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I am thinking of you! There is no "easy" or "right" solution in the situation you're in, and you have to figure out what is the best thing for you, for Winston and for Billy.

BIG HUG
 
mittenpie said:
I've cancelled the vets appointment which was supposed to be in an hour.

Winston's had a good breakfast this morning and has been drinking. He's sitting nose to nose with Billy at the moment which is rare (they get along but like their own space), it's like Billy understands what's coming. I feel so sad for Billy too, this is the second time he will have lost a friend. Poor piggies...
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it is very good that he is eating and drinking
 
Poor Winston and poor you, it is always a heart breaking decision which ever way you decide to do things, Just be there for him when his time comes, talk to him softly and help him over the bridge. If you are worried about him being in pain at all you can give him some calpol, not sure of the dose but someone here will be able to advise you.
 
I am so sorry.:( Sadly the best thing that you could do is to let him go to sleep as it will put him out of pain for ever. He will still remember you as he would have had a brilliant life.

So sorry again. x
 
mittenpie said:
I've cancelled the vets appointment which was supposed to be in an hour.

Winston's had a good breakfast this morning and has been drinking. He's sitting nose to nose with Billy at the moment which is rare (they get along but like their own space), it's like Billy understands what's coming. I feel so sad for Billy too, this is the second time he will have lost a friend. Poor piggies...
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That is so sad but Billy will look after him, if he is eating and drinking, then it is good...if he wasn't seriously distressed, I would let him go naturally in his own environment, they are like any other living creature, it happens to everyone and he will want to feel comfortable and happy at home as would we. :)
 
sharonS said:
If you are worried about him being in pain at all you can give him some calpol, not sure of the dose but someone here will be able to advise you.
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To add on to Sharon's post, the dose is 0.2ml.

Hugs. xx
 
I'm sorry to hear about Winston.
I know this isn't the same but my dog Rose had supposedly the most vicious form of cancer and we were advised to have her PTS. We decided not to and she lived another 15 months before having to have her PTS. This was a year ago today.
Vets are not always 100% correct.
Do what you feel in your heart.
 
This is a video of the noises Cashew made when he was suffering from an inflamed bladder caused by sludge, bladder and kidney stones - similar to your boys prognosis except he was misdiagnosed and when he was x-rayed again I went for surgery. This [noise] was almost constant or when he was trying to eliminate.

IF he is unfortunate enough to get a bladder stone stuck in his penis, preventing him from peeing, might I advise that you have him put to sleep as soon as possible (since surgery isn't possible) They make a horrible, horrible screaming version of what Cashew is doing in the below youtube video and cannot physically urinate. If he is unfortunate to have this happen, in my opinion from watching it happen to Cashew, it crosses a line of being humane to then let him die in the peace of his own home.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTMMyGSmGJ0[/ame]
 
Have you spoken to Vedra?
My big girl Bloss developed stones and collapsed with the pain. Had I not spoken with Vedra I would have had her put down.
It is worth at least discussing it with her.
 
I don't have any advice but if he is happy, eating, and drinking perhaps just wait and see how he is. If he goes downhill you can see a vet, however although sometimes I've had to get pets put to sleep, it's better for them (in my opinion) to sleep away at home with the people they love. I really hope he holds out a little longer.

Also sorry if I missed it but why can't he be operated on?:{
 
The vet said he can't be operated on because he has too many tiny little stones in his kidneys. If they were only in his bladder then they could be removed according to the vet...

I was thinking maybe there could be something we could give him to help his kidneys flush them through but there isn't.

I weighed him today and he has actually put on a little weight which gives me a little hope but the vet said he will die soon, it's just a question of how soon.

teadragon - Winston has NEVER made this noise, or any noise at all when he is weeing. The main symptom which caused us to notice he was unwell was him lifting his bottom when he went for a wee and then more recently he had bloody wee but now that has gone and he is weeing and pooing as normal.

B& the GGs - I tried to contact Vedra when I had a problem with my other guinea pig. She told me a time to call but there was no answer when I rang. I don't have her contact details now, do you have them?
 
