Discharge From Eye And Lethargic

[Kallasia]

I've taken Binky to the vets five times in 3 months now. He's been diagnosed with a chronic lung condition and been on a wide variety of medication. More info at bottom.

His eye symptoms are not new and he has had drops and lubricant for them.

Lately the discharge has increased and he's become quite lethargic normally he puts up a fight against his meds (hates the syringe) but last night he didn't even wriggle.
He's not been running around and he's not been eating as much too.
He has been drinking water though.

Is it time to go to the vets again? Though they don't seem able to cure him.

Or is it just time to stop and make him comfortable and prepare Errol for losing his brother?

Info:
Male (boar) not neutered
Albino, long haired
Rescue estimates 12-18 months but two different vets have said three to four years
Chronic lung condition - frequently has upper respiratory tract infections and lower respiratory tract infections. Lungs are always crackly and breathing is always laboured.
Discharge from nose dries grey around nose and on paws (from wiping)
Discharge from eyes is white and dries yellow. It makes his fur fall out.

I've tried different beddings but nothing worked. I've tried different hay and food but that didn't work. This makes me think it's not allergies.

 

[DM030819]

@Kallasia What medications has he had? And how long was the course? Maybe it wasn't the right medication, or he hasn't had it for long enough.

Speak to your vet about using a nebuliser. I used one for probably a year on my boar who had chest issues. He didn't have an infection but some days his breathing was quite crackly, or heavy. We used an antibacterial solution called F10 in it, and it really helped. You can also nebulise some medications, but I've not tried it myself. I have read that in case get into the infection better, as it's getting to the source, instead of going into the stomach

 

[Kallasia]

@Jaycey I'll enquire about the nebuliser, that sounds like it's worth a try.
I'm at work at the moment so I can't check the medication names, but he's has 3 different antibiotics, pre biotics, pro biotics, anti inflammatory, eye drops, eye lubricant, injections for his gut.
He's costing a fortune! Of course we love him to pieces and will find a way to pay.

 

[Wiebke]

Hi!

Please start topping up with syringe feed and water to keep his weight up asap if you aren't yet. In an emergency, mushed up pellets will do. Weigh daily at the same time to controll his food intake. Hay is making around 80% of the daily food intake, but it is the food group that is often dropped first and impossible to control. Both lung disease and antibiotics are appetite killers.
Complete Syringe Feeding Guide

Place a bowl of steaming water next to the cage to see whether that helps with the breathing.

You will need to speak to a vet as soon as you can. Lethargy is a red alarm symptom.

 

[Kallasia]

Hello, yes I've begun syringe feeding. I've been giving him Oxbow Critical Care. His hay intake has definitely decreased - he was a big eater and now he's barely touching it.
I shall try the bowl tonight - I assume it won't negatively impact Errol my healthy pig?

I'm going to call the vets on my lunch break. Debating taking him to a different vets in case they spot something this one hasn't. What do you think?

 

[Wiebke]

Hello, yes I've begun syringe feeding. I've been giving him Oxbow Critical Care. His hay intake has definitely decreased - he was a big eater and now he's barely touching it.
I shall try the bowl tonight - I assume it won't negatively impact Errol my healthy pig?

I'm going to call the vets on my lunch break. Debating taking him to a different vets in case they spot something this one hasn't. What do you think?

I cannot comment on your choice of vets, as I have no idea how competent yours is.
We have got a recommended vets locator on the top boar. Please be aware that there is only so much that even the best vets can do considering that guinea pigs are rather small animals and vet knowledge, although it has made great advances, is it still limites.

 

[Kallasia]

Quick update - I've been giving Binky Oxbow Critical Care daily and he seems slightly less lethargic now. He also seems to like the taste - normally he puts up a fight when being given things by syringe but he was quite happy with the critical care.
I've managed to find a specialist in exotic pets using the forum vet locator - we've got an appointment monday morning <3


Binky from his "good side"

 

[Wiebke]

Quick update - I've been giving Binky Oxbow Critical Care daily and he seems slightly less lethargic now. He also seems to like the taste - normally he puts up a fight when being given things by syringe but he was quite happy with the critical care.
I've managed to find a specialist in exotic pets using the forum vet locator - we've got an appointment monday morning <3

View attachment 64321
Binky from his "good side"

All the best! Please keep the regular feeding up; as often as necessary depending on how much you get into him in one go and depending on how much he is eating by himself/stabilising his weight.

 

[Kallasia]

This morning we had the appointment with the exotic pet specialist at Cheshire Pet. It's been a four hour round trip.
They think it's something serious, potentially a tumor in his lung.
We've been given F10 and told to buy a nebuliser.
We've been given metacam for pain relief, 1.5ml twice daily.
We've also been given two antibiotics in case there's any infection also.

I can't afford the £450 for x-rays of his chest to confirm the ulcer so I'm going to contact the PDSA and see if they can help. I'm not sure they will though.

I'm off to work now - could only get this morning off - and then tonight I'll start the pain relief etc.

I'm going to give them both so many cuddles <3


Looking sorry for themselves in the pet carrier

 

[Wiebke]

HUGS

I am ever so sorry for the bad news.

F10 is a disinfectant that also reliably kills fungal spores. It can be used safely for topical (surface) treatment, of which inhaling is one, in frail guinea pigs with advanced mites/fungal infections, abscess flushing etc. when diluted appropriately.

