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Dental Pig - Advice Needed

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PiggySweep

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Hi there, I am new to the forum but have been reading it regularly as a guest in the last few weeks. We had 2 male Guineas, but sadly one (Squeak) passed away about 3 weeks ago. We think he had a respiratory infection - he went very quickly. Our other piggy, Sooty, is a 4 year old male. He had lost a lot of weight and had been off hay for about 4 weeks. We took him to our (non-exotic) vets just after Squeak died. They said he had problem teeth but were more concerned with his weight loss so they put him on antibiotics for 1 week (thinking he had some sort of infection) and Oxbow Critical Care for syringe feeding. He weighed 660g then. After 1 week, Sooty's weight had fallen to 615g and he still wasn't eating hay, but was eating Critical Care hungrily. The vet put him on another antibiotic for a week but said we may have to have him put down. After things didn't seem to improve, we took Sooty to a vet recommended on this Forum (Seers Croft, Horsham, Sussex), last Thursday. They anaesthetised him to do his teeth. They said his molars were overgrown and that he also had 2 small ulcers on his cheek. They gave us Metacam, Zantac Syrup and Cisapride for 5 days, and eye drops and said to visit our local vets in 4 weeks to check his teeth again. (He advised this for convenience because we don't have a car so had to hire a car to take Sooty to Horsham). We live in Haywards Heath, West Sussex.

I have been syringe feeding Sooty about every 3 or 4 hours (including 1 night feed). He certainly seems livelier and wolfs down the Critical Care. He eats soft fresh food e.g. cucumber, apple, banana, blueberries - he loves them but we give them in moderation. He is not eating any harder veg e.g carrot, which he used to love. He seems to have forgotten or be unable to drink out of his water bottle, so he is always very thirsty. I syringe water mixed with probiotics at every feed and I make the Critical Care up with probiotics too. He has lost more weight, and weighs 560g before a feed / water and 610g after a feed / water. I have tried several varieties of hay to try to get him interested, but he still doesn't touch it. The last one I bought (Oxbow Timothy Hay) he seemed really interested in, but didn't eat it,just moved his teeth up & down on it lightly.

He is pooing and weeing, but his poos are not jelly bean shape, more like chocolate tic tacs! He does have a stale smelling breath, so I am thinking does he have oral thrush? Also, would the probitoic make the thrush worse? I stopped giving Metacam 5 days post op, but I have started him on it again, in case he does still have mouth ulcers

I am worried as there does not seem to be an end in sight and if he doesn't eat hay his teeth will just get worse. Also, we are going on holiday in 5 weeks and I am worried what I am going to do with Sooty - he was going to be looked after by my dad, but I can't expect him to give him the intensive care that i am giving him - it's wearing me out so I know my dad couldn't / wouldn't do it.

Does anyone have any suggestions please. He looks so skinny but is still lively for food and squeaking when he knows I'm there. Thank you!
 
Hi welcome to the forum.

I am tagging @furryfriends Excellent Adventure Sanctuary who is the best person to answer your question as she runs a dental sanctuary in Northampton and works closely with the most experienced dental vet in the country.

This is the website too www.teasnorthampton.co.uk

I'm so sorry you lost Squeak.

Also, I have just noticed you have no transport. Debbie can take pigs in for temporary boarding who need to see Simon (the vet), space depending. If Debbie was able to offer a space there is a group on Facebook called The Piggy Train which organises transport to Debbie or Simon.
 
Thank you @helen105281 . I have spoken to Debbie and to Cheryl (@Pebble) and Sooty is going to TEAS on Saturday. Cheryl has very kindly agreed to transport him. What amazing ladies both Debbie & Cheryl are.

Cheryl mentioned that you may have used Daktarin oral gel to treat piggy oral thrush. I am not sure whether Sooty has this - his breath does smell a little stale. Does it work & how would I use it? Thank you again.
 
I suggest you await Simon's prognosis ref the Daktarin anti-fungal oral gel

Keep him syringe-fed and watered....if it gets urgent ref weight drop/not eating then let me know
x
 
That's fantastic. I have used it in the past and in my opinion it is effective but you need a diagnosis first and Simon may prefer to use Itrafungol or Nystatin. Good luck.
 
