Had a stone removed

[Mosey]

I've had this pig on a stone prevention diet since his first day home. I was devastated to find out that he had a stone. It's since been removed and he's bounced back remarkably for a 4 year old pig. I'm so very grateful for that. I've made some vet recommended changes and some of my own based on him specifically.

Oddly he's never had any deposits in his urine except for when he's eaten radicchio. This probably isn't the norm, but he'll never have it pass his lips on my watch again. I'm feeding him Oxbow garden select pellets. My exotic vet has strongly advised me not to go pelletless. He doesn't eat more than 2 tsps of these in a day. I feel if he can get a variety of balanced calcium phosphorus ratio vegetables several times a day, I don't see why I can't go pelletless. I do have a bit of an issue giving him certain vegetables because you're limited to low calcium phosphorus, and he's intolerant to some of those such as peppers. He eats lots of zucchini, grape or cherry tomatoes, cucumber, when in season corn husks and fresh grass. He gets a very small piece of honey dew mellon, half a grape, three bluberries or a sliver of apple maybe eight times a year. I've never seen deposits after he eats romaine, it sounds like it might be a good idea to cut that out. My vet said that romaine is great people who have stone pigs seem to say it's not. For now I'm cutting him to a teaspoon of pellets per day until I can find a way to broaden his variety of vegetables more without causing him bloat.

I unfortunately never realized how much calcium carbonate was in our local drinking water. I'm now only giving distilled water. He eats Oxbow orchard grass.

My vet told me that using a back massager would help stir up the crystals and prevent stones from forming. I found a vibrating back massaging ball that I set inside of a blanket and place a cat litter box with a pillow inside and set him in it. I was very pleased to see that he fell asleep in his vibrating bed. Hopefully it helps, but it certainly doesn't seem to bother him one bit.

I've made a few changes that I'm hoping dearly prevent any future stones. If anyone has experience with stone pigs and has any advice to alter what I'm doing I'd greatly appreciate it. I'll do absolutely anything to have the privilege to care for him for as long as I possibly can.

Thank you for reading my very long post and thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge and advice.

 

[VickiA]

I haven’t had any problems with stones and have reduced bladder issues since doing a combination of switching my piggies to grain free pellets, filtering their drinking water, and following the recommended diet detailed in this guide Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets. Have you checked if your pellets are grain free? I’m not familiar with them but suspect they may contain grain.

I don’t know the science behind the suggestion of vibration stirring up crystals, but the idea of making a little vibrating bed sounds interesting and it’s lovely to hear your little chap is happy in his special bed chamber.

Hope he remains trouble free.

 

[Mosey]

Thank you kindly for reading my long post and for your reply. I'm going to look into grain free guinea pig pellets that ship to Canada. I'm positive that Oxbow isn't grain free off the top of my head. The first 3 ingredients are all hays and that appealed to me. Unfortunately I know that they use calcium carbonate as their calcium source in all of their pellets and contain between 30% to 60%. This was the lowest calcium and sadly the "best food" that I have access to. I'm more than willing to change his pellets if I can find something better first him. I'll definitely look into the link you sent as well.

I'm very lucky that he's such a chilled out piggy. I don't know if many piggies would tolerate a "vibrating bed". It doesn't seem to hurt to try this.

I completely forgot to mention that I discussed doing an liquid oral dose of daily vitamin c and my vet said that she didn't like the sugars involved in that. She recommended I stick with my Oxbow vitamin c tabs. The tabs I'm currently giving him have cane molasses in them and doesn't state the sugar content. Cane molasses is most definitely sugar though. I've also been giving him an Oxbow urinary tablet daily for the past two years. This one doesn't contain calcium like the vitamin c tabs does. Do you have any thoughts on the liquid oral vitamin c? What do you prefer to use?

Thank you for the well wishes! I'm thrilled at how he's recovered since his surgery on Aug 1st.

