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Ongoing respiratory problem

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Flower_Girl

Junior Guinea Pig
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Please bear with me with this post, I feel so lost and helpless at the moment in this situation, I'm hoping that someone might have some suggestions as to what this might be or what I can do to help my little pig. I tried to include as much detail as possible.

My 6 year old sow Indy has been having respiratory problems for about 2 months now. I've seen two different exotics vets - they both believed it was most likely a URI and she has been on various antibiotics now for the past month, with no improvement. Her breathing has got worse, and I'm at such a loss as to what to do. My vet is away until after Christmas but she has recommended an x-ray and steroids as the next course of action, as she now believes it may be a mass growing in Indy's upper respiratory tract which is partially blocking her airways.

At the beginning of this, Indy seemed completely unaffected by the breathing but it the past couple of weeks she has become much quieter and has now stopped eating hay completely. She will eat veggies, pellets, oats and treats, but I have been trying to top her up every day with critical care, and have also been giving 2-3ml Fibreplex daily on the advice of both vets as her poos have been very small/irregular over the past few weeks. Her breathing is now very noisy a lot of the time and often seems laboured and irregular, which again my vet thinks is due to a possible mass growing higher up.

It started out as an occasional raspy sort of breathing, it wasn't laboured at all and she seemed otherwise completely normal. She was put on 0.6ml Baytril/day for five days with Metacam (0.3ml/day) for three days, which seemed to sort it out and her breathing returned completely to normal, but a week after stopping the Baytril the rasping came back.

The vet then put her on a 3 week course of Ronaxan, but after about a week of this the breathing got a lot louder. My vet was away so I took her to a different vet who wanted to put her back on the Baytril (0.36ml/day) for a week. I went back a week later with no change and he added Septrin (0.26ml twice daily) and told me to carry on with the Baytril (at 0.32ml/day). After another week without change I went back to my original vet.

From what she can hear, the vet doesn't think there's a heart problem, and she doesn't think Indy's lungs sound particularly bad. She has had me start Indy on Metacam again and has upped the Baytril dose to the original 0.6ml once a day from last Wednesday. She recommended nebulising Indy 2-3 times daily with F10 and Bisolvon which I have been doing since Saturday. However, she has said that she doesn't believe this is an infection so this is just a final "making sure" that it's not a URI.

Going from other advice/posts I've seen on here and other sites I thought it might be heart related, but neither of the vets I've seen have thought this is very likely. I know I need to see another vet soon - my vet has said that her colleague will see me while she's away and would be willing to do a concious x-ray/prescribe steroids as per her instructions but I feel like at this point I'm not really happy to see a non-exotics vet as we don't actually know for sure what this is. But I don't know if that's the right call either.

Just don't know what to do at this point, any suggestions? :(
 
I would definitely go for a conscious xray, as you will be able to see if there is any fluid on her lungs or an enlarged heart etc.
 
The symptoms you describe are identical to what our oldie girl, Sheila had recently :(
Vet gave her Baytril for suspected URI which had no effect so took her to an exotic vet who immediately diagnosed pleurisy and trachitis (the raspy, clicking sound you may be hearing)
Hannah (vet) prescribed Bisolvon, Loxicom and Marbocyl for 2 weeks which helped but I had to syringe CC as top up food, mushed her pellets as she wasn't interested in food/veggies.
It has helped, she is herself again now - hay was an issue as she wouldn't touch it so gave Readigrass as an alternative which she liked. She's now fine but occasionally, I can hear the slight rasp in her throat - her quality of life is great and vowed I wouldn't have her go through examinations etc. but our exotic vet is so amazing, probably would as long as it didn't cause too much distress to Sheila. I just keep her pen scrupulously clean and warm, she has two heat pads in there which are reheated 2-3 times a day and a thick fleece cover the whole pen at night.
Really hope you find a solution and your baby doesn't have to be subjected to lots of tests :(
Such a worry these furloves and sending gentle healing vibes and hugs to you all :rose
 
Thank you both. x>>

It sounds like it might be worth finding another exotics vet for another opinion if I can instead of going back to my current practice and seeing the non-exotics vet. I'm not sure how easy that'll be though, I feel like I'm running out of places to try! I just wish I knew what the problem was at this point.

GPSlave, I bought some readigrass for her hoping she'd go for it but no. She will eat dried herbs so I tried "craftily" mixing a bit of readigrass into a handful of herbs this morning but she wasn't fooled! Thankfully she's still keen for her veggies but I'm really struggling to keep her weight up.
 
My pig had similar symptoms, I took her to a different vet by chance who was insistent it was pneumonia despite me describing it as sounding like a partial obstruction. He scoped her to do a tracheal wash, and actually found that she had abscesses on the back of her throat which had not responded to her previous treatments by my regular vet (baytril and septrin, septrin and marbocyl, nebulisation, bisolvon, metacam). He was able to lance and drain one under GA And sent me away with a long course of azithromycin. Seemed to do the trick until a few days after finishing the antibiotics, when her symptoms returned. He scoped her again and 2 of the original 3 abscesses had reformed. He lanced and drained these, more antibiotics, and she's been fine ever since.