Just a little update. Sooty is not yet with @furryfriends Excellent Adventure Sanctuary as the car broke down en route. He is with @Pebble who is syringe feeding him every 2 hours! @Pebble has been a star and took Sooty to Sears Croft vet today as she was very worried as Sooty wasn't eating anything, even by syringe. She got more medication for Sooty. His molars have grown again and have partially trapped his tongue which is why he is having trouble eating. @Pebble is trying very hard to get food into Sooty, so everyone please think positive thoughts for him. If he makes it (gulp) @Pebble will drive him to @furryfriends Excellent Adventure Sanctuary tomorrow and he has an appointment to see Simon first thing on Monday morning. Thank you all x
 
Well this little guy really had me worried sat morning. All I can say is, thank heavens we started him on an antibiotic friday evening (with telephone authorisation from the vet) .
Sooty's breathing improved dramatically throughout sat afternoon/evening as the antibiotic started to work. Fri night/sat morning he could only cope with 0.2ml per mouthful and trying to get even 5ml into him took 40mins - hence why he was receiving 2hourly feeds Also - the tramadol painkiller - whilst very effective - wassn't lasting long. So he is now on staggered dual pain relief - tramadol, then metacam 6hours later, then another dose of tramadol 6hours after that etc. Finally - yesterday afternoon during one feeding session - all the Pebble Piggies decided to wheek continuously throughout - as if egging him on to eat more!

As I write this, he is now able to take 0.5-0.;8ml per mouthful from the syringe and keep eating for longer periods. He's still not up to 20ml in one sitting - but we' have been getting 15ml plus 5ml carrot-flavoured water into him every 3hours through the night. His poos aren't good - but that's because his intake dropped over the last 24hours - however the gut meds and the increased food intake should now rectify this. Feeling a lot happier this morning - off for some kip!
x
 
Oh my goodness poor little thing! Well done Pebble for keeping him going, hopefully Simon & Debbie will get him sorted out tomorrow, good luck & hope he pulls through x
 
Yay - Sooty can now cope with a full 1ml of food per mouthful - albeit I have to be assertive and swap in carrot flavoured water every 3-4ml. He's just taken 20ml in 20 mins! Will wait to give him another feed before setting off for TEAS - this time in the trusty old pigmobile!
Weight yesterday morning at vets 550g. :help:

Weight at med time this morning 600g. :tu:

Weight after last feed 650g :)

Tiny poos atm but the main thing is he is still pooing regularly.

He is still very frail and hunched - but I'm hoping he's past the crisis point (which was clearly a developing URI) and will be strong enough for Simon to do his teeth tomorrow.
 
Very scary how quickly that came on. Glad he seems to be improving.
 
Thank you @Pebble! The heaviest I got him was 620g so I am over the moon that he's 650g! Did the teeth cause the URI? - sorry for my ignorance. As you know, he'd been on 2 different antibiotics, a week each, before he came to you. Thank you again. Give him a cuddle from me & Jess. xxxxx
 
Hi Popppy's mum
Yes it was - the new silver one not the trusty old blue Pigmobile (long story as to why I currently have two cars!)

I got as far as Crawley approx 7pm friday and red battery light came on which meant (according to the manual) don;t drive the car any further! Nevertheless. I tried limping the car carefully towards home but never got there as the dashboard went crazy with 8 miles to go (isteering and braking). I knew the mothership megastorm was approaching so found a parking area off the main road and parked up behind a suitable hedge for shelter from the gusts. Me and Sooty watched the storm clouds and lightning roll in - scariest thing ever!

