Lung Infection and Resistant Bacteria

[Dom R]

Hi all,

Just wanted some help and some information if possible.

So back story, Oscar, who I got last September at around 2-3 months of age, has a lung infection (you can hear the crackle when he breathes), and he had it around the beginning of February, and it went after being treated with Baytril. And, which was said by the vet it has unfortunately returned. But this time I believe it is more resistant to Baytril, as it was throughout his entire lungs and is now just at the bottom, according to the checkup last week; but it isn't getting past that point.

At the checkup, the vet said that there's a possibility of a swab if it isn't gone by Thursday. Due to it being mainly in his lungs, how is this bacteria culture going to be taken? There's no signs of infection anywhere but his lungs, does it still show up in saliva/mucus outside of the lungs? Also, how much would this cost roughly, just for general information.

I'm also wondering if it's recommended to try a different antibiotic first? Or should I just go straight for the culture and then the antibiotic.

Other than this, Oscar has no discharge in his nose, mouth, eyes or anywhere else, it's primarily in his lungs. He's still eating, drinking, passing faeces and urine perfectly normal. Dosage wise, he's on 0.42ml of Baytril twice a day, at 2.5% (this does seem high to me, especially with him still being young, and with the impact it can have on his growth etc.)

Apologies if there's a million posts like this, I prefer things to be more specific rather than guessing off of other posts.

Many thanks,

Dom.

 

[DM030819]

@Dom R How long was he on the Baytril for? He may need a longer course.

Is your vet certain that it is an infection and not a fluid retention issue? Does he gain weight when he's crackly?

The vet might try another antibiotic, Baytril is the general go-to drug but my vet tends to use Karidox for lung issues.

 

[Dom R]

@Dom R How long was he on the Baytril for? He may need a longer course.

Is your vet certain that it is an infection and not a fluid retention issue? Does he gain weight when he's crackly?

The vet might try another antibiotic, Baytril is the general go-to drug but my vet tends to use Karidox for lung issues.

The first time, I believe he was on it for 2~ ish weeks, including a little extra time when it had gone. Currently he's been on it for just under 2 weeks and no improvement past the plateau. I've had two different vets from this practice check him, and both agreed that it was an infection. He's not gaining weight and not really losing it either, as he's been growing quite slowly for a while now, and stayed at around 1070-1080g for a couple of months.

It is a different vet this time, whom I've just realised has advanced training in small animal medicine; so that is definitely a positive.

 

[pig in the city]

Hi. Baytril isn't the best antibiotic for potential lung infections. My vet tends to use either Doxycycline or Zithromax. Infection is the most likely cause of lung crackles in a young piggy if heart problems have been excluded.
A swab would need to be taken when he had been off any antibiotics for at least a week. I personally think it would be better just to try an alternative antibiotic.
An antinflammatory like metacam might help reduce secretions, and perhaps a mucolytic like bisolvon to break up the mucus. Keeping him in a warm but not too dry environment will help, plus avoid woodshavings and dusty hay.
Has he got a friend by the way?

 

[Dom R]

Hi. Baytril isn't the best antibiotic for potential lung infections. My vet tends to use either Doxycycline or Zithromax. Infection is the most likely cause of lung crackles in a young piggy if heart problems have been excluded.
A swab would need to be taken when he had been off any antibiotics for at least a week. I personally think it would be better just to try an alternative antibiotic.
An antinflammatory like metacam might help reduce secretions, and perhaps a mucolytic like bisolvon to break up the mucus. Keeping him in a warm but not too dry environment will help, plus avoid woodshavings and dusty hay.
Has he got a friend by the way?

Thanks for the reply,

I'll definitely push on trying a different and more specific antibiotic for him, especially since its not just a new illness, and he's had it for a couple of weeks now; I don't want it to get a lot worse just to try and get a swab sample. The vets I've seen have both said that his heart sounds perfectly healthy.

I do have some spare Metacam, which I will also ask about, along with the mucolytic as you suggested. I try to keep my room as warm as possible, due to also having a crested gecko.

He's currently, and has been on old bed sheets with additional blankets for warmth to sleep in, and the hay is pretty much dust free, since I do the transferring from the bulk bag into a box to bring inside, so most dust ends up floating off.

He does have a friend, which I have also been monitoring; and he's showing no signs of any illness, and no changes in his breathing patterns, same with the two piggies underneath him and his friend. Is there anything I can do to limit the transfer of any infection? Note that his friend is much older than him, as he's around 2 years old compared to him.

