Ill little Piggy

[Lyndsay1988]

Hi there, this is my first post.

I have 2 male guinea pigs, Huey who is 4 1/2 and Winston who is nearly 2. They live together all of the time.

Huey has had impaction since he was 2 and I have been managing it for him and he has been happy.

Suddenly last monday I noticed he was hobbling on his front paw and it was inflamed. He also had diarrhea. The vet said it was probably and infection and they could put him to sleep but they reckoned he had a chance and gave him some antibiotics and some anti inflammatories.

I noticed a few hours later that the biggest problem was his back legs and he couldnt walk on them properly, he was walking drunk and sliding along. I phoned the vet and they said i should keep an eye on him and if he got worse then to bring him in.

Since the antibiotics he no longer has diarrhea and he is eating and drinking normally. If i hold him he is very interested in me and has enjoyed being in his pen and eating grass. Winston is doting on him and cleaning him.

He is passing soft poo and because he cant move easily he is becoming dirty, so i am bathing him daily.

The vets have booked him in to be assessed on monday because he hasnt got better or worse in the last 5 days. They dont know what it is that is causing it because he is so alert, but I wonder if he may have had a stroke or something?

The vet said the decision was mine as to whether I put him to sleep and I'm torn. Usually if there was no hope I would be the first to put him out of his misery and put him to sleep, but this is difficult. He is so alert and wanting to carry on as a normal guinea pig with his friend, and then has moments where he is a bit overwhelmed.

Really I was just wanting some advice as to what you think it could be and what I should do for him.

I can't take him back to the vet before monday because they have said unless there is a massive change there is no point. I also have a bad bladder condition and find it difficult to get out so I would not be able to spontaneously just go.

Thanks for any suggestions

 

[Poppy'sMum]

I'm really sorry to hear about your boy. I have no experience of this problem, but there are lots f people here that will be able to give you advice. Can you give us a rough idea of whereabouts you are in case we can suggest another vet nearby?

I would perhaps keep him off watery veg whilst he has soft poos, keep his veg to a minimum until they firm up but make sure you offer him water regularly.

Welcome to the Forum as well sorry it's not in happier circumstances

 

[SpinningNickel]

Oh dear. I'm not sure what to say, because you're right -- it's such a grey area. I just lost one of my boys to an inner ear infection. We lost him on the Saturday and if he hadn't started to recover by his next vet visit on Tuesday I was prepared to start considering euthanasia, because he was clearly overwhelmed that he couldn't stand upright, was nauseous and in a lot of pain between injections and from the injection site too from so many jabs. But if you piggie isn't in pain and can get around ok, it's a very different story and much harder to make that call.

I can't offer you any advice with regards to his health, but as for how I would look at the "putting to sleep" scenario:

If he's really struggling with his mobility, you have to think about the quality of that life, whether he's alert or not. How miserable and depressed might he be in the longer term if he can't run and play and jump about with his cage mate? Limited mobility and ability to exercise could lead to other health problems down the line as well.

What I would probably say is that if he's eating fine, maintaining his weight, and seems otherwise happy and healthy, maybe this isn't a decision you need to make RIGHT NOW. See how he gets on. After 5 days there probably won't be a miraculous recovery, but in a few weeks maybe he'll figure out how to scoot around pretty effectively, or regain partial movement in his back end, or something. They can be surprisingly adaptable, and he might be happy that way. If he's clearly not, then I think you're right to consider all your options.

 

[Lyndsay1988]

Thanks for both of your replies. He has lost weight drastically sort of almost in a day last Monday but I thought maybe it might be due to the diarrhea clearing his impaction.

He hasn't been too fussed by his guinea pig food and has largely wanted kale and greens as well as hay and grass.

He won't seem to eat carrot or apple at the moment. Is it ok for him to eat lots of grass? And what other things could I try him on that will help his weight?

I will stop his kale and greens for a while and see how he goes.

He is in his pen at the moment and an airplane went over. He hobbled about 2 foot to get under cover.....bless him.

 

[SpinningNickel]

Aww, poor little dear.

I'm sure I read somewhere on here that 30g can just be the difference between a full bladder and an empty one, which surprised me. I'm weighing Machu every few days at the moment and he regularly fluctuates within that. Day one he was something like 746 and the next day he was 775. I was convinced he'd just been wiggling around too much for me to get a good weigh the first time, but apparently this is ok! In other words, those kinds of fluctuations are ok as long as he isn't consistently just going down. If he is, or the weight loss is more, you need to be looking at more drastic measures like syringe feeding.