I knew I needed to get Sooty back pronto for food and meds. Unfortunately my new breakdown and insurance warranty cover had a 30day grace period and didn;t come into effect until 27th July. (I therefore had to pay £160 before they'd even agree to recover the car). When I chased them and was told it would be 4hours, I got a friend to pick us up in the middle of the storm and abandoned the car until the following afternoon. We finally got home about 9.30pm

So yesterday, in between feeds, I had to get a taxi to the garage in TWells, pick up the blue car (unfixed), drive back, pick up Sooty and take him to the vets in Horsham before they closed. That afternoon I nipped out to the abandoned car to meet the recovery vehicle with the keys - only to find a tree blocking the main road and all traffic being turned back - so had to wait an extra 30mins before Recovery turned up!

Not been the best 48hours of my life - and first time ever a car has ever let me down with a piggie on board. Thankfully we are back in the trusty Pigmobile for today's trip!
 
It is not uncommon for a piggie with teeth problems to develop a sudden "opportunistic" URI. The bugs are carried by all piggies and only cause problems when the pig's immune system is lowered (eg weight loss/malnutrition from teeth problems). Unfortunately the swab cultures we have done over the years are showing an increasing number of these bugs now resistant to baytril (and marbocyl) and/or septrin. Doxycycline is now often chosen by my vets as first line antibiotic (which is what I got authorisation to give him friday night).

Just coming up to his next feed before leaving and he is still weighing in at 630g!
 
Good lord, you couldn't make stuff up like that.

Firstly, well done Pebble for your sheer guts to continue through the night feeding and doing above and beyond to help poor little Sooty, he is clearly in superb hands. I hope you get your cars fixed okay...I am never amazed at the lengths forum buddies go to in helping an ill piggy.

Good luck Sooty, you are in another safe pair of hands with Debbie and Simon. Come on Sooty, we are willing you on!
 
Sooty is here and has taken 20 mls of syringe food and is now getting settled in. He does look very frail, but he desperately wants to eat. Hopefully we can get to the bottom of his problems very soon.

Huge thanks to Cheryl for all she has done for this little man, and I am really hoping that he will soon turn a corner and begin his road to recovery.
 
PiggySweep said:
Phew! Didn't think he was going to make it @furryfriends Excellent Adventure Sanctuary as one point. Thank you again @Pebble for all you have done - we are forever indebted. Thank you too Debbie for taking him in x
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I have to admit that Sooty scared the hell out of me over friday night/early sat morning -. But actually I think everything happens for a reason.
With hindisght - in view of what was a developing URI, his having to come back to mine and getting the doxycycline into him friday night (rather than waiting for his appointment with Simon the following morning) might have saved his life! (BTW - his eyes are no longer encrusted with milky white cleaning fluid - although they are still rather sunken and squinty)

furryfriends Excellent Adventure Sanctuary said:
I've just got another 10 mls of syringe food into him. He's a very poorly piggy, but he has a lot of fight and determination, which should hopefully help get him through this xx
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That's great to hear Debbie - and it was good to see him comfortable enough after the journey to now eat more "solid" mush than the liquid gloop "wot I have had to give him to date".

I have to say I have rather fallen in love with this feisty little man over the last 48hours. He really is the most adorable soft-furred black aby - still inquisitive and so very keen to eat .

Good luck Sooty - all Pebble Piggy Paws crossed that this will be a very happy result!

x
 
What an incredible story so far! Massive well done and admiration for everyone involved in keeping this guy going. I really hope Simon works his usual magic x
 
Pebble said:
I have to admit that Sooty scared the hell out of me over friday night/early sat morning -. But actually I think everything happens for a reason.
With hindisght - in view of what was a developing URI, his having to come back to mine and getting the doxycycline into him friday night (rather than waiting for his appointment with Simon the following morning) might have saved his life! (BTW - his eyes are no longer encrusted with milky white cleaning fluid - although they are still rather sunken and squinty)



That's great to hear Debbie - and it was good to see him comfortable enough after the journey to now eat more "solid" mush than the liquid gloop "wot I have had to give him to date".

I have to say I have rather fallen in love with this feisty little man over the last 48hours. He really is the most adorable soft-furred black aby - still inquisitive and so very keen to eat .

Good luck Sooty - all Pebble Piggy Paws crossed that this will be a very happy result!

x
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I guess you can see now why I get so attached to all the special piggies who come through TEAS. I build such a close bond with them. xx
 
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