I Have Had To Seperate The Boys Tonight

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Katiedid

Katiedid

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During floor time Dozy would not leave Jet alone. He kept following Jet around trying to sniff his bottom (and I think mount him) there was a lot of runble strutting (though very little teeth chattering), loads of my head is higher than yours. lots of one hiding and the other out and then when I was upstairs (leaving hubby to watch them) and hubby had to seperate them as Dozy went for Jet (it isn't an all out attack but a nip that has broken the skin).

I came down and got Jet out the pen. Hubby had Dozy and I cuddled/checked over Jet. There is a tooth mark cut in Jets side and another sore bit on his rump (got between yesterday evening and today). I've split the cage with cardboard (not ideal I know but until we sort more perminent out).

Jet has been looking very stressed for the past 24 hours so we felt a break was best. Jet has totally relaxed - Dozy is looking for Jet calling for him :(

I don't know where to go from here. It seems what is right for Dozy isn't for Jet.

I also cant believe that they were bonded at the shelter. They have not got on since they arrived (even the peace between them was avoidance not love - I hoped it would develop) could they really have been OK at the shelter and like this here? If so what can I do to get them back to normal or is it a case of once bitten never friends?

aaahhhhhhhh what do we do now?
 
It's so sad when this happens. It's something we really have no control over. What size cage/hutch are they in? I suppose when they're out on the floor they have lots more room so space doesn't appear to be the problem. Did they have more space at the shelter where they could keep away from each other if they wanted to? Once you get bad cuts or wounds then it's time to separate them which you have rightly done. It's now a case of what to do next, there are lots of options. Do you keep them as 2 solo piggies but in areas next to each other or do you re-home one & try to get another companion for the other. It all depends how attached you've got to them. Other options include getting a new boar friend for each or the final choice is to have them neutered and get them a lady friend each. The last could be the best option long term as boar/sow pairs have the least problems. I'm really sorry this has happened. Good luck with their future.
 
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I wonder as well whether they were really that well bonded at the shelter in the first place and not just sticking together out of fea - at least Jet. :(

When you have to separate boys you usually end up with one that is happy to be away from the other and one (usually the dominant one) that wants his companion back. :(

You may perhaps want to consider keeping them next to each other with interaction through the bars. Some boars get on better again as hormonally settled adults if the bond is not irrevocably broken. More likely by sharing run or lawn time on neutral territory than actually moving in with each other fully.

Unfortunately, I don't think that your local rescue (and you haven't got another one anywhere near) is up to boar dating. I also don't know how good and practiced the vets in Jersey are re. neutering, so your options are sadly a bit more limited! However, you can still give them a happy life even if they can't live as a pair. Quite a number of forum members have next door neighbour boars who don't get on but can't live without each other either!
 
They are already neutered so a sow boar pair is an option. Jet is looking decidedly perky this morning Dozy isn't :(

In terms of cage size it is 1.2m by 60 (something) cm and is the same as at the shelter. They fight during floor time too - last nights fight was floor time - I suspect they would need something much larger. I am thinking of a 2 level C&C so one on each level (or three level and one split so that they can see each other. We have a huge outdoor run so I will try them in that.

Thinking about it I didn't check Jet over when he arrived (I didn't want to stress him) so I don't know if any of those early bites occurred before we got them.
 
I'm really sorry for you, I know how upsetting it is. I currently have Jack living on his own because he was too aggressive to Pumpkin.
He is waiting for a friend, we think @Rodentopia might know of a suitable piggy so fingers firmly crossed :)
 
Katiedid said:
They are already neutered so a sow boar pair is an option. Jet is looking decidedly perky this morning Dozy isn't :(

In terms of cage size it is 1.2m by 60 (something) cm and is the same as at the shelter. They fight during floor time too - last nights fight was floor time - I suspect they would need something much larger. I am thinking of a 2 level C&C so one on each level (or three level and one split so that they can see each other. We have a huge outdoor run so I will try them in that.

Thinking about it I didn't check Jet over when he arrived (I didn't want to stress him) so I don't know if any of those early bites occurred before we got them.
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HUGS

The fallout from a fall-out can be rather gutting! However, Jet being so much happier away from Dozy means that he clearly wasn't before. You have tried your best, so don't blame yourself; you are a very loving mummy who is trying to make both boys happy - but as things are between the boys, this is not really possible.

