My Boys Keep Fighting! Please Help.

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alex may

alex may

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hi there. very new to this forum, but desperatley needing some advice!
ive had my 2 boys, Benny & Mo, since I picked them up at 6 weeks old from pets at home.
always been very close, occasionally doing the usual 'bum wiggle' and 'mounting' - but no signs of fighting. they slept together, followed eachother around and played together.
we moved house 2 months ago (had the boys around 8 months now) and bought them a brand new C & C cage, and they love it, loads of room and popcorning all over. i clean them out every week and spot check 3 times a week. always tons of fresh food, hey and water etc.
however, around a month ago we took them to visit my mum, transported them in a proper carrier and they where fine on the journey, however we then introduced them to my mums 2 boys (same age) and they all bonded rather well, and shared a cage for one night.
however, once home i noticed Benny had a large bite wound on his back, Mo was fine now signs of fighting or wounds. took benny to the vet and thats all healed, no problems.
now this is where the problems started, occasionally started hearing teeth chattering and alot of running around etc. and whenever i started going near them, they would teeth chatter at me, especially Mo. i wondered if they had fallen out with me because of the change in routine, so ensured we had plenty of 'lap time' and cuddles. but Mo began biting me, not the usual little 'are you food?' nip but proper biting. the worst was when i put them both in their carrier as usual (its where i put them when i clean out the cage) and suddenly a huge fight errupted between them, had to separate and both had blood everywhere and Benny split his mouth. very worried and didnt know whether to put them back together, as i have no way of separating them without buying another cage, which i cannot afford right now. they now constantly chatter teeth and chase eachother round, and Benny is covered in scars and open scratch wounds.
came home from work today and this is what made me try some online advice...Benny's hair was all over the cage and he was bleeding from his mouth and had even more open wounds on his back. ive cleaned the cage out and separated them for about an hour - however had no choice but to put them back in cage. fine to start with, but just had to stop another fight! Benny is constantly hiding in the house, and Mo seems to be the main bully. but Benny still not accepting his dominance (he was originally the dominant one, and with zero complaint from Mo as he was the shy one) roles massively reversed!

i really need help. ive owned piggies for the last 10 years with my parents and only experienced male fighting around a pregnant female, nothing like this. these are my 2 piggies that ive owned by my self and i feel like I'm doing something wrong and keep getting upset that they seem angry at me! please help, as i fear i my have to give them up for adoption, and i dont want to do that as i love them both so much!

thank you for reading
 
These boys cannot live together at all. Sadly you have no choice but to separate them. Once blood has been drawn guinea pigs must be apart. The reason they fell out is they were introduced to two other boys. With boars a pair works best. Guinea pigs friendships are complicated. they cannot be introduced to new pigs then taken away again. They have to establish a hierarchy and this is very important to them.
 
so you would recommend a permanent separation? unfortunately i don't have the space for 2 cages, nor the money to buy another. it kills me that i have to do this, as ive always wanted two little friends! perhaps I should send one to be adopted? would introducing a younger male to Benny once he is on his own be a good suggestion? as i dont want to leave him alone.
 
Can you not extend the C and C slightly so it can be split in 2 and they can live alongside each other?
 
I am very sorry but, yes, I would not have them together any more. With guinea pigs you cannot just put two together and hope they get on. They have to work personality wise. The best way to get one a friend is to take him to a rescue were he can choose his own friend. That saves buying one and having them fall out. This locater will show you your nearest rescue,
http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/pages/guinea-pig-rescue-locator/

If your c and c cage is big is it possible to divide it into two and have them live as neighbours?
 
Hello and welcome to the forum.

Piggyfan is right. Pleased separate your boys immediately. Too much damage has been done and they are at risk of one either being seriously injured or even killed.

I am sorry that things have ended like this but it very much sounds like the balance was upset when you introduced your boys to your mums boys and the relationship has sadly ended.

Please do not beat yourself up but they really do need separating on a permanent basis.

Is there anyway you could have then living side by side so they can still talk to and see each other without having any physical contact?
 
my c & c cage has a bottom and a small top, however the bottom isn't big enough to split in 2 for both of them, I may have to buy extra grids and more corex to line it. it's strange as just been to check on them and both laid relaxing near eachother. It's such a shame, I thort introducing them to new little pals would be good for them, clearly it's disrupted their routine, as they where best friends before. I feel terrible ):
 
Please do not feel terrible. You were not to know that would happen. You clearly love your boys very much. If you can extend the cage they would both need 4 by 2 grids.

I am wondering how your mums boys are now?
 
it's strange as my mums boys are fine, no fighting or anything.
In regards to the c & c cage, would splitting the cage directly in the middle be a problem? I'm meaning putting the grids straight down the centre of the base? As they would be literally next to eachother? Is that a good thing? as I originally put a piece of card between them and they both freaked out but I think that's because they couldn't see each other?