Good news that he's not off hay though, since that's so much of their diet. Grass should be ok as long as he's used to eating it regularly. Otherwise it can upset his tummy. Obviously you have to be careful with greens as bloat can be dangerous for them, but if he's losing weight then you just want him to eat, full stop, and should just give him what he wants, within reason.

I assume carrot and apple are things he usually likes? Strange, if it was a stroke or something neurological I wonder if it could have messed with his sense of smell... like he doesn't realise what you're offering him? Complete guess though!

Forum user ToffeeWoffee suggested mixing some critical care with blended banana when my sick boy didn't want his critical care mush. TW said the sugar helps keep their weight up. I know banana can constipate them if they have too much, but if your little one has had soft poos it's probably a good thing for him, so try that. Try mixing some of his usual pellets with boiling water til it turns to mush and mix it with mushed banana.

Syringe feed him if you have to -- he might just be a little off his food because he's overwhelmed, as you say. If you have a blender (even just one of those little handheld ones) try boiling and blending down some veg and making him some smoothies. Carrot and red bell pepper mixed together was a favourite for my Picchu. Syringe them or see if he'll take it himself off a teaspoon. Personally my instinct would be to leave syringing as a last resort in this case, because what you really want is for him to adapt and get by on his own, not become completely dependent on you. But if he's not eating, do what you have to.

Try and get him the widest range of vitamins you can with fresh veg, especially if he's off pellets as they're often fortified with some of that stuff and he needs to get it somewhere. Have a look at this chart if you need some idea of what veg gets him what nutrients.

I'm no expert AT ALL but I hope some of that helps!

 

[Pebble]

Temporary hind limb paralysis can be a feature of infection and the piggie can recover. There are plenty of threads on here where piggies have developed hind limb paralysis and this has been reversed by giving them liquid osteo-care according to the dosage suggested by Peter Gurney

http://www.oginet.com/pgurney/paral.htm

Here is a recent thread where a piggie has recovered.

http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=91254&highlight=osteocare


(It is also not unknown for this to happen after an injection because the needle or fluid can temporarily shock the nerves - I've seen my pig have a neurological reaction in his hind legs in direct response to an injection that was placed further down his back than normal - they usually put it in the neck).

I am concerned that the vet has not identified the source of the infection - given the hind limb issues I would be worried there was an infection in the ear and these should be checked at the next visit. Is he shaking his head more often than usual?

You say the front paw is inflamed but is there any evidence of a cut/wound? It could be unconnected with the infection and just be a sprain.

Keeping off the greens because of the soft poops and providing extra syringe food (mushed pellets) to ensure your piggie maintains his weight is vital at the moment. You need to weigh him daily. If his poos become smaller or stop he may need a gut stimulant as well as additional feeds.

He also needs adequate pain relief to help him eat as a piggie in pain won;t eat properly and then starts to have issues with his guts. Metacam is the main non-steroidal anti-nflammatory that is used with piggies however recently my vet and I have found that trama-dol can be more effective with some types of pain in piggies including joints, urinary and dental. Trama-dol is an opiate and can slow down the gut so we tend to give my piggies gut stimulants (cisa-pride or eme-prid and zan-tac) if we give trama-dol.
--
Here is a recent thread where the owner had a piggie who developed hind limb paralysis following an operation and put an intensive amout of care into supporting the "acute phase" of the crisis. Luckily they also had a vet receptive to using additional medications to just baytril and meta-cam.

http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=94009

Finally, unless there were additonal symptoms when you took Huey to the vet, I would be concerned they suggested PTS just because of an infection (I'm assuming from what you said that when you took him in his hind legs were working) It suggests to me they know very little about guinea pigs. Also, antibioitics and painkillers can be given in oral form - you should not be having to rely on multiple visits to your vet to get injections when oral meds are available. If you let us know whereabouts in the country you are based perhaps we can recommend a more cavy-savvy vet for you?

Hope this helps
x

 

[Lyndsay1988]

Thanks for the replies, he is on metacam oral which I am giving him via a syringe at the moment.

I have stopped his greens for now and making sure he is eating hay and grass which he has usually.

Apple and carrot was something he used to have every week but since Monday he has refused it. I have taken on board your suggestions and I'm going to try the different things with his food and hopefully he might start to perk up.

He is tilting his head slightly but I think it is only to adapt to the new position he has to sleep in. When I hold him he is more interested in tickles and sniffing me than anything.

I'm in Portsmouth, England and the vet I have used has been my family vet for more than 30 years. I do trust their judgement, but as it is such a difficult thing to diagnose I don't blame them for being unsure. But I'm sure on Monday we can assess him and make sure he has the right care and choices.

Thank you for taking the time to reply and the links