At least the neutering will give you a most convenient option; cross gender bonds are the most stable of them all once thesow has accepted the boar! How long since Dozy and Jet have been neutered? We recommend a 6 weeks wait to be 100% safe after I had a surprise baby courtesy of a supposedly safe over 5 weeks post op rescue boar. If you can, please go for girls - ideally subadult ones, as they tend to be much less fussy than older sows.
 
They were neutered on the 6 February. I'm not rushing into new piggies as I'm now terrified of having 4 that don't like each other! They have apparently been calling out for each other this morning. I'm going to get a mesh divider for the cage tonight while I source C&C. Jet still looked relatively happy at lunchtime (able to eat without worry) Dozy was quite stressed. There has been no rumble strutting, rumble noises and no teeth chattering since last night - which is lovely.

Is all lost with the boys? Would time side by side and a reintroduction be doomed to failure? Is it worth trying outdoor or floor time with them together - hubby made up the outside pen - its huge and lovely.

For the girls by subadult - how old are we talking? I dare say I could get young ones (one pet store here will let me order them in) but they would be little - I would worry that they were too little (especially with Sir Biteychops). Other than that there is no real rescue here so it would be luck of the draw as to what comes into the JSPCA - and I would expect all will be over 1 year old.

Is it likely that a female and the boy may not get on? Would I be better getting young ones from a petshop, or trying to persuade the JSPCA to do a dating service with older sows?

Would I be better with just the boys side by side?
 
You can try and see whether your boys get on again or whether the old problems make an unwelcome appearance very quickly - in the second case, I would separate immediately and leave be. Please make sure that you are present at all times and can intervene if things suddenly start to blow up!

Please go rescue - the majority of sows in rescue are around a few months to two years old, which is all a good age for cross gender bonding. Some are even born in rescue if their mummy is pregnant on arrival. If you can, stage a little meeting at the rescue to see whether they like each straight away; that will make for a happier relationship. If you are going to break up a pair, try the dominant sow with your underboy first. On the other hand, if the two piggies don't hit it off or don't want to interact, you know that you want to look for another lady love!

The good thing about cross gender bonding is that once acceptance has happened, fall-outs are virtually unknown and that if you have to do the intros yourself, you can do them a bit more slowly than a boar bonding, which you have to do in one go. My previous advice to go for sows that are a similar age to your boys was taking into account that without having somebody there who can help you with the bonding and after your current experiences, you'd want to take the very safest route possible.

I have had some touching love stories between older boars and sows (or older sows and a younger boar of their choice), but I also have some rather cranky older ladies here that are a nightmare to introduce to other piggies! But they all very much rely on the individual personalities, and what you are looking for is potential partners which are pretty failsafe. ;)
 
OK. I suspect in that case the only solution will be side by side cages if a reintroduction does not work. I can't risk 4 pigs that don't get on.

The JSPCA is the only rescue here that I can find (its only a small island). They are unlikely to do introductions and I have already been told 'they don't get many sows in and those that do go quickly'. I can separate the boys and put my name down with the JSPCA and see what comes up. I will call them tomorrow (in all honesty I'm not that impressed with them sending out 2 that clearly don't get on so how I would trust them with another introduction -if they would do one - I don't know).
 
120 cage for two boars i think is quite small. I think 140 is recomended but not your fault. Sounds like the rescue doesnt know what they are doing, They should have told you all this.It doesnt sound like they were bonded. My friend has two boys in a 100 cm cage that get on great (know this is too small but sick of telling her) so their bond must be incredibly strong
 
I have 2 brothers who now live side by side with interaction throught the bars and 30 mins floor time together and 1.5 hours each alone. Any more than 30 Poe starts bullying Edgar again. I was gutted when they fell out as they were bonded and snuggled up together every night. I felt a huge fail. Now however they seem perfectly happy and Edgar who was the one who seemed sad has perked up and was popcorning away at floor time this evening. They now have a 2x3 with a loft each side by side.

I have considered getting them both a furry girlfriend each but in all honesty I do not want to put them through the surgery as I feel it is a bit cruel. However if they became depressed I would def have to rethink.
 
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