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Help! Can Anyone Help With How To Help A Dental Piggy To Get Back To Feeding.

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I usually sit mine on a towel on it but it is quite powerful so may work through a carrier.
 
Ok so I checked out what gut stims I have in the cupboard, my vet let me have some extra in case Petal ever has another "Episode". Bear in mind Petal is a giant guinea pig lol! She is 1.450g :) She was prescribed 0.4ml Zantac twice a day & Emeprid 0.7ml 3 times a day. When I gave the Zantac she also had to have the Emeprid at the same time. My vet said it didn't matter whether before food or after/during or leaving any gap, she just said give the dose of Zantac at the same time as the Emeprid. At the moment I would say using both together is important for Minky, hopefully Pebbles will confirm in what order etc is more beneficial soon, but in the meantime it ifs fine to give the 2 different types together as Zantac works on the hindgut & Emeprid on the foregut. Is she also on Metacam for pain as her tummy will be hurting her? Massage her tummy gently by hand & I also stimulated Petal to poop by gently wiping her bottom with a damp warm flannel, but don't make her sore. I feel this helped as she passed a lot of gas :eek: & my thought was it would mimic a mummy pig licking her baby's bottom to make it poop :roll:
Btw please don't give anymore Infacol or vegetable oils etc, only the Zantac Emeprid, Metacam & antibiotic x
 
The main point about medications in this quantity and of this nature/mix, albeit they are a necessity, is they need to be given during/after a feed so they go on a full stomach. Emeprid helps the stomach to empty....no need to delay starting it. Zantac will stimulate the hind gut but also because of its usual, more well known action in hoomans, will also help protect the stomach lining from other meds including metacam so if anything that should be first in line to be given.

I always line the stomach with 2-3ml of feed first before giving the meds.

You have all the meds required and are doing everything you possibly can. I have had a pig go for 48 hours without a single poo whilst on emeprid/metoclop and zantac before a sudden barrage of air-gun pellets being produced. They completely recovered.

Car journeys DO help....many the time I've been driving round the village at unearthly hours in the morning despite also having a massage pad. I'm not known as the "mad guinea pig woman" in my village for nothing!

x
 
All meds given at roughly the same time but interspersed with 2-5ml of feed between each is fine.
Do NOT give infacol - it's mode of action is to coalesce gas bubbles to make a big bubble - which in pigs could possibly lead to gut torsion and death.

Talking dosages now - they are meaningless unless you know both the weight of the pig and the actual concentration of the liquid. All doses are mg of active drug per kg body weight.
Zantac - an OTC 20mg tablet ground up and dissolved in 2ml of water gives a solution of 10mg/ml. For a 1kg guinea pig you would normally be asked by your vet to give anything between 0.2-0.8ml twice daily ie 2-8mg/kg according to the British Small Animal formulary.

In an acute situation ie no poops like yours, my vet would prescribe a dose towards the top end over a 48 hours period. In a less acute situation of gut motility issues eg soft poops etc - it would be lower end for 3-4 days.

HTH
x
 
Pebble said:
All meds given at roughly the same time but interspersed with 2-5ml of feed between each is fine.
Do NOT give infacol - it's mode of action is to coalesce gas bubbles to make a big bubble - which in pigs could possibly lead to gut torsion and death.

Talking dosages now - they are meaningless unless you know both the weight of the pig and the actual concentration of the liquid. All doses are mg of active drug per kg body weight.
Zantac - an OTC 20mg tablet ground up and dissolved in 2ml of water gives a solution of 10mg/ml. For a 1kg guinea pig you would normally be asked by your vet to give anything between 0.2-0.8ml twice daily ie 2-8mg/kg according to the British Small Animal formulary.

In an acute situation ie no poops like yours, my vet would prescribe a dose towards the top end over a 48 hours period. In a less acute situation of gut motility issues eg soft poops etc - it would be lower end for 3-4 days.

