Gradual weight loss despite healthy appetite

[Jon880]

One of my guinea pigs, Apricot, has gradually lost a significant amount of weight over the summer - around 150g - despite seemingly having a good appetite and being as active as normal.

I took her to the vet yesterday who told me her teeth and heartbeat were fine and he couldn't feel any bodily abnormalities apart from a sebaceous cyst we're already managing with F10 barrier cream. He suspects arthritis and our local piggie rescue lady / expert suspects ageing (Apricot will be four next month). Do these sound like credible explanations?

Apricot and her herd mates have a large C&C cage, constant access to abundant hay, fresh water, and a carefully controlled amount of daily veggies. They even have an air purifier in their room, so they're well looked after.

 

[Piggies&buns]

I’m sorry to hear of her weight loss.

Yes ageing could well be the reason.
If she has arthritis then a dose of Metacam would be the usual course of action to help pick her up and hopefully boost her.
Making sure she is warm enough can also help. Adding a snugglesafe (if you don’t already) can help an older piggy.
Older piggies do lose mass as they age and instead maintain their weight at a new lower normal.

I give my oldies some dried forage and a few porridge oats as an extra calorie boost once a day (I don’t feed mine pellets though).

 

[Wiebke]

One of my guinea pigs, Apricot, has gradually lost a significant amount of weight over the summer - around 150g - despite seemingly having a good appetite and being as active as normal.

I took her to the vet yesterday who told me her teeth and heartbeat were fine and he couldn't feel any bodily abnormalities apart from a sebaceous cyst we're already managing with F10 barrier cream. He suspects arthritis and our local piggie rescue lady / expert suspects ageing (Apricot will be four next month). Do these sound like credible explanations?

Apricot and her herd mates have a large C&C cage, constant access to abundant hay, fresh water, and a carefully controlled amount of daily veggies. They even have an air purifier in their room, so they're well looked after.

Hi

Older piggies do lose weight gradually. It can be an underlying, developing issue but also a slowing metabolism/the organs no longer working as efficiently.

Has your vet prescribed a painkiller for the arthritis to see whether there is a potential pain issue that is suppressing the appetite?

Caring for Older Piggies and Facing the End - A practical and supportive information collection

 

[Jon880]

Hi

Older piggies do lose weight gradually. It can be an underlying, developing issue but also a slowing metabolism/the organs no longer working as efficiently.

Has your vet prescribed a painkiller for the arthritis to see whether there is a potential pain issue that is suppressing the appetite?

Caring for Older Piggies and Facing the End - A practical and supportive information collection

Yes we're doing a week or so of metacam and will take her back for a review and weigh in at that point.

The mystery is that she still seems to be eating well, so I can't understand the weight loss.

We have another piggie who's a year older than Apricot and is still - for the time being - pretty chunky.

 

[Wiebke]

Yes we're doing a week or so of metacam and will take her back for a review and weigh in at that point.

The mystery is that she still seems to be eating well, so I can't understand the weight loss.

We have another piggie who's a year older than Apricot and is still - for the time being - pretty chunky.

The problem is that what you cannot control by eye is the hay intake, which makes over three quarters of what a piggy eats in a day but it is generally the food group most affected by pain. Tucking into veg and pellets is not the same as tucking into their hay.

How much metacam and in what concentration (cat 0.5 mg/ml or do 1.5 mg/ml) has your vet prescribed? If the dose is on the cautious/cosmetic side, you won't see any change.
You will also have to consider that the source of any pain may not be arthritis but another developing issue. Right now, your vet has as little idea what could be going on as you. Have they checked the mouth/teeth?

I cannot quantify the weight loss, so you will have to judge for yourself whether the weight loss is significant enough to offer extra top up feed.
This guide here discusses how to judge any weight loss for your individual piggy for any size and age (not just the average) and when to step in with which level of support feed. You may find it helpful: Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support

 

[Jon880]

The problem is that what you cannot control by eye is the hay intake, which makes over three quarters of what a piggy eats in a day but it is generally the food group most affected by pain. Tucking into veg and pellets is not the same as tucking into their hay.

The guinea pigs live in our kitchen diner, so I have a good line of sight to what they're eating quite a lot of the time (I work from home).

As I type this Apricot is tucking into the hay with gusto- she was the first one to wake up when I added a new batch.

How much metacam and in what concentration (cat 0.5 mg/ml or do 1.5 mg/ml) has your vet prescribed? If the dose is on the cautious/cosmetic side, you won't see any change.

He's prescribed an initial dose of 0.42ml followed by a maintenance dose of 0.21ml.

You will also have to consider that the source of any pain may not be arthritis but another developing issue. Right now, your vet has as little idea what could be going on as you. Have they checked the mouth/teeth?

Yes he was happy with her dental condition.

