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Fluid Lumps - Help Please.

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Kkiselmo

Junior Guinea Pig
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Location
Victoria, Australia
Hey everyone. I was wondering if I could get some advice and opinions from some of you, as I have been having troubles with two of my piggies the last week. This post may be fairly long, but I need as much help as I can get.

On the 4th, I noticed my guinea pig Truffles wasn't looking too good. Truffles is a 4 year old female guinea pig, tricoloured and short-haired and I have had her for 3 years. She has had one litter of (3) pups (2 years ago) and has always been one of my favourite piggies, always healthy and friendly and very tame.

So on Monday, I noticed her tummy was appearing and feeling very bloated and squishy/fluidy, she was acting more quiet than usual, her droppings were very small and she was extremely hunched over. (I should also mention, she has lost 200g in the past year, presenting in a very thin bony feature now at around 770g.) But she is still eating excessively (I had her on the bench and she tried to get to the fruit bowl, then when I pull her away, she ate my porridge, then when I took that away she started eating paper) and excessively drinking. Though when I give her food, she will eat ravenously at it and half way through get bored until I gave her a different type of food. She still seems fairly happy, friendly (more friendly than usual).

We took her to our local vet, who treat my guinea pigs fairly often, but since the cost for an x-ray was too expensive and they couldn't find the problem with her, they said we should try a vet with a better expertise in guinea pigs.

Eventually we got in to a vet, around about 2 hours away from where I live, and they offered to see her Tuesday afternoon, have her stay overnight, and get the guinea pig expert vets to take a look at her the following morning.
With an ultrasound taken, and a blood test, they gave us the results.

"The ultrasound showed enlarged kidneys and excess free fluid in the abdomen. A sample of this fluid shoed it contained inflammatory cells (that typically indicate migrating parasites).
A common cause of kidney enlargement is stones in the kidney, bladder or uterus, but there were no stones. The other possible causes are acute kidney failure or infection (pyelonephritis). There were no inflammatory cells in the urine, but there was occasional bacteria and high protein (indicating kidney failure, which is reversible if I get her to continue to gain weight through high-protein foods)."

They have prescribed some medication for her, including Metronidazole (for the low bacteria count - I believe it is meant to help with the inflammatory and fluid in her abdomen too), Temgesic pain relief and Fenbendazole (for possible parasites and worms - I am to give this to all 8 of my guinea pigs).
If they do have parasites, they apparently may have come from my dog (according to the vet). At first, I was skeptic, but now I see how that may have been possible. Our family dog (a labrador) gets into the guinea pig food alot (mostly the grain and pellets in their bowls) so if she was eating it from the bowl, I see how it could have passed on the parasites.

But now, a few days back, I noticed my guinea pig Sundae (Female, 6 years old, long-haired, have had her for 5.5 years and she has always been quite healthy) was showing similar signs to Truffles. I found a large lump under her neck, between her front legs. I didn't notice it fully until I got Truffles home from the vet Wednesday night. I thought, when I felt it previously, that it was just my imagination or a fatty lump. Her tummy was also feeling funny but I thought she was just fat.

But now, the lump has grown majorly (it is not a fatty lump, they do not grow that quickly, I am sure. It feels very fluidy) and her tummy is feeling fluidy too, but it's still firmer than Truffles abdomen. And now I think Truffles may be getting a similar lump under her neck.

We have spent over $800AUD on vet fees so far. I don't have money as I don't have a job currently, and my parents don't want to spend much more. I have a vet appointment booked for this Monday coming (11th) to check what is in the lump, but I am still stressed about both their wellbeing. I don't know who is worse at the moment, but I am giving them both their medication (none of the parasite antibiotics for Truffles until she finishes her bacteria medication doses) and plenty of food, and I have separated them form the rest of the girls.
Sundae is very hungry and fairly thirsty, and also more friendly than usual, like Truffles. She doesn't seem to be in pain and she seems oblivious to the fact she is sick. She seems fairly happy. I also noticed today, her privates are crusting up and they feel hardened. I'll go look that up now, but thought I should add it.
They are going well, but there have been no drastic changes yet (I have only been able to start their medication tonight).

I'll keep you guys updated, in the comments section i guess, and I'll attach some pics of their underbellies (they don't like it when I put them on their back, so the photos aren't the best, so sorry.) But if you have read this far, thank you so so much, it means alot to me that people are willing to help, or simply read and sympathise at this difficult time. Thank you everyone <3

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The fact u have this problem with 2 pigs now suggest some form of parasite as mentioned or a toxicity. The excess fluid should be able to go down if given low dose diuretics- was this sugested to you?