This is all such a shock to me, I made a huge mistake. and Mo hates me..any advice as to why he bites me with intent?
 
Hi!

Could you please add your location to your details, as that will inform some of your options. Click on your username on the top bar, then go to personal details and scroll down to location.

I am very sorry that every change of territory and company (even just going back to the original pair) will start a new hierarchy sort-out between boars. Unfortunately, by mixing them with your mum's, you have very much de-stabilised their bond. This comes right in the middle of the big teenage hormones, which is the most difficult time for boars anyway.

You can either:
- keep your boys above each other (not ideal as it prevents interaction through the bars). How big is their cage anyway? Space is also a major factor in fall-outs.
- contact one of our recommended rescues that offer boar dating at the rescue, so you could re-bond either one or both boys with a new character compatible boy, depending on whether you can accommodate two cages on top of each other.
- neutering is only an option if you can plan on keeping a boy with a sow, provided that you have access to either a general vet with lots of piggy neutering practice or a small animal specialist with experience in fiddly ops. You would also have to factor in a full 6 weeks post op wait until a boy is 100%. One of my own sows is a surprise baby courtesy of a supposedly safe over 5 weeks post op boar. Unfortunately, neutering will do nothing to get your two boys to live peacefully together again.

Please separate your boys. once bites and bloody fights have happened, they won't go back together.
 
I am glad your mums piggies are okay.

I would separate the cage using more grids. Hopefully they can live next door to each other happily.

Mo does not hate you. He is at a tricky age were his hormones are all over the place. He may be trying to dominant you. I have a piggy who bites me. When she does it I blow on her to show I do not like it. She hates being blown on and stops. You may like to try that with mo.

I am sorry for not welcoming you to the forum. I was in such a rush to help you that I posted quickly. Welcome!
 
hi everybody! Thank you all so much for your welcome and your kind words and information. I have temporarily separated my boys.
Here is some cage info, it's a 3x2 c&c cage with a loft - but the loft is too small for one piggie, as a tempory option I have split the cage in an 'L' Shape and both seem settled and eating away happily for now. My main issue with my cage is that because it was ordered to size the corex is only big enough for 3x2 so expanding is difficult, the whole cage cost a bomb so it's abit difficult to sort right now. I am thinking of perhaps putting Mo up for adoption at a local rescue, as much as that will kill me, and maybe keep benny alone for awhile or get him a new friend.

I'm going to give them individual lap time and try and build a separate relationship with them both.

Would it be a suggestion to maybe send both to be re homed? As I don't want to have one rejected and sent away. It's all very confusing and as a new piggie owner, not something id like to have gone threw. As for benny, his back is very badly cut and full of scars ... would a vet be recommended or will he heal nicely?
 
My c and c is on the floor so I have no correx. I do not know if that is possible for you though.

You can give both boys to a rescue, if that is what you mean but then you will have no piggies. Is that what you meant?

If you post a picture of Bennys cuts and post them in health and illness then somebody can advise you on what to do.
 
I dont have correx.I think 3x2 is considered small for two boars.The badly injured one may need painkillers and antibiotica.Did you clean the sounds and put sudecrem on to stop infection?I have had to seperate my friends boars that were together for about eighteen months.Their cafè was only 100x50 cm soi knew it would happen
 
I now have 4 boars, two bonded pairs, one pair is on a bench in my spare room, in a large indoor hutch.The other on the floor in a huge indoor hutch. They will never meet. Despite them being bonded pairs, I have two small spare hutches in case of illness or fallouts. It is important to have a back up plan. Stuff happens. I have split cages and as long as they cannot get to each other they will live side by side.
 
Thanks again for everyone's adviced I have temporarily separated the boys, however they are still teeth chattering and biting furiously at the grids. I am thinking of putting benny in the loft above (obviously expanding to the same length as the base of the cage) and keeping mo in the bottom. it's a shame as I don't want them being alone and the closest rescue is a good drive away. I may have to live with having single piggies, as I don't think id like to give away either of them.
I've checked Benny's back (yes did a clean and soothed the wounds as best as I could, doesn't seen to be in any pain) cost and room is a huge problem for me and I go away next week and worrying even more as I have a friend looking after them.

I have another question, even tho the boys are separated would it be a good idea to have them together for play time (either on my lap with my partner or on the open floor) or would that result in more confusion?
 
My boars are in separate cages die to not getting on with one cage on top of the other (only possible way due to space) and they seem fine
My Cookie went through a stage of biting me, he still nips a bit but he's got a lot better! Think its just his age
 
No play time together. It'll just confuse them and they can still fight when supervised.

2 x 3 C&C is smaller than recommended for 2 piggies, so I would definitely try to increase it to 2x4 instead.

As they're still quite young I think it would be sad if they had to live out their lives without any company. I would seriously consider re-homing one and using a rescue to try to bond the other one with a new friend. Or rehoming them both.

How are the bite wounds?
 
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