Guinea pigs lunging and puffing alot at each other

Wee Handsome Guinea Lads <3

Wee Handsome Guinea Lads <3

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Hi!

8 weeks ago I got two boars who are brothers, from the same litter and were bonded. They are coming up on 4 months old now which I know to be a hormonal stage, however they started their dominance from about a week or 2 after I got them.

Progressively it has gotten worse. They have gone from the normal dominance actions like rumble strutting, chasing and the occasional mounting to now lunging, puffing persistent humping and butt sniffing /chasing. The lunging and puffing has mostly been coming from Sven.

Sven seems to be the most dominant and he is slightly bigger than Axel but they are not far from being the same weight as I weigh them weekly. Both are gaining weight, however it's at a point now where Sven goes through long sessions of not leaving Axel alone and now Axel has had enough and has started lunging and puffing back. Its quite aggressive from both boys.
It's strange because when they get scared they hide together. They still eat together sometimes and they will share things too sometimes, so I think the bond is still there but I feel like it's slowly disappearing as the dominance is more and more.

I separated them on Monday, they are side by side with a tinted screen.
They can still see, hear and smell each other. They have even rumble strutted a couple of times through the screen. I noticed a cut under Axels chin and Sven had a little red dot (like a bruise) on his upper lip I presume both from the lunging. There are no bite marks, missing fur or other injuries.

So last night I decided I would take them out and place them in their play pen together to see how they get on, however right away they started the same behaviour and it progressively got worse again. Then it calmed down and they seemed to have settled in to being together so I decided to place them back together in their cage. When I took Sven out the play pen first, Axel was looking up at at me and watching me walk away with him and wheeking/tallking. This morning I have been awoken by them banging about in their cage due to lunging mounting and chasing. Axel seems to submit but is still raising his head as he is backing off which tells me that neither of them seem to want to back down and accept who is boss.

I have again separated them this morning but I'm scared I am doing more damage than good with the separation as I understand this resets the dominance behaviour again.

I've read a lot of these forums and realise that these behaviours can go on for months through the teenage period but I'm not sure if it's a personality thing or if it's normal.

I have extended their cage twice so they now have a 6x2 cage 84" x 28" (which is now split) originally it was a 4x2 cage. I have given them 2 of everything, water bottle, food bowl, hay sacks, toys, hideys and tunnels but they still insist on following each other to the same areas, sometimes they eat alone and sometimes they eat together. The hides have 2 entry points and easy ways to escape incase cornered. I use draped scarves and log tunnels for hide outs along with a fleece hidey which hangs down.

When separated things are calm and they don't seem fussed a lot of the time but I have noticed that when one gets taken out of the cage the other is looking over and chatting, sometimes wheeking.

Can anyone offer guidance as maybe there's something I'm not doing or could be doing better?

Thank you 🙂
 
Yes four months is when the hormones really start to hit. It’s normal to see a lot of dominance during this time (the teens last from 4 to 14 months of age). As babies they will be desperate to be together for companionship but even then seeing dominance is normal. Bringing them to a new home in itself (even as youngsters) will cause them to reestablish their relationship and set a hierarchy. Being brothers sadly does not make them any more likely to get on and unfortunately once they become teenagers, character incompatibilities can come to light and that can mean things dont work out.

If behaviours go beyond normal dominance, become aggressive and neither wants to back down to be submissive, then I am afraid that can most likely spell the end of their relationship and they would need to permanently live separated.

What is important is figuring out where their behaviours lie and giving them to opportunity to make a decision on whether they actually want to be together. You are right in separating and reintroducing will cause them to display dominance.
The puffing can mean they are pretty annoyed with each other. This guide explains dominance behaviours and rates them by severity - this may help you determine whether what you are seeing is getting beyond normal dominance
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs

Even as separated piggies, they can still be friends but just not able to live together, so looking for the other is not uncommon

The gudes below may also help further in explaining what you are seeing and helping you determine whether it is normal teen boar behaviour or if there is a problem starting.

Bonds In Trouble
A Comprehensive Guide to Guinea Pig Boars
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
 
Hi and welcome!

Sorry that teenage hormones have hit.

@Piggies&buns has said it all so well. Please take the time to read the links. You will find them very helpful with their practical and detailed information that looks at all aspects.
 
Hi all! Thanks for your replies and help.Would you say it's best to keep separating them and reintroducing them for now and then play it by ear until they are past the 14 month mark? Will the be helpful?
 
Nicola1990 said:
Hi all! Thanks for your replies and help.Would you say it's best to keep separating them and reintroducing them for now and then play it by ear until they are past the 14 month mark? Will the be helpful?
Click to expand...

No, I'm afraid you cant do this. Constant separation and reintroduction causes stress and in a bond which is teetering, doing so can cause it to fully break. Boars need to be either permanently together or permanently apart so you need to figure out whether you are seeing typical hormonal behaviour and that their relationship is functioning or whether things are actually more serious than that and is failing and make a final decision on where to go next - either leaving them together if they are ok or separating permanently if they are not. If the behaviour is constant and showing the signs in the orange ‘warning’ section of the dominance guide then I would be concerned that things are not brilliant between them Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs

Being over 14 months of age won’t change anything if they don’t like each other - if they don’t like each other now, then they will sadly never like each other going forward.
 
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Okay thanks for your guidance. I think I'll keep them separated for now and in a few days time try a bonding bath (I haven't tried this yet) as I want to exhaust all possibilities before permanently separating them. If this doesn't work then I will have to accept they aren't compatible with each other as I don't want to cause further distress. I still believe they are bonded as I've seen signs that they still are.

They are also due for a check up at the vet and will seek further guidance that way too.

Thanks again, it's much appreciated. Just want my boys to be happy 😞
 
Buddy baths are a bit of a myth and aren’t recommended. They can cause more problems due to the stress of them.
Unfortunately if a bond is failing then there is not much you can do - it’s down to the pigs whether they like each other
 
Thanks for the advice. Well my questions were officially answered by them last night. Axel managed to climb up on his tunnel, up on to the divider (c&c grid so he's clearly an acrobatic guinea pig) and leap into Svens cage. They had a really bad fight and injured each other quite sorely. So unfortunately they will stay separated. I think I have 2 Alpha piggies that aren't keen on each other. Such a shame 😔 cage has been made safe to prevent further occurrences but I'm sad they can't be best buds 😞
 
Gosh to the climbing antics! Determination! It's disappointing when things don't work out as planned, but I think that they are fortunate pigs to have someone who is patient and is doing the right thing by them.
 
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