When first reading through your post, i thought kidney failure.. But normally the kidneys shrink if its chronic (age related disease) which is why your vet is thinking theres a primary cause.

Has the liver been checked? This can also cause free fluid, and causing enlarged kidneys due to the overflow of fluid needing processed. Again, due to it now being a 2 pig problem, its more than likely a parasite or toxicity than chronic disease.

What do they eat? Have they been given anything new recently- rare plants, wild plants, potatoes, onions.. Anything they shouldnt have? Whats their pellets consisting of?

It sounds like a tricky issue to diagnose. But your vet sounds like they are investigating thoroughly. I hope they respond to the antiparasitic treatment soon and at least then u have a diagnosis. Hopefully any damage can be reversed x
 
I have nothing really helpful to add except to say I am thinking of you and hope it gets sorted quickly.
It sounds like the vets do know what they are doing, and you have done everything possible to try and get the problem sorted.
Fingers crossed that Monday goes well.
 
The fact you have this problem with 2 pigs now suggest some form of parasite as mentioned or a toxicity. The excess fluid should be able to go down if given low dose diuretics- was this sugested to you?

When first reading through your post, i thought kidney failure.. But normally the kidneys shrink if its chronic (age related disease) which is why your vet is thinking theres a primary cause.

Has the liver been checked? This can also cause free fluid, and causing enlarged kidneys due to the overflow of fluid needing processed. Again, due to it now being a 2 pig problem, its more than likely a parasite or toxicity than chronic disease.

What do they eat? Have they been given anything new recently- rare plants, wild plants, potatoes, onions.. Anything they shouldnt have? Whats their pellets consisting of?

It sounds like a tricky issue to diagnose. But your vet sounds like they are investigating thoroughly. I hope they respond to the antiparasitic treatment soon and at least then you have a diagnosis. Hopefully any damage can be reversed x
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Hi Adelle, thank you for your reply. I doubt they have a form of toxicity - I haven't introduced any new food to them in recent weeks and according to symptoms online, it doesn't look like they are showing any (dip in temperature, loss of appetite etc.), but I will be sure to mention this theory when i next talk (go) to the vet, thank you for that :) They also have not prescribed any form of medication to get rid of the excess fluids so i will ask them about the diuretics and see what they think.

Liver was not thoroughly checked, but I am sure they would have if it showed abnormal on the ultrasound. But I agree, it seems more likely they have may have parasites or a possible toxicity.
Their main diet consists of grazing/fresh grass, all throughout the day and given to them at night. They are given fruit and vegetable scraps sometimes, including broccoli + cauliflower scraps, orange, apple, carrot, strawberry, spinach and different lettuce types. They are also given grain (not on a schedule) which includes sunflower seeds, pellets, nibble o's, oats, wheat, chaff etc. I am mixing a few brands lately, but usually I would not have extra pellets and nibble o's in their grain.

I am currently working on, and organising a new diet for them. I've realised I need to add more fruit/vegetables and different forms of greenery. I need to schedule their grain intake too.
It's hard, because I have 6 girls usually in the same cage, and they are all different weights and ages, and cannot be seperated (not enough cages). Would you have any dietary tips for me?

Thank you so much for your help x
 
UPDATE:

Sundae is now basically the size of a small water bottle, and she feels exactly like one too. Her lump under her neck is huge but doesn't seem to be affecting her breathing or eating abilities.

Truffles definitely has a lump in the exact same spot Sundae does. Her bony form may be gaining a bit of weight, which is good. Her stomach is very fluidy still and may be getting a bit larger. Have an appointment at our local vet tomorrow, and depending on what they say, I may have to email our other vet.
 
Keep a very close eye on them- if anyone deteriorates u may need to see an emergency vet for diuretics to shift that fluid. The weight gain is probably fluid weight rather than normal weight i am afraid to say.

The fact both have this, it is likely it is something thay have picked up as i said rather than a general illness. Guinea pigs shouldnt have seeds etc, infact most people feed a grain free diet as it has its health benefits. A decent guinea pig pellet fortified with vitamin c is all the dry pellet they need. Grass shouldnt be given constantly- some pigs are used to eating more than ithers which I'm sure yours must be, but good quality timothy hay should be available 24/7 and should make up 80% of the diet at least.

Have u treated your grass lately? Any pesticides or fertilisers? Do you have slugs or snails? This is all the kind of stuff that may help u find your issue. Things like lungworm, hookworm and heartworm can be picked up from garden insects.

