Meet Betty and Barney

Sorry, I've just got to vent!

As I posted at the beginning of this thread, a friend of mine got ill and decided that she couldn't really take care of her boar any more.
The boar had been alone for some weeks at that point because his wifelet had passed away a bit earlier and my friend didn't have the energy to get him a new partner.
So I took him in, got him a new girl - with the long term plan for him to move on to another friend when she will have the space once her elderly boar has passed.
My friend agreed to this plan in writing - we wrote about it on WhatsApp.
They moved in in August. I really only did it as a big favour to my friend because of everything else going on in my life.

Now fast forward a few weeks. My friend still has a long way to go but she has suddenly decided that she wants Barney back. NOW!
When she first told me this weekend, I said no.
Barney and Betty are both very timid and skittish and handing them around a lot is not in their best interest.
I'm slowly making progress with them and though I know that my friend loves animals, I don't think that guinea pigs are the best choice for her.

We ended the conversation with "we will talk about it again next week".

Today a friend of this friend called me in a very demanding and close to rude way and demanded that I give Barney back straight away.
I only took him in for a few weeks and now it was time to give him back because my friend can't live without him any more and she needs him so much.

I told her that I wouldn't discuss this matter with her. My friend can get in touch herself.
I also told her that it had been a permant arrangement. She wanted to see the proof of that and I sent her screenshots of the WhatsApp messages.

I can't tell you how furious I am.
Yes, I'll probably have to give him back to her.
But I truely believe that it's not in his best interest (or Betty's who is my pig strictely speaking, but of course I wouldn't seperate them).
And I'm also really mad that now I'm the bad guy in this scenario after only trying to help her and of course the piggy.
 
Viennese Furbabies said:
Sorry, I've just got to vent!

As I posted at the beginning of this thread, a friend of mine got ill and decided that she couldn't really take care of her boar any more.
The boar had been alone for some weeks at that point because his wifelet had passed away a bit earlier and my friend didn't have the energy to get him a new partner.
So I took him in, got him a new girl - with the long term plan for him to move on to another friend when she will have the space once her elderly boar has passed.
My friend agreed to this plan in writing - we wrote about it on WhatsApp.
They moved in in August. I really only did it as a big favour to my friend because of everything else going on in my life.

Now fast forward a few weeks. My friend still has a long way to go but she has suddenly decided that she wants Barney back. NOW!
When she first told me this weekend, I said no.
Barney and Betty are both very timid and skittish and handing them around a lot is not in their best interest.
I'm slowly making progress with them and though I know that my friend loves animals, I don't think that guinea pigs are the best choice for her.

We ended the conversation with "we will talk about it again next week".

Today a friend of this friend called me in a very demanding and close to rude way and demanded that I give Barney back straight away.
I only took him in for a few weeks and now it was time to give him back because my friend can't live without him any more and she needs him so much.

I told her that I wouldn't discuss this matter with her. My friend can get in touch herself.
I also told her that it had been a permant arrangement. She wanted to see the proof of that and I sent her screenshots of the WhatsApp messages.

I can't tell you how furious I am.
Yes, I'll probably have to give him back to her.
But I truely believe that it's not in his best interest (or Betty's who is my pig strictely speaking, but of course I wouldn't seperate them).
And I'm also really mad that now I'm the bad guy in this scenario after only trying to help her and of course the piggy.
Click to expand...


Your friend might be feeling a bit better but well enough to care for Barney and Betty ? As well as all her other animals ….I doubt it
If she asked you to have Barney because of her illness do you think she could easily give them away again ?
I’m sure she hasn’t really thought thru what is best for Barney ….
Also she is basically breaking an agreement …she wasn’t having Barney back
I hope you can keep them and pass them onto your other friend ….as arranged in the future !
 
Keep them. Your friend won't have the energy to fight for them. It is definitely in the piggies' best interests they stay with you. Sometimes very unwell people go into denial and it may take her some time to realise that she can't go back to the way things used to be 😔
 
You really don’t need this after all the effort you have put into caring for Barney and Betty.
The fact that she wants him back NOW suggests she hasn’t thought it through and is acting on her emotions.

Maybe suggest she sees how she feels in a couple of weeks.
Is she up to coping with Barney and Betty ?
What will she do if she finds herself back in the original situation of not being able to cope ?

Hugs 🤗
 
I’m sorry @Viennese Furbabies. How awful to be treated this way by “friends”. You are the one they should be thankful to.

I agree she probably hasn’t thought this through properly.

