Fighting herbs!

HumberHen

HumberHen

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Any ideas please. My 4 month old brother's Fennel and Thyme had a spat with a short fur ball fight and a lot of chasing and tooth chattering around 8.30am. No injuries found. There was plenty of food scattered so no obvious reason. I know they are teenagers! All day Thyme has contained Fennel in about a quarter of the run. There has been Plenty of food scattered so no food guarding. Both have eaten. Fennel is very cowed and obviously a bit anxious. I have a temporary divider if needed. Any thoughts greatly appreciated. I am worried something may kick off in the night. Thank you!
 
I’m sorry to hear this.

What you are describing sounds to have gone beyond dominance and I would be very concerned for their bond, I’m afraid. A fight and what sounds to be bullying (the fact fennel has been contained by thyme) usually means the bond is dysfunctional and possibly broken.
Hormones rising is a reason and that can bring about incompatibilities between them.

In this situation, you should separate them now.
Keep them apart for several few days to allow them to calm down.
You can decide to attempt a neutral territory reintroduction after they have been apart for several days. This will allow them to decide on the future of their bond.

If their bond is functioning, then they will go back together (although you while expect mild dominance - mild chasing and humping).

If during the reintroduction they fight again or if there is any tension or any bullying then sadly their bond has failed and a separation would need to be made permanent.

If during the days they are separated Fennel perks up and appears happier to be away, then that alone is unfortunately a sign of bullying and that the reintroduction is highly likely to fail. You can also decide to not attempt to reintroduce based purely on fennel’s reaction to being away.
Thyme’s behaviour during the separation is not your gauge of the situation - is he likely to be upset by it but you have to ignore the way he reacts to it. If thyme is doing the bullying and instigating the fighting then any insistence on getting back to fennel is usually just a desire to fight again

I’ve added a guide in below to help further

Bonds In Trouble
Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated Bonding Dynamics and Behaviours

Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
 
HumberHen said:
Thank you. It's been such a shock as it came out of nowhere. Fen so different from his usual cheeky chatty self
Click to expand...

Sadly that is how it happens.

The two boys I have left used to be a pair. One morning they had a fight completely out the blue. They were 18 weeks old at the time so right at the start of hormones. There had been no warning of any tensions prior to that morning. Their bond was immediately over (once a fight has happened sadly boars don’t usually go back together) and they have had to live separately ever since; they are just over 4 years old now and live happily as neighbours.

Keep us posted on how things go, and don’t forget it is Fennel’s reaction you watch during the separation - if he becomes happier then he may not want to be in with Thyme anymore.
And don’t be confused by behaviours such as laying together against the divider - that is not a friendly sign that they want each other. It’s actually territory marking and making sure the other stays away.
 
Good Morning! Thank you Piggies&Buns. Fen went into his pod overnight and no kerfuffles that I heard. This morning hey have both approached the bars. As soon as Tim moves forward making no sounds Fen reverses awkwardly into the corner teeth chattering.vThus seems to annoy Tim who does a speedy turn about. Strangely Tim is "chuck chucking" to himself as he eats
Forum advise is to leave it a bit longer to reintroduce. As they are in the inside pen I don't have an obvious neutral place apart from the bathroom floor!
 
Yes they still need longer apart - do not want to reintroduce them until at least Friday.

I would say, obviously we can only be guided by your wording, that fen’s reaction to thyme moving means he doesn’t want to be around him now.
I would be prepared that the reintroduction won’t be successful. Be prepared with oven gloves in case they fight when reintroduced.
As a general guide, once an actual furball fight has occurred, then reintroduction isn’t always advisable due to the risk that they immediately fight again.

If they can’t go back together then they will each require a minimum of a 3x2 c&c or 120x60cm cage.

The reintroduction has to be somewhere neutral.
If the bathroom floor is the only neutral place, then that will have to be.
 
Thank you. I could put them in two separate carriers and clean out the playpen thoroughly and reintroduce them there? It is in the hall and is the most accessible. I will wait until Friday. I have several options for housing. I think thT parallel with the ability to touch noses may be best? Happy to be guided by you. I have received so much support from the forum since I joined. Thank you all x
 
Yes you would have to make sure it is properly cleaned and doesn’t smell of either of them. Neutral territory is so important.

If they have to live separately permanently, then yes they have to be in completely side by side cages so they can see, hear and smell each other at all times
 
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