HTH
x
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Thanks very much for this info. I was recommended Infacol on here. Before I used that I was using Boots Gripe Water should I revert back to this. I'm really desperate to help Minky get better but nothing seems to be working. I tried 2ml of vegetable oil 2 days ago as stated in the Guinea Piglopaedia but was told on here not to use that. There's so much conflicting information.

Minky is currently hovering over the 1.1Kg (2lb 7oz) mark. When she's OK she peaks at about 1.3Kg (3lb). The prescription I picked up last night states:-
5.00 x Zantac Syrup 300ml - 0.3ml twice a day
5.00 x Emeprid Oral Suspension 125ml - 0.2ml twice a day

I'm going to give her 0.3ml of both now with some food in between & stop the gripe water etc.
 
That's quite a low dose of Emeprid, you could check with the vet if you can give 3 doses a day. Please don't give anything like Infacol or gripe water, as Pebble said these are designed to bring all the gas together into one large bubble, that could be fatal in a guinea pig. Once she is on Emeprid & Zantac together, she does not need the other stuff. Like colic in horses, movement is crucial here, so massaging her tummy, sitting with her on the massage pad for an hour or so at a time (Put something like a waterproof sheet then a towel on the pad in case of accidents) Also feed her little bits of hay & keep the syringe feeding up, as the meds will help pass the food through. So give a couple of syringe fulls, then give her the Zantac & Emeprid at the same time, then carry on completing the syringe feeding, aim to get 120 ml into her in a 24 hour period if you can.

You don't mention Metacam, if she is not on it she needs that as well because if she is in pain she won't eat properly. Good luck, will check back later to see how she is doing x
 
Good News! Minky's done 7 little poos while being massaged. I hope this it the start of things getting better.

If you want to see pics of Minky giving total trust while being massaged please go to thread "Total Trust" which will be up in 5 minutes.
 
I have a piggy whos not been 100% at the moment Ive had trouble getting her to eat since shes been on anti inflammatory drugs for an injury that she had to her spine while out playing. I have been syringe feeding her on a special rodent formula called critical care it seems to be working aswell as building her appetite back! You can get it over the counter from the vets (if not I'm sure you can get something similar).
 
Poppy'sMum said:
That's quite a low dose of Emeprid, you could check with the vet if you can give 3 doses a day. Please don't give anything like Infacol or gripe water, as Pebble said these are designed to bring all the gas together into one large bubble, that could be fatal in a guinea pig. Once she is on Emeprid & Zantac together, she does not need the other stuff. Like colic in horses, movement is crucial here, so massaging her tummy, sitting with her on the massage pad for an hour or so at a time (Put something like a waterproof sheet then a towel on the pad in case of accidents) Also feed her little bits of hay & keep the syringe feeding up, as the meds will help pass the food through. So give a couple of syringe fulls, then give her the Zantac & Emeprid at the same time, then carry on completing the syringe feeding, aim to get 120 ml into her in a 24 hour period if you can.

You don't mention Metacam, if she is not on it she needs that as well because if she is in pain she won't eat properly. Good luck, will check back later to see how she is doing x
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I'm going to check with vet regarding doseage. Regarding the 120ml of CC a day, I think it's impossible when her tummy is full. I'm managing 40ml a day plus she's eating some lettuce, melon & cucumber from my hand & her weight is level or going up. I'm hoping that with all the massage & other treatment she will start to poo more soon. In between massage & feeding she's back with her 2 companions chasing them around for their poos. I'll work out what to do next when I see the vet.
 
Fantastic that she has done some poos. I was thinking that the Emeprid dose seemed low too, am sure ours were on 1ml twice a day. I havee no experience of Zantac though, apart from the fact my Nan took it for years for a a stomach ulcer and it masked the symptoms of her cancer returning.
 
To be honest, I've never got 120 ml's into any of my pigs when they aren't eating. Normally I manage 60 - 80 ml's - that's always worked for me. I tend to aim for as much as they will take.