Happy New Year everyone!

Thank you AP - I'll send her a text.

Winston is still here. I've just hand fed him some water and picked some grass from the garden for him which he is polishing off. He is eating but only certain things are tempting him.

Almost worringly he has put on more weight. I've got him on newspaper now to see if he is still passing water. I don't want to keep putting things in him if they're not coming out!

Hope everyone has a lovely day and isn't too hungover!
 
Hi Mittenpie

You have my sympathies as I have just had this occur with Fleure. She was diagnosed in early October with a large urethral stone (which was removed) and multiple kidney stones in each kidney. The only indication I had was that she stopped eating and hunched up wth pain.

Once she had the urethral stone removed she started eating again and was in less pain but the prognosis was poor becuase of the kidney stones. I got the urethral stone tested (it was carbonate,, NOT Oxalate) and so my lovely co-operative vet agreed to try her on destolit (same as actigall on guinea lynx) which is normally used to treat bladder stones. The information available said that it was meant to dissolve carbonate stones (rather than turn them into sludge which we were concerned would block up her kidneys even more) This was agreed as a last ditch attempt and we maintained her on metacam, splitting the dose and giving it twice a day rather than once.
I should point out however that Fleure was never squeaking in pain or had any pain while peeing and was very active, which is why the vet agreed to try the destolit. Any pain she did have appeared to be from the inflammation in her kidneys which would cause her to get spiky fur and sit or lie quietly until her next metacam dose - that's when I realised how important timing the doses was. Gradually we increased the metcam to its maximum dose.

For two months she had a good quality of life, was eating and peeing properly, very active and Grommie her cage mate was always at her side. I was closely monitoring her every day for the ultimate signs of renal failure, supplemented her food with Recovery each day and she had several trips to the vet during that time for check up. We took another X ray after about 6weeks to check on whether the destolit was having any effect but if anything it looked like the stones in her kidney were getting bigger.

The morning after her last check up, it became clear that she'd had enough and when I picked her up she stretched out and laid her head on my arm and looked into my eyes. I took her to the vet that day and found her kidneys had swollen overnight to four times their usual size (there had been blood in her urine for the first time the night before) so we then made the decision to put her to sleep there and then.

As to the effects of destolit - it really has only shown results with bladder as opposed to kidney stones judging by the reports on guinea lynx. I am therefore unconvinced as to whether it might be useful for kidney stones, even if the stones in the kidney are very small - perhaps Vedra might have an opinion on this?

I'm very sorry that you will at some point have to make the decision about Winston - however I hope that my experience shows that with proper pain maintenance and careful monitoring, Winston might have a good quality of life and enjoy being with his friend Billy a little while longer.

Sending you all lots of hugs and piggie kisses
xx
 
Stating the obvious, a pig that wants to eat is not not yet ready to die.
Let him have what he wants to eat.

Stones,sludge in the kidney are not the same as "floating free" in the bladder. I would think that kidney problems have to be dealt with whilst the particle size is still small enough to be flushed through the kidney substance.
 
I agree with you AP. He is willing to eat when he wants to and is not giving up yet. He is still passing urine although it is a little bloody but does not appear to be in any pain when doing so. I am going to enjoy him while he is here, however long that may be, he'll go when he's ready.

Thanks again everyone for your support.
 
sorry to hear about your piggie. If he is eating and drinking then I would be inclined to leave alone at this stage. My Mimsi was diagnosed with a bladder stone earlier in the year. He has had intermitten bleeding and discomfort upon urinating for years. It was only when I got my laptop and joined the forum that I read that his syptoms could be a bladder stone/kidney stone. The stone Mimsi has is fused into the bladder wall. I had to decide whether or not to put him through intricate bladder surgery or leave him as he is. As Mimsi has no other sypmtoms other than occasional blood in his urine and slight discomfort, I decided not to put him through the surgery. 8 months on and Mimsi is thriving. On occasion he has blood in his urine and some discomfort (which I give him baby calpol for). I have also identified foods that aggravate the bladder such a spinach, green leafy cabbage and broccoli. I avoid these now and Mimsi is living a happy life at the grand old age of 6. Mimsis case is quite unique though because the stone has fused into the bladder wall so it cannot mover, however it could get bigger so I have to keep a close eye on my special boy.
 
mittenpie - to take what AP said literally "give him what he wants" to eat; to be honest, at this stage, I'd give the pig whatever he bloomin' ever wanted to eat that I wouldn't let him have.