 

[DMS260820]

Plenty of grass, filter or even double filtered water, grain free nuggets. And a few cucumber treats throughout the day is what I do to help lessen the chances of stones.

Oh and wetting any high calcium veg like kale, spinach etc before feeding

 

[Wiebke]

I've had this pig on a stone prevention diet since his first day home. I was devastated to find out that he had a stone. It's since been removed and he's bounced back remarkably for a 4 year old pig. I'm so very grateful for that. I've made some vet recommended changes and some of my own based on him specifically.

Oddly he's never had any deposits in his urine except for when he's eaten radicchio. This probably isn't the norm, but he'll never have it pass his lips on my watch again. I'm feeding him Oxbow garden select pellets. My exotic vet has strongly advised me not to go pelletless. He doesn't eat more than 2 tsps of these in a day. I feel if he can get a variety of balanced calcium phosphorus ratio vegetables several times a day, I don't see why I can't go pelletless. I do have a bit of an issue giving him certain vegetables because you're limited to low calcium phosphorus, and he's intolerant to some of those such as peppers. He eats lots of zucchini, grape or cherry tomatoes, cucumber, when in season corn husks and fresh grass. He gets a very small piece of honey dew mellon, half a grape, three bluberries or a sliver of apple maybe eight times a year. I've never seen deposits after he eats romaine, it sounds like it might be a good idea to cut that out. My vet said that romaine is great people who have stone pigs seem to say it's not. For now I'm cutting him to a teaspoon of pellets per day until I can find a way to broaden his variety of vegetables more without causing him bloat.

I unfortunately never realized how much calcium carbonate was in our local drinking water. I'm now only giving distilled water. He eats Oxbow orchard grass.

My vet told me that using a back massager would help stir up the crystals and prevent stones from forming. I found a vibrating back massaging ball that I set inside of a blanket and place a cat litter box with a pillow inside and set him in it. I was very pleased to see that he fell asleep in his vibrating bed. Hopefully it helps, but it certainly doesn't seem to bother him one bit.

I've made a few changes that I'm hoping dearly prevent any future stones. If anyone has experience with stone pigs and has any advice to alter what I'm doing I'd greatly appreciate it. I'll do absolutely anything to have the privilege to care for him for as long as I possibly can.

Thank you for reading my very long post and thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge and advice.

Hi!

I am very sorry. Sadly, many people concentrate only on the veg and not on the water and pellets, where often the majority of calcium is coming from, especially in a hard water country like the UK.
This comes into play especially if you have a guinea pig with a genetic disposition for stones or if at some point the complex calcium absorption process is going wrong for some reason. Natural non-drinkers are also at a higher risk because their bladder is flushed less often and less effectively - but you can't make a piggy drink that is not thirsty; overhydrating can be even more damaging.

A balanced low calcium diet can largely mitigate but cannot completely prevent the build-up of stones depending on what has caused the stone because it is only one factor amongst several. It takes time for the to rebalance especially if the calcium absorption process is not working as it should. But our diet tips do work for the long term. I haven't had any bladder stones for nearly 6 years; the last one was a hangover from my diet experimentation 7 years ago. My experience parallels that of other long term forum members.

Please don't overreact and cut out any calcium whatsoever - that is as harmful for long term health in its own way as too much calcium!
Filtering water or using low calcium bottled water is the best thing you can do in addition with feeding only the recommended 1 tablespoon of pellets (another change in diet recommendations over the last decade); you are cutting off the two largest contributors.
Please use low calcium water, but do NOT give distilled water to a guinea pig - it is harmful!

You can feed lettuce to bladder piggies if you wish to; it's more of an issue for piggies with interstitial cystitis where it can act as a trigger food for some piggies.
Otherwise the recommendations in our urinary tract diet hold for bladder stone piggies, too: no grain (including sweet corn and pellet components) and root veg; ideally no fruit or only a little as a special treat. Stay off any foods that are very high calcium but do not cut out any calcium altogether. A certain amount is needed by the body to function properly; minerals like magnesium (not present in pellets) are bound up with calcium and often vitamin C rich vegetables.