They said that they have never seen it before, but that doesn't mean to say its not more common, but people don't necessarily go to the lengths of investigation that I did.

A CT scan would yield more information than an X-ray if this option is available to you. If you're considering a second opinion, try contacting the small animal practice at the royal veterinary college. They have a fully functioning veterinary surgery with some of the most knowledgable exotics vets in the country.
 
Thanks for the recommendation Belinda, unfortunately I think that would be at too far for me to get to at the moment but I really appreciate the suggestion.

Thanks Amanda - the second vet I saw was actually one of the exotics vets at the Beaumont Sainsbury who was also thought it was most likely to be an infection (he also suggested pneumonia) - my main worry with going back to them is that he wanted to do an x-ray as a next step and basically told me that it wouldn't be worth doing unless they put her under GA, which I'm not willing to do at this point as she is now very poorly. The vet I saw did seem very knowledgeable though so I would be willing to go back, I know they have another exotics vet there too so it might be worth seeing her for a third opinion.
 
No change really, she is still having periods of really awful sounding breathing. After 3+ straight weeks, I'm fairly sure this isn't going to improve with the baytril so I'm stopping that today and hoping that I can get her poos back to normal. She has eaten quite a lot of CC today (she was keen enough to eat off the spoon which is so much nicer for us both) and is currently giving her dinner plate a thorough check for any leftovers. I will definitely be asking for at least an x-ray at the next visit, just wish my vet wasn't away this week.
 
It's good that she's eating - Sheila took hers off a spoon and my little finger.
Sending more healing vibes for Indy, she's obviously in very good hands :rose
 
I suggest try vet call CJ Hall in Mortlake, I trust them 100% they fixing a lot of problems with our pigs and chins.
Make sure cage always clean.We keep ours on vet bed.
 
Thank you Kotov, unfortunately they're quite awkward for me to get to on public transport but if I can find someone to give me a lift I'll give them a call to see if they can see Indy in the next few days, I don't want to be carting her on and off trains in the cold. I hope the receptionists I've been dealing with aren't completely sick of me constantly ringing up to transfer notes here and there.

Indy hasn't got any worse in the last few days but I'm still not happy with her poos. She's still not showing even the slightest bit of interest in her hay. She's had a good chew on a new cardboard box house I've given them though and is still the most enthusiastic at veggies time but she's been sleeping a lot otherwise. I'm still concerned that this may be a heart problem.
 
This happened to my guinea pig, he sadly passed away today!
But deffo go for the X-ray as I've read that it could have been caused by an enlarged heart but my vet said it was proberly pneumonia that cause my Alfie to pass away
 
Thanks Rachael, so sorry to hear about your Alfie. :(

I'll give CJ Hall a call first thing tomorrow morning to see if they have any appointments next week.
 
My piggy also has that rasping clicking sound so I will take him to the vets as I'm a little worried now what it may be
 
CJ Hall were closed yesterday but I've made an appointment for tomorrow morning with another clinic which I've been to once before so hopefully they can shed some light on this, and it's not too far. Indy is now eating only veggies and a very tiny amount of pellets/oats by herself, I'm trying to get as much CC down her as I can but she's still losing weight. She's being fairly cooperative with the syringe/spoon feeding though which is a relief. Really hope to get some answers tomorrow.

Mizzpigz - I do hope your piggy is okay, it's always best to get these things checked if you're worried but hopefully it's nothing!
 
Nothing to add to the advice been given on the thread, hope you can get some answers for Indy.
Lots of healing vibes to her.
 
And flower girl I hope your piggy is back on her piggy toes x
 
Thank you everyone, your support is very much appreciated.

Just a quick update: the new vet thinks it is most likely an obstruction of some sort growing in Indy's throat somewhere. (Interesting as my regular vet thinks it is an obstruction in her nasal passage ...) She's had a short acting steroid injection and is back on the baytril, and we're going back on Thursday to re-evaluate. It's been a day and a half and there's no change yet, she sounds absolutely awful today. On Sunday evening she did start eating a bit of hay though which was a relief, but it is really only a bit of a nibble here and there so I'm carrying on with the CC.

The vet also tried to get a look in her mouth and she sort of...regurgitated some yellowish liquid which he thought had been sitting in the back of her throat? He was going to take a look at it under a microscope so maybe that'll shed some light.

I'm feeling really down about this at the moment, I just really hope she's showing some improvement tomorrow.
 
Do please talk yo your vet about using azithromycin (see Amanda's post earlier). If they need advice on its use in guinea pigs they can speak to vet Simon Maddock as he routinely uses it, especially in the treatment of abscesses.