I know my pigs love things like Kale, carrots, spinach and other fabulous little nibblets that are too high in (something) for my pigs to eat and maintain long term health (eat in as much quantities as they want, these things are limited). Enjoy him. Spoil him. Do things with him that he'll enjoy.

:) It won't make the end any easier, but you'll know that he had a bloomin' awesome life with you to this point and beyond!
 
Aw i'm so sorry hun, but if he's in pain, it'll be for the best.:0 I was devestated when i had to have my cat PTS but it was the kindest thing to do. She had leukemia. We didn't know anything about it until she became un-balanced and falling over. We took her to the vet who x-rayed her. It was terrible 8... the x-ray showed she had leukemia passed around her whole body. She didn't look in pain but she was. 8... If the vet say's Winston's in pain, he most likely will be, even though you can't see it. It's up to you hun, but if he's in pain, it will be for the best and he'll pass whilst he's asleep. I'm so sorry, good luck xxxxxx
 
I can only repeat that, in my experience, a guinea pig that wants to eat is not in any discomfort. However, a pig that refuses food and cannot or will not swallow is near the end of it's life.
 
I would agree that if an animal still wants to eat and has its bodily functions, I would not call it a day, however as soon as a terminal animal, who has had all that can be done for it, stops eating- I would have it PTS. In renal failure they may not feel pain, but they will feel pretty crappy as the toxins flood the system. Whenever I have the option, I have the vet come out to the house for a PTS, regardless of the animal, it is, for me, the best way to remove stress and pain and discomfort at the end of a friendship.
 
It is very difficult, if not impossible, to guess how long a pig has left to live.
A few hours seems to be the maximum time from being alive and alert to the moment of death.
"A few hours"?....30 minutes upto three or four hours.
Many do slip into a coma, some just fade away.
The problem is there is only one chance to get it right.
 
Winston is still here! Bless him.

From what the vet said I wasn't expecting him to last the day after we took him home from his appointment on Wednesday so am amazed that the little guy is still fighting on. He seems too perky to be at deaths door.

I've just gone to the shop and got him some infant Calpol and given 0.2ml. Do I give this to him just once a day? Can anyone advise?

Thanks
 
Good to hear he's still fighting on and doing well.

Calpol can usually be given at that dose twice a day.
 
mittenpie said:
How do I know if he's in pain?

I am so torn as to what to do.

I'm sure he would rather pass away in his little house with his buddy beside him than on a cold vets table after a distressing car journey but can't bear the thought of him suffering...
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Guinea-pigs in pain sit hunched-up and lose interest in food and their surroundings. If he's moving around and appears happy in himself, then he should be okay.
 
Do not administer any pain killer until it is needed. A regular, ie twice daily dose, that is not needed will lose it's effectiveness so that if the pig does need pain relief the standard dose ie 0.2ml will not be so effective.
 
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alcesterpigs said:
Do not administer any pain killer until it is needed. A regular, ie twice daily dose, that is not needed will lose it's effectiveness so that if the pig does need pain relief the standard dose ie 0.2ml will not be so effective.
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I concur ...hold on until he really needs it..you [*]will[/*] know (NB - you have already shown what an observant guinea mamma you are) - his fur will go spikey and he will reduce eating etc and be less active

Hugs and strength...

x
 
I really do wish Winston, his buddy and you all the best in what time you have together. I'm sorry, I've only just seen this thread. Lots of love and best wishes from me and my tribe xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
 
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