I hope you don’t have to give them back to her and your other friend can rehome them as planned.
 
Wanting Barney back right now seems a little hasty! Like a spontaneous off the cuff idea that isn't going to work.

Maybe she is just really missing Barney and or having guineas around. Does she live close enough to you that she could visit the guineas 15-30 minutes once a week or once
every 2 weeks, something like that? Would that work for you as well? You could even suggest for 2-3 months, so not lifelong. I gather you have a lot going on, so may not be easy for you, but it might save the friendship and more importantly give your friend a realistic look into guinea care and can she really do it again?! Come for guinea TÜV, weekly check, come for 'cage'-cleaning.

If you're thinking and exuding a bit of 'guinea pigs are the wrong pet for you anyway', I think that's going over to her side of the road maybe even slightly patronising, better to avoid and stay on your own side of the road so to speak. If that really means in your opinion she's the wrong person for guinea pigs, please consider that she's probably not the worst either.

I can see things from your side and from her side, it's seldom all one person's 'fault' whether misunderstandings, rudeness or whatever. You wrote messages, yes, but in a friendship there should maybe be room for minds to change? You didn't actually write a contract did you? Now this other friend of your friend has leapt in, good that you shut that down. But maybe listen to a little message in there? It sounds as if your friend may be feeling overpowered. You can use that to basically ignore her and keep the guineas or you could use that information to try for some sort of compromise. If you power through, keep the guineas, ignore her, you might well lose the friendship. So do consider if that's worth it.
Please feel free to tell her you feel as if she's making you into the bad guy now in an "I feel" way rather than accusation, if possible.

Ill-health and illnesses and lack of energy can take surprising turns. A piggy-savvy acquaintance of an acquaintance took on 3 elderly guineas of mine for a few weeks or so up to six weeks. One had very bad bumble foot and my own health was getting in the way and I just couldn't continue. Then the acquaintance ended up on the verge of nervous breakdown and brought me my guineas back long before the time was up, and it was OK I managed.

There will be details and innuendos in this case with your friend that I don't know and can't know so take what's useful in what I wrote and ignore what doesn't fit at all.

Fingers crossed you can work something out that's good for all four of you - 2 guineas, 2 people.
 
So, it sounds as if I'm a little in the minority on here in what I've written.

I got help last year from lots of people after I broke my ankle. In particular, I had to find friends and acquaintances to stay with for about 5 weeks because I live alone and couldn't manage the stairs in my building. Of those friends and acquaintances, one with her husband was particularly helpful and I was very grateful but it also got too much like her being on my side of the road, assuming I needed xyz whereas I didn't. But she expended energy doing xyz and then got very resentful which I could sense but I didn't know why. Asking her would have been out of the question, she was in the position of power. I even had to gather together energy and courage to say I wanted to go home earlier than envisaged. Very long and convoluted, but I hear some similarities going on between our two cases. They would definitely see themselves in your position, ill-used by a friend who needed and asked for help. I see myself in the position of your friend in certain ways, which are probably clear in my other post. Sometimes I was speechless at her behaviour towards me. Yet in her own mind it was all fine. I'm not saying your behaviour towards this friend is incredibly bad, but I'm saying it's likely you both have blind spots, not just her you too.

I wonder if there have been problems in this friendship for a while?
It sounds as if es menschelt etwas in der Beziehung. Maybe it's more Bekanntschaft than Freundschaft?
(Sorry to the non-German speakers on here, a bit of cultural stuff which I presume exists in Austria as in Germany).

I'm sorry @Viennese Furbabies if it seems I'm speaking out of turn. I don't know you that well, after all.
 
Mrs Tiggy Winkle said:
So, it sounds as if I'm a little in the minority on here in what I've written.

I got help last year from lots of people after I broke my ankle. In particular, I had to find friends and acquaintances to stay with for about 5 weeks because I live alone and couldn't manage the stairs in my building. Of those friends and acquaintances, one with her husband was particularly helpful and I was very grateful but it also got too much like her being on my side of the road, assuming I needed xyz whereas I didn't. But she expended energy doing xyz and then got very resentful which I could sense but I didn't know why. Asking her would have been out of the question, she was in the position of power. I even had to gather together energy and courage to say I wanted to go home earlier than envisaged. Very long and convoluted, but I hear some similarities going on between our two cases. They would definitely see themselves in your position, ill-used by a friend who needed and asked for help. I see myself in the position of your friend in certain ways, which are probably clear in my other post. Sometimes I was speechless at her behaviour towards me. Yet in her own mind it was all fine. I'm not saying your behaviour towards this friend is incredibly bad, but I'm saying it's likely you both have blind spots, not just her you too.