How is she today? x
 
I have been reminded this afternoon of a pig that was going through a similar thing to Minky and suffered a gastric volvulus and ulceration of the caecum because his gut had become dehydrated. This was literally in the time it took for the pig to go to a vet across the county and back home. This was all confirmed in the post mortem that the owner asked to be carried out. Therefore, the important thing to gain from this pig's experience is that large amounts of fluid are needed together with a lot more food. Stick with the Emeprid and use the massage pad (has it arrived?) and try to get as many feeds as you can into her together with plenty of fluids and this should be done at regular intervals throughout the day along with time on the massage pad.
 
sharonS said:
Stewybus, has your vet considered that all these syptoms could be E cuniculi, Ruby had all of the symptoms you are describing and I am convinced now this is what she had. Read this article and see what you think, so many of the syptoms are the same as you describe.

http://undercoverguineapigs.blogspot.co.uk/2009/10/symptons-of-e-cuniculi.html
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A lot of the symptoms fit but Minky’s seen the vet today & she seems to have got over the worst. Her tummy doesn’t appear to have any gas in it now but full of mostly liquid. I may ring my vet in the morning & see about a blood test to be on the safe side.



helen105281 said:
I have been reminded this afternoon of a pig that was going through a similar thing to Minky and suffered a gastric volvulus and ulceration of the caecum because his gut had become dehydrated. This was literally in the time it took for the pig to go to a vet across the county and back home. This was all confirmed in the post mortem that the owner asked to be carried out. Therefore, the important thing to gain from this pig's experience is that large amounts of fluid are needed together with a lot more food. Stick with the Emeprid and use the massage pad (has it arrived?) and try to get as many feeds as you can into her together with plenty of fluids and this should be done at regular intervals throughout the day along with time on the massage pad.
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Minky has had her Emeprid dose upped from 0.2ml twice a day to 0.5ml twice a day & also been prescribed Cisapride, 0.2ml to be taken twice a day. I gave her 20ml of Critical Care between 6pm & 7pm this also has Bio-Lapis mixed in with it. Unfortunately the massage pad didn’t arrive even though it was on a 24 hour service but UPS have promised an early delivery tomorrow.



flintstones said:
To be honest, I've never got 120 ml's into any of my pigs when they aren't eating. Normally I manage 60 - 80 ml's - that's always worked for me. I tend to aim for as much as they will take.

How is she today? x
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She’s a lot better thanks, I’m aiming at getting at least 100ml of Critical Care into her between 6pm tonight & 6pm tomorrow night. She’s not fighting it & already had 20ml I will start again soon trying another 20ml
 
C'mon little Minky, we are all rooting for you x
 
Oh Cisapride is a very good gut stimulant and very difficult to get hold off for the vets (well it was don't know if that's still the case), as it was removed a couple of years ago. To be honest I don't know the full history of the drug but I'm sure it was routinely used. I had it for Fred when he had trouble with his bloat. I think Zithromax appears to be one of these drugs which is normally ok but sometimes the piggies can take a very bad reaction like your Minky and my Fred.

It was a good day when me and Fred finished the ab course we had a very similar experience. I'm so glad to hear Minky is over the worse just keep going it'll be worth it, there's nothing more satisfying than nursing a guinea pig back to health. x
 
flintstones said:
Oh Cisapride is a very good gut stimulant and very difficult to get hold off for the vets (well it was don't know if that's still the case), as it was removed a couple of years ago. To be honest I don't know the full history of the drug but I'm sure it was routinely used. I had it for Fred when he had trouble with his bloat. I think Zithromax appears to be one of these drugs which is normally ok but sometimes the piggies can take a very bad reaction like your Minky and my Fred.