Infact it may be worth having both their hearts checked.. Heart worm causes the heart to enlarge, and sometimes fluid collection. The kidneys could be large due to trying to process all of this excess fluid. Heartworm needs a seperate wormed to a general wormer depending on the brand. Obviously I'm not a vet but this could well be a possibility and certainly does no harm in mentioning it.

I really hope the vet gets to the bottom of this soon, must be terrible for you all x
 
I hope that you vet can get to the bottom of this quickly. As both have it, it must be either infectious or environmental.

What a worrying time for you!
 
UPDATE:
Both Sundae and Truffles are still alive. They are taking their bacteria and parasite medication prescribed. But there has been no major improvement, yet no major deterioration. They are still holding major fluid amounts.

Sundae is huge, she is 1.2kg+ and is feeling like a hot water bottle (very fluidy, but firm at the same time and extremely large) and a huge fluid lump under the neck. Still eating (less than before though) and drinking, pooping alot, crusty eyes, nose and private area. Very smelly and wet, and messy (Will be giving them a bath tomorrow) but her eyes are still bright. Has alot of discomfort and doesn't like moving alot. I don't know if she is having trouble breathing or not. She will not eat any of the high-protein food given by the vet, but will eat other food.

Truffles is still hunched over (more than she was previous) her fluidy stomach is favouring her left side and she seems to be in massive discomfort, but still likes cuddles and pats (only showing a bit of pain-squeaking wise), she isn't getting much fatter and won't eat much of the protein mush the vet gave. She squints her eyes and is disorientated. I put her back in her cage and she veered off majorly to the left before snuggling in with Sundae (they won't part with each other very much). Her hunchiness is noticeably her trying to keep her belly from touching the ground too. She seems very very quiet and out of it. Her lump under her chin is bigger too.

Thinking maybe it is a toxicity. We had sugar cane mulch in their cages for a while, so maybe they ate that, or/and they got their teeth on something else that is toxic to them (We are looking after friend's guinea pigs at the moment and they brought sugar cane mulch to use for bedding, so I mixed it in with the usual straw for all the cages. Though I don't see how the other guinea pigs aren't sick if this is the reason). Not sure, but I will keep posting updates. I am sick with worry lately, highly strung and exhausted. Does anyone have any tips during this time on care for them, or how I can stop worrying so much about them?

Thanks all for the help <3
Please continue to keep my piggies in your thoughts.
 
It may be time to get a second opinion- the hunched piggy doesnt sound in a good way whatsoever.

Diuretics should be a must considering the extent of odeoma the pigs have- i would 100% push for these to be prescribed. They wont treat the cause but will ease the symptoms and should make the worse of piggy much more comfortable.

Your vet seems to have been very thorough, but as they still dont have a diagnosis you need to try and source another piggy knowledgable vet and have them investigate this illness. Be sure to mention ANYTHING you can think off that may trigger a line of investigation with your vet, including the sugar mulch.

The piggy with the severe abdominal fluid and the disorientation, in my opinion, sounds like she is deteriorating and is possibly facing a life threatening volume of fluid collection.

Please have them seen by a vet today- if you cant see a new vet, at the very least see your old vet and push for diuretics. The hunched piggy sounds like she is struggling.

I really pray they can get over this, but they need a diagnosis asap.
 
It may be time to get a second opinion- the hunched piggy doesnt sound in a good way whatsoever.

Diuretics should be a must considering the extent of odeoma the pigs have- i would 100% push for these to be prescribed. They wont treat the cause but will ease the symptoms and should make the worse of piggy much more comfortable.

Your vet seems to have been very thorough, but as they still dont have a diagnosis you need to try and source another piggy knowledgable vet and have them investigate this illness. Be sure to mention ANYTHING you can think off that may trigger a line of investigation with your vet, including the sugar mulch.

The piggy with the severe abdominal fluid and the disorientation, in my opinion, sounds like she is deteriorating and is possibly facing a life threatening volume of fluid collection.

Please have them seen by a vet today- if you cant see a new vet, at the very least see your old vet and push for diuretics. The hunched piggy sounds like she is struggling.

I really pray they can get over this, but they need a diagnosis asap.
Truffles Has passed. I will take Sundae to the vet and push for the medicated you described.
Thank you for the good thoughts and the help
 
I'm so sorry she didn't make it. You really pushed to save her and I followed your thread hoping for the best. I hope Sundae makes a turn around soon. Sorry your girls went through this. :(
 
Truffles Has passed. I will take Sundae to the vet and push for the medicated you described.
Thank you for the good thoughts and the help

I am ever so sorry you are going through this. Push for the diuretics and try and seek a second opinion on this.

Again, i am so sorry.

Sleep tight truffles x
 
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