrance to his bottom (if you see what I mean!) and then he tends to do 4 or 5 poo at once, but they always look normal. whether this is an effect of the ranitidine I don’t know, but the cisapride sounds like a good option. It’s nice to know I’m not alone in this situation xx

With Pili Pala just 0.1 ml of cisapride once daily is doing the trick (i can go up to 0.25 ml twice daily if she deteriorates), but she also has got twice daily 0.4 ml emeprid.

She is getting fibreplex only if necessary. I have not noticed any difference from the other probiotics.

The multiple poos are not uncommon in older boars when the bum muscles start to weaken. They are not worrying in themselves.