I wonder if there have been problems in this friendship for a while?
It sounds as if es menschelt etwas in der Beziehung. Maybe it's more Bekanntschaft than Freundschaft?
(Sorry to the non-German speakers on here, a bit of cultural stuff which I presume exists in Austria as in Germany).

I'm sorry @Viennese Furbabies if it seems I'm speaking out of turn. I don't know you that well, after all.
Click to expand...
No problem. I put the post on here to vent but also to see if I'm over-reacting.
Yes, it came completely out off the blue that my friend wants Barney back.

The thing with my friend is that she has quite a history off breaking off with friends. My mum predicted that Barney could mean the end off our friendship. And yes, I should have put something in writing. But I made the mistake to think that we wouldn't need it because we are friends, have been for many years.

Right at this moment I think that the friendship is over anyway. This phone call yesterday was more than I can take at the moment.
If it was anything else, I would throw it at her feet. But we are not talking about a toy, we are talking about a live and breathing guinea pig.

At the moment, I don't know what my next step will be. I know that I should talk to her but I'm just so mad at the moment that I don't know if I won't say anything to make things even worse. 🙈
 
Morning
Not much of a friend if she is treating you like that. I think if you know it is best for them to stay with you, you should stand your ground, she in no way from what you've said indicated that this was a temporary arrangement else why would you have bonded him 🙁
 
I'm still very angry and also disappointed.

My circle of friends who is my inner guinea pig circle are also speechless. They think that I should either keep them or if I have to give them back, turn my back on my friend and offer no more help.

While at the moment I don't feel that my friendship has a chance to survive, I know that my friend doesn't have guinea pig backup like I do. And my heart brakes for them.
What happens when she has to go to hosiptal for a few days or during her operation and in the weeks after that?

I also talked to the specialist vet for a view from someone who can be more objective. Also to ask his opinion if she can force me to give them back because I don't have a contract of any kind.
He doesn't think that this is likely to happen but he also thinks that this could go on and on. To protect myself he would think it's better to give them back.
(Though Betty is technically my piggy, she doesn't have a right to claim her back. But of course they have got to stay together.)

My mum also thinks that I would be better off to give them back because I'm too worked up about the whole issue. She suggested that I ask one of my friends to drive them back to my "friend".

I still don't know what to do.
Yes, I know that I should talk to my friend.
And usually I'm always the one to make the first move but this time I couldn't do it (yet).
Today I'm not quite as mad as I was yesterday but I'm sad and disappointed :(
 
I don't think she could or would try to force you legally, that's a whooooole big strenuous hassle on top of whatever health problems she's dealing with. I don't think the lack of a written contract is going to make a practical difference. When I was still freelancing, I and all my freelance colleagues we had our contracts with clients whether verbal, written on paper or email. If a client refused to pay, we could point to the contract they'd agreed to and send reminders etc but if the clients absolutely refused which happened 3x in my circle of colleagues over the years, nobody went to court over it. Because not worth the fight for a few hundred euros. Learn lesson, vent to colleagues, blacklist client among colleagues and move on. My experience would say that's analogous for your "friend" - she won't engage a lawyer or go to small claims court. She may well vent to the world about you while probably not moving on emotionally.

What to do? Can you give yourself more time? And tell "friend" you need more time? I know it would be unusual, but if it would be helpful for you, could you email her instead of speaking? It can help to reduce the emotional charge in the atmosphere, both for needing more time and the actual discussion. I do it that way fairly often. Better that way than not at all. Or do you know of a (semi-)professional arbitrator (?correct word? I've forgotten in German too) who could sit in on your discussion and keep you and "friend" in the present with the issue at hand rather than dragging up the historical baggage of the "friendship" and any other emotional baggage, which you're probably both carrying, otherwise you wouldn't be as agitated as you are. Or if not an arbitrator, maybe someone skilled in nonviolent communication, someone neutral. The aims: deescalation, what's the real issue here, pragmatic solution everyone can live with. Best case scenario: you both feel heard by each other and bad feelings much reduced. It probably sounds like a long and arduous route, and you may not want to do it, may not be able to, "friend" may refuse anyway, but if it did work out, I believe it would help you achieve peace in your mind and soul, whatever the final decision is for Betty and Barney.

There are other completely different routes you could take, but I'll leave those suggestions to others.
 
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