I have never heard of vibrating being used or recommended for bladder stones; that is a new one for me. Please let us know your longer term experiences with it!

But another measure that has stood the test of time is to protect the beleaguered bladder walls of guinea pigs with long term bladder issues (into which category stone piggies fall) with a glucosamine-based food supplement like cystease capsules for cats. This is to support the natural glucosamine coating of the bladder walls.

Here are our post-op care tips: Tips For Post-operative Care

 

[VickiA]

My bladder piggies also get glucosamine in the form of cystease. They actually seem to enjoy it.

 

[piggieminder]

My bladder piggies get a glucosamine supplement too. I've not heard of the vibrating but my vet did say to encourage them to exercise to keep sludge and crystals moving, not easy in elderly boars! She also advised syringing a few mls of extra water 2 or 3 times a week to flush the bladder. Filter water, avoid high calcium veg and only feed a table spoon of low calcium pellets daily. I do hope you can keep your piggie stone free. As well as having two 5 year old boars with bladder issues I've lost two young boars to mineralisation, it's so heart breaking.

 

[DMS260820]

What interesting is, I used to have 2 brother boars. Both fed very high calcium veg and high amounts of pellets. When I didn't know better. One got 3 bladder stones age 6. The other not even a sign of any bladder problems and lived to 7.

I do think it depends on the pig, which obviously we just cant tell

 

[Mosey]

Plenty of grass, filter or even double filtered water, grain free nuggets. And a few cucumber treats throughout the day is what I do to help lessen the chances of stones.

Oh and wetting any high calcium veg like kale, spinach etc before feeding

That's great, thank you. I wet all vegetables before giving them to him. I've never fed kale or spinich because of the calcium content. I can't seem to obtain grain free nuggets, but I'm looking into it still. I just purchased a water distiller and that should help too. Thank you very much! I appreciate you sharing your protocol.

 

[Wiebke]

That's great, thank you. I wet all vegetables before giving them to him. I've never fed kale or spinich because of the calcium content. I can't seem to obtain grain free nuggets, but I'm looking into it still. I just purchased a water distiller and that should help too. Thank you very much! I appreciate you sharing your protocol.

Check for bladder supplements for cats; that really make a difference for the bladder.

Grain-free pellets are not available everywhere; they are a fairly new phenomenon and not all taste that good that piggies want to eat them. 1 tablespoon of low calcium pellets per day will do as a fall-back alternative. You may have to do some research of the calcium percentages in your available brands.

 

[DMS260820]

That's great, thank you. I wet all vegetables before giving them to him. I've never fed kale or spinich because of the calcium content. I can't seem to obtain grain free nuggets, but I'm looking into it still. I just purchased a water distiller and that should help too. Thank you very much! I appreciate you sharing your protocol.

No problem at all. Its not proven to work at all. But it gives me. A peace of mind knowing I'm doing what I can to help prevent any future illnesses. But sometimes whatever you do, it depends on the pig.

Please excuse some of my spelling and what not, my phone is set to predictive. New phone lol

 

[Mosey]

Hi!

I am very sorry. Sadly, many people concentrate only on the veg and not on the water and pellets, where often the majority of calcium is coming from, especially in a hard water country like the UK.
This comes into play especially if you have a guinea pig with a genetic disposition for stones or if at some point the complex calcium absorption process is going wrong for some reason. Natural non-drinkers are also at a higher risk because their bladder is flushed less often and less effectively - but you can't make a piggy drink that is not thirsty; overhydrating can be even more damaging.

A balanced low calcium diet can largely mitigate but cannot completely prevent the build-up of stones depending on what has caused the stone because it is only one factor amongst several. It takes time for the to rebalance especially if the calcium absorption process is not working as it should. But our diet tips do work for the long term. I haven't had any bladder stones for nearly 6 years; the last one was a hangover from my diet experimentation 7 years ago. My experience parallels that of other long term forum members.