It was a good day when me and Fred finished the ab course we had a very similar experience. I'm so glad to hear Minky is over the worse just keep going it'll be worth it, there's nothing more satisfying than nursing a guinea pig back to health. x
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Dominika, Minky's vet said that the Cisapride is very hard to get but luckily they had some in stock. It was about £5 for 3 pills. Each one is disolved in 1ml of water to make up 5 x 0.2ml dose.

I managed to get another 20ml of Critical Care down her making a total of 40ml since 6pm. The mixture was made up from 1 level tablespoon of CC powder plus 1/3 of a sachet of Bio-Lapis mixed with previously boiled water let to cool down. After her food I let her rest like in the pictures I posted this morning. I used the electric toothbrush for a while but then just gently massaged her with my hand. After 3/4 of an hour she didn't want to get up. I've made up a 1.2m cage for her with the cosy that she loves & a cat lit tray with teabag paper bedding in cover by a carrier bag full of hay. I've also put all the foods in that are in with the other piggies & there's a white infant's training sheet in the bottom so I can see what come out the other end. Nearly forgot to mention that she'd done some poos in her cosy which were hard like pellets. I broke one in two & it just looked like dried Critical Care.

I'm hoping she's going to be OK now but just got a little doubt because of her symptoms which are similar to E Cunicili. I'm going to ring Dominika in the morning to see what she thinks and is it worth it to have a blood test done to put my mind at ease.
 
I'm not sure if the E. Cunicili can be tested through fecal samples, it may be worth checking with your vet, the poop has to be sent off to an exotics lab though, you could mention Chester Zoo, they tested Petal's poop recently & the test covered everything from E. Coli to Saccharomyces which is what my Petal has. My test was around £62, that also included a fecal float as well. Fecal sampling would be less invasive & safer as she wouldn't need to be anaesthetised to do it. You could drop Pebble a pm to find out if she thinks a poop test would show the E. Cunicili, or ask your vet tomorrow. My concern re blood test would be that the anaesthetic may set her back, you will need to syringe feed her during recovery etc & it does take a while for them to recover from the effects. The poos sound better though & they are there so it's looking more promising for her, keep up the good work!
 
cisaprid is difficult to gt hold of - but my vts can hlp your vts to gt this
kyboard gon wst...a spcifici vowl not funcitoning
x
 
Can't put much down now because I'm just about to take Minky back to the vets for a ultrasound scan. She hadn't we'd from 3.30pm yesterday till 6am this morning which is very worry. She's since done 2 wees. Does anyone else have info on piggies that aren't weeing.
 
Pebble said:
cisaprid is difficult to gt hold of - but my vts can hlp your vts to gt this
kyboard gon wst...a spcifici vowl not funcitoning
x
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We're OK for Cisaprid, I got 3 pills last night which will makeup a weeks supply.
 
Just got back from the vets & Minky's had an ultrasound scan which showed nothing out of the ordinary. The lack in passing water is being put down to her been dehydrated through not eating enough & she's now rehydrating. I managed to take a sample of her white paper bedding which she'd just wee'd on before I took her to the vet & this also suggested that she was retained water as the wee was concentrated. I feel a lot better now & Minky has also been eating some parsley & attempting some hay. She had about 80 x 1ml syringes of critical care between 6pm & 5am and another 5 x 1ml at breakfast time with he meds so she's pretty full at present. I'm easing off this for a while to give her change to feel like eating something more naturally. Thanks to everyone who's sent suggestions & well wishes. This roller-coaster is on an up at the moment, hope it doesn't come back down.
 
Thanks for the update Stewy, we are thinking of her.
 
Every one here at Dindy Towers is rooting for Minky. I'm sorry that we have no advice for you, we are glad that she is on the up at the moment.
 
Are you also syringing water? I would normally syringe 10ml's food, 5ml's water to ensure the piggy is hydrated. I hope that makes sense, so every 10ml's of food, I give 5ml's water.

Keep trying to tempt her with hay to, your doing a brilliant job!
 
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