 

[DM030819]

Good luck with the F10 and nebuliser @Kallasia. It really helped my boar. He had breathing issues on and off for years and no matter of antibiotics or tests did anything. We thought it must have been down to his airways being compromised from an earlier infection. Having a blast in his nebuliser really helped.

I wasn't sure what to use as the container for the nebuliser to pump into, so I fashioned my own version using a plastic cat carrier covered in cling film. I'd poke a hole through it and stick the end of the nebuliser through. My vet used to laugh at it, saying he has a "rain mac" on for when he went to the vet as I was always too lazy to take the cling film off.

I do have some photos of the set up if you need any inspiration.

 

[Kallasia]

@Jaycey thanks some photos would actually be really helpful. I'm going to try and knock something together tomorrow as I have ordered a nebuliser on next day delivery so he can start as soon as possible.

 

[DM030819]

Here you go @Kallasia

I first wrapped the whole carrier in cling film, except for the door.

I then wrapped the door separately. It was easier this way as I could still put the door on and take it off without unwrapping it. I'd make a little hole and poke the end of the nebuliser through and prop it in place with a book.

But if he was having a really bad day and it needed to be sealed more I'd pop him inside with his dinner and then clingfilm over the whole door area.

He was a bit impatient and sometimes chewed the cling film so I had to make sure no straggly ends were inside the carrier.

 

[DM030819]

He did try to destroy the nebuliser by chewing through the pipe but I beat him by putting a bit of black tape round it. The parts were pretty easy to get hold of so I bought a new pipe eventually.

 

[Kallasia]

@Jaycey The nebuliser is arriving today and I've also picked up a similar carrier to yours. I was wondering, how long do you leave it on / him in it?
I'm worried about not doing it enough or doing it too much!

 

[Swissgreys]

@Jaycey I am constantly blown away by the creativity and dedication of people on this forum for their piggies.
That set up is amazing!

And @Kallasia it sounds like you are also one incredibly dedicated owner - your boy is very lucky to have you.
Good luck with the nebuliser.

 

[rome_italy]

Here you go @Kallasia

I first wrapped the whole carrier in cling film, except for the door.

I then wrapped the door separately. It was easier this way as I could still put the door on and take it off without unwrapping it. I'd make a little hole and poke the end of the nebuliser through and prop it in place with a book.

But if he was having a really bad day and it needed to be sealed more I'd pop him inside with his dinner and then clingfilm over the whole door area.

He was a bit impatient and sometimes chewed the cling film so I had to make sure no straggly ends were inside the carrier.

View attachment 64585

View attachment 64587

View attachment 64589

brilliant!!!

 

[DM030819]

Thanks @Swissgreys and @rome_italy . My vet thought it was hilarious when I took it in to show her. But it worked, so he had to be embarrassed about his waterproof carrier for his vet visits.

@Kallasia See what your vet thinks about times. I'm sure the F10 bottle doesn't say for very long. But as it isn't medicine my vet was happy to increase it. So he was in for 30mins at a time (any longer and he got angry about being in there, he was a very grumpy, opinionated boy). And on a really bad day he went on 3 times, but usually once or twice was enough.

 

[DM030819]

I think I started at 10 mins a go but it didn't really help, so we skipped to 20 mins. Then up to 30minutes. He had his breakfast or dinner in there so he wasn't bothered.

Does anyone remember Stars in their Eyes? Where the person says "And tonight Matthew I'm going to be..." then they would appear from out of the smoke dressed as a singer? It was like that some days when I opened the door when he was finished. Unfortunately he never came out dressed as Cher or someone.

I was a bit cautious at first about it going in his eyes but he had no issues what so ever.

There was an odd sneeze or snort afterwards but that was always a good thing as it usually cleared his nose better.

 

[Kallasia]

I think I started at 10 mins a go but it didn't really help, so we skipped to 20 mins. Then up to 30minutes. He had his breakfast or dinner in there so he wasn't bothered.

Does anyone remember Stars in their Eyes? Where the person says "And tonight Matthew I'm going to be..." then they would appear from out of the smoke dressed as a singer? It was like that some days when I opened the door when he was finished. Unfortunately he never came out dressed as Cher or someone.

I was a bit cautious at first about it going in his eyes but he had no issues what so ever.

There was an odd sneeze or snort afterwards but that was always a good thing as it usually cleared his nose better.

I think you'd be quite surprised if he did come out as Cher!

 

[Kallasia]

An update for you: metacam seems to be taking the edge off the pain which is good
Binky has just had his first nebuliser experience. He managed 15 minutes. I do think I nebulised myself more than him but hopefully it's fine in humans!
Here's hoping it helps him

I ended up using an upside down pigloo and cling film for the chamber.

 

[Kallasia]

So Binky has been on pain relief and antibiotics for almost two weeks now. He seems a little better, but it's hard to tell. What I have noticed is that since using F10 and a nebuliser (every day for 10-15mins for the past week) he's less crackly and wheezy. If nothing else it seems to be clearing his airways a little.
I've ended up investing in a cat-litter tray with a hood and flap - it's pretty much air-tight and easier than faffing with pigloos and clingfilm!

 

[DM030819]

Excellent news! Good idea with the cat litter box!

 

[Kallasia]

So Binky's new nebuliser chamber is up and running much less faffing for me and he prefers it as there's room to move around.

His health seems the same - pain relief taking the edge off things, antibiotics doing nothing but nebuliser helping breathe a little.

I wonder how long we continue the antibiotics for if there's no obvious positive impact.