Please don't overreact and cut out any calcium whatsoever - that is as harmful for long term health in its own way as too much calcium!
Filtering water or using low calcium bottled water is the best thing you can do in addition with feeding only the recommended 1 tablespoon of pellets (another change in diet recommendations over the last decade); you are cutting off the two largest contributors.
Please use low calcium water, but do NOT give distilled water to a guinea pig - it is harmful!

You can feed lettuce to bladder piggies if you wish to; it's more of an issue for piggies with interstitial cystitis where it can act as a trigger food for some piggies.
Otherwise the recommendations in our urinary tract diet hold for bladder stone piggies, too: no grain (including sweet corn and pellet components) and root veg; ideally no fruit or only a little as a special treat. Stay off any foods that are very high calcium but do not cut out any calcium altogether. A certain amount is needed by the body to function properly; minerals like magnesium (not present in pellets) are bound up with calcium and often vitamin C rich vegetables.

I have never heard of vibrating being used or recommended for bladder stones; that is a new one for me. Please let us know your longer term experiences with it!

But another measure that has stood the test of time is to protect the beleaguered bladder walls of guinea pigs with long term bladder issues (into which category stone piggies fall) with a glucosamine-based food supplement like cystease capsules for cats. This is to support the natural glucosamine coating of the bladder walls.

Here are our post-op care tips: Tips For Post-operative Care

There is glucosamine in his urinary tablet I give him daily. That makes me feel good to know that it aids in preventing more than just arthritis. What is the reason that distilled water is so dangerous? I've been doing a mountain of research into this. I was totally against thus at first, but since I've looked into it more I feel differently.

 

[Wiebke]

There is glucosamine in his urinary tablet I give him daily. That makes me feel good to know that it aids in preventing more than just arthritis. What is the reason that distilled water is so dangerous? I've been doing a mountain of research into this. I was totally against thus at first, but since I've looked into it more I feel differently.

I can't lay hands on it, but I have read an article about this several years back, and it emphatically discouraged the use of it.

 

[Mosey]

My bladder piggies also get glucosamine in the form of cystease. They actually seem to enjoy it.

That's wonderful! I do give him glucosamine daily already. My vet also has him on potassium citrate two times daily. Thank you very much for the information.

 

[Mosey]

I can't lay hands on it, but I have read an article about this several years back, and it emphatically discouraged the use of it.

I totally understand as I felt the same way previous to doing some in depth research on distilled water. I've attached a link to the video that is part of the reason my mind has been changed towards distilled water. The music is loud in the beginning, but then stops. This truly is a real eye opening argument that is worth hearing for yourself.

 

[Mosey]

My bladder piggies get a glucosamine supplement too. I've not heard of the vibrating but my vet did say to encourage them to exercise to keep sludge and crystals moving, not easy in elderly boars! She also advised syringing a few mls of extra water 2 or 3 times a week to flush the bladder. Filter water, avoid high calcium veg and only feed a table spoon of low calcium pellets daily. I do hope you can keep your piggie stone free. As well as having two 5 year old boars with bladder issues I've lost two young boars to mineralisation, it's so heart breaking.

This all sounds good to me. That's pretty much what I'm going to be following as well. I'm happy to hear that you've had success following this regime. It gives me hope that I can hopefully prevent any future stones too. Thank you very much!

 

[Mosey]

Plenty of grass, filter or even double filtered water, grain free nuggets. And a few cucumber treats throughout the day is what I do to help lessen the chances of stones.

Oh and wetting any high calcium veg like kale, spinach etc before feeding

That's all good advice. Thank you!

 

[Mosey]

What interesting is, I used to have 2 brother boars. Both fed very high calcium veg and high amounts of pellets. When I didn't know better. One got 3 bladder stones age 6. The other not even a sign of any bladder problems and lived to 7.

I do think it depends on the pig, which obviously we just cant tell

That's so amazing. Even with the same genetics and diet. Thank you for sharing that interesting experience.