I cannot quantify the weight loss, so you will have to judge for yourself whether the weight loss is significant enough to offer extra top up feed.
This guide here discusses how to judge any weight loss for your individual piggy for any size and age (not just the average) and when to step in with which level of support feed. You may find it helpful: Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support

 

[Piggies&buns]

Even being able to see them eat hay you still don’t know they’re actually taking in enough: we see it many times, piggies sat seemingly eating hay but their weight dropping - hence why the weight checks need to be done by yourself at home on a daily basis so you know whether you need to step in wirh support feeding before the week is up

 

[Wiebke]

The guinea pigs live in our kitchen diner, so I have a good line of sight to what they're eating quite a lot of the time (I work from home).

As I type this Apricot is tucking into the hay with gusto- she was the first one to wake up when I added a new batch.



He's prescribed an initial dose of 0.42ml followed by a maintenance dose of 0.21ml.



Yes he was happy with her dental condition.

Is that cat or dog metacam (see my first post for the concentration; dog metacam is three times stronger so it makes a difference) and is it once or twice a day?

 

[Jon880]

Is that cat or dog metacam (see my first post for the concentration; dog metacam is three times stronger so it makes a difference) and is it once or twice a day?

It's meloxicam for cats, 0.21ml per day after a first dose of 0.42ml.

 

[Wiebke]

It's meloxicam for cats, 0.21ml per day after a first dose of 0.42ml.

As expected, that is about as low a dosage as your veg can get away with, verging on the cosmetic with the halved dose. So please don't expect wonders.

Guinea pigs don't get kidney issues from metacam the way other species do and they also metabolise it differently, so they need significantly higher dosages to make an impact.

 

[Jon880]

Just a quick update on Apricot. I took her to the vets for a follow up this afternoon. Her weight has stabilised, thank God - in fact she's regained a little - so the vet suggested stopping the meloxicam and seeing how she gets on for a week or two.

 

[Jon880]

Just a quick update on Apricot. I took her to the vets for a follow up this afternoon. Her weight has stabilised, thank God - in fact she's regained a little - so the vet suggested stopping the meloxicam and seeing how she gets on for a week or two.

I'm sad to say that after appearing to stabilise in October, Apricot has now taken a turn for the worse.

Once she stopped taking meloxicam her weight loss resumed, again despite apparently normal eating and drinking behaviour. The vet scanned her this morning and detected a 2.7cm mass around the uterus (and potentially spread further) which is obviously the cause of all these problems.

So now we face a grim choice between palliative care or an invasive procedure the vet thinks may be ineffective and she probably wouldn't recover from anyway. It always takes the judgement of Solomon to work out what to do in these situations.

We've owned four pigs in total (three at present) and now it seems we're going to lose a second in her fourth year.

 

[piggieminder]

I'm sorry you are facing this it's just about the worst part of pet ownership and never gets easier. Whatever decision you make will it will be made with love so can't be wrong.
Sending you my very best wishes at a difficult time.

 

[weepweeps]

I’m so sorry for this diagnosis. Sending you hugs. I had a piggy with a suspected tumour. I opted for pain relief rather than operate. Whatever decision you make it will be made with love for Apricot at the heart of it.

 

[Jon880]

I’m so sorry for this diagnosis. Sending you hugs. I had a piggy with a suspected tumour. I opted for pain relief rather than operate. Whatever decision you make it will be made with love for Apricot at the heart of it.

Did your piggie pass away naturally while receiving pain relief, or did you have her PTS?

I'm wondering how long Apricot will be able to maintain a decent quality of life on pain relief, and when to make that fateful final journey to the vet. I'd rather do it before she starts to suffer, but equally I don't want to do it prematurely and deprive her of precious time.

 

[weepweeps]

Yes he passed away peacefully at home with me by his side.

I noticed he was having laboured breathing at midday so made an appointment at the vets for that evening. As I was getting his blanket ready in the carrier he took a few deep breaths and passed away. I don’t believe he was in any pain. I was pleased he went at home without the rush to the vets.

There is no right or wrong decision. As long as they have good pain medication and you are prepared to take them to the vets to help them over the bridge if needed.

He had come up to the bars for his breakfast meal. In my mind I said to myself as long as he’s willing to eat then that’s my sign he still has a quality of life. I hope that helps.

 

[Jon880]

Well, we've just received some good news - for now - about Apricot. Since the last vet visit, and following a week of Loxicom at 0.5ml/day, she's actually gained weight (and the tumour hasn't grown).

I do wonder sometimes whether most vets know what they're doing with the species. But I'll take that early Xmas present for now. At least we'll have Apricot for a bit longer than we might have expected.

 

[Wiebke]

Well, we've just received some good news - for now - about Apricot. Since the last vet visit, and following a week of Loxicom at 0.5ml/day, she's actually gained weight (and the tumour hasn't grown).

I do wonder sometimes whether most vets know what they're doing with the species. But I'll take that early Xmas present for now. At least we'll have Apricot for a bit longer than we might have expected.

That is wonderful news.

 

[weepweeps]

Brilliant news.