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Correct Septrin dose?

  • Thread starter Thread starter BigTigPig
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BigTigPig

Hi All,

Just wondered if you could tell me what this is? Tigger is currently on 0.2ml twice a day for her cystitis but I'm thinking it should maybe be more (but not sure if I'm getting confused with Baytril here?). She weighs just over 1kg if that matters.

TIA
 
I give my adults 0.5 ml twice daily and had that dose confirmed on here the first time I got my vets to prescribe it.
 
Thanks. Tigger is 3 so an adult. I guess if she is not having enough this could explain why she is not shifting this. She's fine in herself but the peeing and squeaking is still there.
 
The dose is down to the judgement of the vet to a certain extent. A bigger dose may not actually be better - it can cause the bacteria to detect that it is being attacked and turn into a spore, so the problem comes back later.
It may be that this bacteria is immune to septrin, or that the bacteria has been removed, but she still has an underlying bladder stone or crystal problem.

Also it is possible that the concentration of septrin is different from different suppliers.
 
The dose is down to the judgement of the vet to a certain extent. A bigger dose may not actually be better - it can cause the bacteria to detect that it is being attacked and turn into a spore, so the problem comes back later.
It may be that this bacteria is immune to septrin, or that the bacteria has been removed, but she still has an underlying bladder stone or crystal problem.

Also it is possible that the concentration of septrin is different from different suppliers.
 
Give Tigger as much to drink as she'll take - up to 50ml of unsweetened cranberry juice (Ocean Wave light is available in supermarkets) and/or water via syringe, as much as she'll take. I found that mine goes down better if it is half juice/half water. The more you can flush out of the bladder, the better!

Some probiotic will help counter the effects of the antibiotic on the guts.

Make sure she has an x-ray WITHOUT general anaesthetic (simply wrapping up the piggy in a towel and placing it on a soft surface will suffice) to check for bladder stones/sludge as a cause for the cystitis.

Here is a link to the best medical website for guinea pigs:
http://www.guinealynx.info/uti.html
 
" A bigger dose may not actually be better - it can cause the bacteria to detect that it is being attacked and turn into a spore, so the problem comes back later"

Your statement implies that the bacteria do not detect a smaller dose which kills them, but that they detect a larger dose for which they adopt a self-defence mechanism. It seems counter intuitive, can you elaborate further, please?
 
It is. A smaller dose will not kill all of the bacteria, so the survivors can develop a resistance to the drug, hence the instruction "Finish the course of treatment".
It seems as though the writer has got the information back to front.
 
also a baccilus cannot "turn into a spore" - spore's are produced as part of the reproductive cycle of fungi, not baccilus - baccili reproduce by asexual means - i.e. cellular division.

too high a dose #can# cause liver problems but its highly unlikely in an otherwise (than the cystitis) healthy adult pig.

I would ask your vet to reconfirm the dosage, mentioning that standard dose is 0.5mg - however as someone else already said it depends on the concentration of the solution - the package should confirm the w/w % in solution .

Tony
 
Thanks all. We took Tigger back to the vet this afternoon and they are going to take her in for another x-ray tomorrow (previous x-ray showed no stones just a bit of sludge). They reckon that if there is no improvement in her bladder sludge the best thing to do would be to operate. Would you agree, it seems a bit drastic and I'm nervous? I'll follow-up the septrin dose then too
 
I do not agree with the "let's have a look inside" approach.
It is far easier, simpler and safer to maintain a high fluid input to flush out any sludge than to operate.
 
I have to agree with AP. We reached the end of the line with Connie's bladder problems so I agreed for my vet to open her up (this was after she had x rays, constant medication and every other avenue had been explored). Connie died 5 days after her op. There is no evidence to suggest that this was the reason why Connie died as she was poorly for 5 months on and off but I would definitely advise you to only have this done as a last resort. Good luck xx
 
for any small animal a GA has a very high risk - absolutely a last resort - Mr Vet needs to realise that the QUICKEST way (i.e. cut her open and have a prod around) is not necessarily the BEST way to treat a problem like a UTI which is fairly long term, so time isnt so much an issue!

Not to slander said vet but the charges for surgery are generally a LOT higher than a few consultations . . .
 
One of my piggies has had long term bladder sludge/stone issues and at times has been on a large dose of Septrin (1ml twice daily) for up to a month at a time - Smudge coped well with this dose and never had an upset tummy. She has had small stones in the past which my vet managed to flush through without surgery - sorry can't remember what this procedure is called, maybe AP can help out? We have found that by increasing her fluid intake by syringing fluids daily, in addition to offering "wet" veggies helps to keep her bladder reasonably clear of sludge.

Good luck with Tigger, but I wouldn't rush to let your vet open her up.
 
BTP
I have just looked again at your first post, I would appreciate a more detailed history of the condition, please.
 
alcesterpigs said:
Your statement implies that the bacteria do not detect a smaller dose which kills them, but that they detect a larger dose for which they adopt a self-defence mechanism. It seems counter intuitive, can you elaborate further, please?
Click to expand...

Hmm, I have done a search and I can't find where I read that, so ignore it.
 
alcesterpigs said:
BTP
I have just looked again at your first post, I would appreciate a more detailed history of the condition, please.
Click to expand...

Um well Tigger first showed problems about 18 months ago when she peed blood for a few days, was x-rayed and her wee tested and it showed a few crystals though no stones.

This cleared up and we had no problems until about a month ago when she passed a small stone seemingly very easily. (Squeaked slightly for a couple of wees,the stone popped out, couple more blood wees and nothing more).

This has now flared up again although nothing has passed that I know of. She's been to the vet, been x-rayed which showed no stones and is currently on septrin (0.2ml twice a day) and metacam. I'm giving her cranberry and also made up some barley water for her. She's fine in herself until she tries to pee. Sometimes she can do a normal amount and others it's just a drop or two. Sometimes she squeaks sometimes she doesn't. Sometimes there's obvious blood other times there isn't. She's back to the vet later this morning for another x-ray and they say they want to open her up if it shows a stone which I will refuse as everyone on here seems to have backed up my gut instincts.

Thanks
 
It depends on the xray result but my thought is to put her on Rimadyl, a pain killer anti-inflammatory drug, for a week and then decide what to do.
 
UPDATE

Well she's had the x-ray but ended up having an argument with the vet nurse who didn't seem to get that we didn't want her operated on today just for a bit of sludge.

Anyway the results of the x-ray were not fantastic. She has two bladder stones and after being told after the last x-ray that there were no stones and just sludge but today seeing both sets of x-rays there was an obvious stone on the x-ray from 2 weeks ago that even I could see so I am not too happy. The stone has not moved in the two weeks since the last x-ray either.

I have her home for now but the vets are recommending operating sooner rather than later as her bladder will just get into a worse condition if we leave it and the stones still don't shift.

I don't know what to do. Are there any other avenues to explore? Am thinking of trying another vet, the recommended vets page gave one in Baldock... or does anyone know of any others in the Stevenage area?
 
The confirmed presence of a stone does narrow down treatment options, essentially you are looking at an operation.
Are you anywhere near Broxbourne?
 
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