Cat and Rabbit Care Clinic Ltd
1 Limehurst Square
Duston
Northampton
NN5 6LP

Telephone: 01604 478888

I have used it in the treatment of a very difficult eye infection where other meds had failed.

HTH

Suzy x
 
Hi Flower Girl! So sorry to hear about Indy. Where are you based in London? I see you've got an appointment with CJ Hall and that was a vet I was considering to go to with my tribe of piggys but like you I have to use public transport as I don't have a car and it was awkward for me to get there.

My vet recently sent me as a referral to a place in North Kent which is quite easy to get there from London using public transport. There are two exotic vets, one of which has her own guinea pigs (40!) and both vets come highly recommended by me - there is also a hospital.

There is also another exotic vet in Charlton which is very close to the train station. I used to go there for a number of years - there is one exotic vet there who I can apsolutely recommend.

I do hope you get some answers at CJ Hall but should you need to go elsewhere, I'm happy to let you have details of any of those practices.

Thinking of you and Indy xxxxx
 
Thanks Suzy, I'll definitely ask about azithromycin and take Simon's details with me tomorrow.

Dolomite, thank you so much for your recommendations. I'm in North London. I didn't actually manage to get an appointment with CJ Hall so I went to the Village Vet in Hampstead on Monday which is their exotics practice. Is the Charlton vet the Barrier Animal Care Clinic? That's where I've been taking Indy but the vet is away for a couple of weeks. Could you post or message me details of the Kent practice too? It'd be great to have details of another recommended place just in case I need it.

Thank you both x
 
oh I'm sure you must be quite worried for her.

I really hope that things get better with your much loved piggy : )
 
Hello
Chronic respiratory disease is quite common in Guinea pigs and can be due to a variety of factors. A chest X-ray is always a good idea as it will give an indication of heart enlargement or the presence of fluid in the chest. If the heart looks enlarged a scan would be a good idea. Heart disease is under diagnosed in guinea pigs.
Chronic pneumonia is also common and is visible on an X-ray. A blood sample carried out at the same time will show evidence of infections and also give a bit of a body profile.
There are lots of medications available depending on the problem. I have to say I don't use steroids in guinea pigs much as they can suppress the immune system.
I would anaesthetise for the X-rays and blood sample. It will give the opportunity for a detailed mouth examination. At my practice we regularly anaesthetise sick guinea pigs and with the right protocol this shouldn't present a problem.
Goodluck
 
Thanks Suzy, I'll definitely ask about azithromycin and take Simon's details with me tomorrow.

Dolomite, thank you so much for your recommendations. I'm in North London. I didn't actually manage to get an appointment with CJ Hall so I went to the Village Vet in Hampstead on Monday which is their exotics practice. Is the Charlton vet the Barrier Animal Care Clinic? That's where I've been taking Indy but the vet is away for a couple of weeks. Could you post or message me details of the Kent practice too? It'd be great to have details of another recommended place just in case I need it.


Thank you both x



I'll PM you xx
 
Saw the vet again on Thursday and he seems to think that there's not much else to be done for Indy. He still thinks the most likely cause is some kind of growth somewhere which is causing the noisy breathing and also the fluid accumulation at the back of her throat, and that basically there's nothing else we can do as the steroids didn't seem to have any effect.

I mentioned azithromycin but as he hasn't used it before in guinea pigs he didn't want to prescribe it, but he took Simon Maddock's details and said he'd give him a call and also maybe see if Simon had any other ideas for Indy. I haven't heard back from him so possibly he hasn't been able to get through to Simon yet but I'll give him a call in a couple of days if I don't hear from him then.
 
Saw the vet again on Thursday and he seems to think that there's not much else to be done for Indy. He still thinks the most likely cause is some kind of growth somewhere which is causing the noisy breathing and also the fluid accumulation at the back of her throat, and that basically there's nothing else we can do as the steroids didn't seem to have any effect.

I mentioned azithromycin but as he hasn't used it before in guinea pigs he didn't want to prescribe it, but he took Simon Maddock's details and said he'd give him a call and also maybe see if Simon had any other ideas for Indy. I haven't heard back from him so possibly he hasn't been able to get through to Simon yet but I'll give him a call in a couple of days if I don't hear from him then.

Simon will always call a vet back, even if he can't speak to them at that particular time. I know they have been having problems with email at the Cat and Rabbit Clinic, so a phone call is definitely the best way to communicate at the moment. I am more than happy to have your piggie to stay for a few days if you wanted Indy to be seen by Simon.
 
That's very kind Debbie, thank you. I'll call the vet tomorrow and see what's going on, I did give him the phone number and he said he would call but he may have had time off over the past week or just not had the chance to speak directly to Simon. When I've spoken to him I can think about what to do next. If there's a chance this may still be treatable, coming up to Northampton to see Simon is an option.
 
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