 

[Freela]

It's possible either that it was not a long enough course or that the antibiotic was not a great match. I think it's worth trying a different antibiotic even before the culture comes back. As you pointed out, since they need to culture sputum/phlegm, they may not turn up anything on culture anyhow if there isn't any nasal discharge or obvious sputum to swab. Unfortunately, unlike people, guinea pigs can't cough on command! In addition, swabs are better taken before antibiotics are started at all... you'll have to judge if it's worth your money. For what it's worth, we had this situation with Hadley a couple of years ago... she was on a couple of courses of antibiotics for wheezing/lung issues, showed some improvement while on but had it recur within a few days of stopping the antibiotic. We switched up the meds without culturing. The vet wasn't very confident of getting a good culture and we would have had to put her on something in the meantime anyhow. The second antibiotic did the trick. All the best to your piggie!

 

[pig in the city]

Thanks for the reply,

I'll definitely push on trying a different and more specific antibiotic for him, especially since its not just a new illness, and he's had it for a couple of weeks now; I don't want it to get a lot worse just to try and get a swab sample. The vets I've seen have both said that his heart sounds perfectly healthy.

I do have some spare Metacam, which I will also ask about, along with the mucolytic as you suggested. I try to keep my room as warm as possible, due to also having a crested gecko.

He's currently, and has been on old bed sheets with additional blankets for warmth to sleep in, and the hay is pretty much dust free, since I do the transferring from the bulk bag into a box to bring inside, so most dust ends up floating off.

He does have a friend, which I have also been monitoring; and he's showing no signs of any illness, and no changes in his breathing patterns, same with the two piggies underneath him and his friend. Is there anything I can do to limit the transfer of any infection? Note that his friend is much older than him, as he's around 2 years old compared to him.

That all sounds good. His friend would have caught it by now so don't worry. Some pigs are more susceptible than others.

 

[Dom R]

It's possible either that it was not a long enough course or that the antibiotic was not a great match. I think it's worth trying a different antibiotic even before the culture comes back. As you pointed out, since they need to culture sputum/phlegm, they may not turn up anything on culture anyhow if there isn't any nasal discharge or obvious sputum to swab. Unfortunately, unlike people, guinea pigs can't cough on command! In addition, swabs are better taken before antibiotics are started at all... you'll have to judge if it's worth your money. For what it's worth, we had this situation with Hadley a couple of years ago... she was on a couple of courses of antibiotics for wheezing/lung issues, showed some improvement while on but had it recur within a few days of stopping the antibiotic. We switched up the meds without culturing. The vet wasn't very confident of getting a good culture and we would have had to put her on something in the meantime anyhow. The second antibiotic did the trick. All the best to your piggie!

Thanks for the reply! I'll definitely push towards a second course of antibiotics, today I think he sounds a bit worse, so the baytril may be doing even less than before, luckily the appointment is only on Thursday so it wont be long to wait.

Oscar is currently sat on my lap after his baytril, cucumber and green bell pepper, so I know he still feels good in himself if he's not even deterred away from eating food.

 

[Dom R]

Just an update, I managed to get Doxycyline tablets 20mg to split into 4mg chunks to give Oscar, and I've also been given some MiPet Meloxaid, which is just a different type of Metacam, which is 0.5mg/ml at 1ml a day (I've read this is very high dosage, so I'm going to drop it to 0.3ml twice a day.

 

[Bill & Ted]

Hoping these meds kick in fast and little Osca makes a full recovery soon x

 

[Dom R]

Hoping these meds kick in fast and little Osca makes a full recovery soon x

I'm sure he will, he probably can't wait to get rid of it bless him, he's a strong little one

 

[Merab]

Can’t add to the advice but wanted to offer support

 

[pig in the city]

Just an update, I managed to get Doxycyline tablets 20mg to split into 4mg chunks to give Oscar, and I've also been given some MiPet Meloxaid, which is just a different type of Metacam, which is 0.5mg/ml at 1ml a day (I've read this is very high dosage, so I'm going to drop it to 0.3ml twice a day.

Hi, how much does Oscar weigh? It may not be a high dosage if he is a big piggy.
My vet prescribes dog metacam at 0.4ml/kg once or twice a day
Hope he improves soon

 

[Dom R]

Hi, how much does Oscar weigh? It may not be a high dosage if he is a big piggy.
My vet prescribes dog metacam at 0.4ml/kg once or twice a day
Hope he improves soon

The weight the vet said was 1085 I believe, although my scales at home show a little less than that, but that is expected. I've currently not given him any of this version yet, as I am finishing off the little bit of 1.5mg/ml Metacam that I have left from a few months ago, may as well use it while its still within the shelf life.