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Pigglywink's been sick

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Pigglywink's Rachel

Hi, I just joined the forum, but I've been browsing for the past couple days. I just had a question, wondering if someone could help me.

My guinea pig, Pigglywink, got sick about a week and a half ago with a foot infection (Bumblefoot?). I took her to the vet last Sunday, emergency call, as she'd been a bit off her feed (which is what led to the close examination, allowing me to realize that she had an infection between the pads on her front foot). Anyway, due to this, the vet prescribed her antibiotics (chloramphenicol), which I've been giving her, along with suggesting that I bathe her foot in a weak saline solution two to three times a day.

I followed the vet's instructions regliously, and it cleared the foot infection (it's almost completely back to normal), but she still didn't recover her appetite and stopped drinking water. I found that I was able to get her to eat her pellets only if I softened them with a little bit of water first, but she was still not interested in her greens, or her hay, and she was still not drinking. I should probably also mention that I was giving her water orally via syringe.

Anyway, I took her back to the vet today, as yesterday she didn't produce any stools at all, and only one small pee. And she was totally off her food, wouldn't eat at all.

The vet examined her and noted that there seemed to be some impaction in her cheeck pouches, so he decided to x-ray her, which he did, but in order for them to get a clear shot, they gave her a mix of ketamine and valium (they'd tried taking the x-ray four times, but there was no way to keep her still).

Ok, getting to the end of the story now...

I went to pick her up from the vets, and he showed me in the x-ray that there were no formed stools anyway in her digestive track, just what he termed sludge. He said that the antibiotics had interfered with her GI tract, and told me that I should give her yogurt in order to boost her digestive bacteria count. He also told me that he'd given her some fluids through the skin (subcutaneous?).

Pigglywink has now sort of come out of the drugged stupor (she's unsteady on her feet), but the first thing she did was make a dash for her food dish, and since then (for about the last thirty minutes), she's been going back and forth between her food dish and her water dish, eating more than she's eaten total in the last week.

So my question is this... do these drugs have an appetite increasing effect? Or is she feeling better because of the fluids he got into her?

And also, does anyone have any suggestions for how much yogurt it's safe to allow a guinea pig to have? He told me to give her either 3 mL, or 5 mL three times a day until she's eating normally again and producing normal stools, and I don't want to give her too much, but at the same time, I don't want to give her too little.

This is my first ever guinea pig, and I want to make sure that I do this right. And I also want to make sure that she gets back to full health, as I was hoping to introduce her to a new friend, but I obviously don't want to risk her infecting another guinea pig.

Oh, and, sorry to keep running on, how long, once I get the new guinea, should I keep it quarantined to make sure it doesn't have something that it might give to my Piggly?

Thanks,
Rachel
 
Hi Rachel. Personally I would definately not give my piggie yoghurt as they don't eat dairy foods and it is not an essentially part of their diet. The first thing I would recommend is bio-lapis. This is something that can be given when piggies are on antibiotics which protects their tummies from being affected by the antibiotics, which seems to have happened in Pigglywink's case. I think this would be a much better thing to syringe her rather than yoghurt. There are certain things that I would recommend you keep in the house as I first aid box for your piggie. The first thing is critical care which is a liquid food to be made up with water and syringed to your piggie when she is not eating. Secondly vitamin c supplement. The chewable ones that humans have are fine. When your piggie is under the weather half a tablet for about a week will help her as vitamin c is the most important thing in a piggie's diet as they don't make their own. This can be purchased from your vet or other people on the forum can suggest websites that they have used. How is the bumblefoot looking now? It would be good for you to contact a lady called Chrissie. You can get her email from www.gorgeousguineas.com She sells a very good balm that can go on your piggie's feet which helps soften the pads and helps piggie's with bumblefoot. Something I found helped my piggie when she had bumblefoot was Savlon. You buy it in a spray on form from a chemist. It has to be the spray on form as this contains iodine which will protect the pads. It will leave a slight brown mark on her feet but don't worry that's the iodine. Hopefully this will help and welcome to forum, rachel x
 
great post as a reply :) Your piggy may be feeling better which is why his/her appetitie has imrpoved vitamin B is great for improving apetite if your guinea is off their food.
 
Thank you for your help... I've contacted a local pet supplier, and they said they could have some Critical Care for me in two weeks (they have to order it special... apparently it's not part of the regular stock for local stores?). I've also ground up half a chewable vitamin C tablet and mixed it with her food.

That leads into my new problem... which I'm thinking might be more behavioural than actual illness. Pigglywink ate well while I was giving her the foot soak this morning (still ground up pellets with a little bit of water... you can form the paste into the same shape as the original pellets, but I guess it's softer and easier to chew?), and drank a fair bit of water. But once I put her back in her cage, nothing at all... didn't want to eat, drink, nothing, just sat in her little house looking miserable.

So this afternoon, when I got back from shopping, I decided to take her out and see if I could get more water into her. I didn't fill the sink, since I don't want her to get too wet, but I did put her in the sink (since it makes a handy bowl), and, since the sink was empty, I put the food dish and water dish in there (I'd taken them directly out of her cage, so this is the food she was refusing to eat) while I got ready to mix up a new batch of food. And I noted, while I was reaching for the food, that she had her head buried in the food bowl with occasional breaks for a drink of water.

So now my concern is that she'll only eat while she's in the bathroom sink. She's been in there eating steady for the last twenty minutes (I finally took the top off of her cage and hooked it around the faucet so she can't put it off, so I don't have to worry about her climbing out and falling onto the floor). How do I get her to accept eating in her cage, or at least not in the sink... my son and I really need to use it sometimes, and I can't think a bathroom is the healthiest place to keep an animal anyway.

Thanks in advance for your help... I know it sounds like a stupid worry, but I just don't know what to do with her... do they have psychiatrists for guinea pigs? (just joking)
 
maybe try the same technique but in the room where she stays and with Piggly on your lap for a few feeds. She might just like being fussed over. Gradually she may be able to eat again on her own in her home.
When my (late) Rene was sick, I had to serynge feed him quite a lot. He got better for a while but would not eat unless on kitchen worktop to start with or if I wasn't in the room with him. It was easier than the sink, admittedly, but it meant that many other things could not be done at that time...
BTW, your posts are really funny and witty! :(|)
 
Perhaps she's lonely? Pigs do like company of their own kind. But of course wait until she feels a little better before considering this. and I would definately recommend getting a friend from rescue, if only to guarentee the health and sex of the guinea.

Also, something you said your vet had said - that her cheek pouches needed examining, I thought only hamsters had cheek pouches and while guineas have cheek areas it's more likely to be teeth issues that would make this inflamed, anyone know?
 
As to getting a pig from rescue... I know most of you are in the UK, but does anyone know if there's any cavy rescue societies on Vancouver Island in British Columbia, Canada? I tried doing a Google search, but it kept spitting me back to breeders, and referring me to the SPCA (which I mentioned in a separate thread doesn't get many guinea pigs here for some reason). I know they probably have some over on the mainland, but that's a three hour drive on top of a two hour ferry trip. And of course I wouldn't get a friend until Piggly's feeling better and I can afford a bigger cage (the one I have is only 80 cm by 50 cm).

PS

Well, I tried moving Piggly's closer to her cage to feed her... she won't eat from her dish while I'm holding her, but I was able to give her some applesauce through a syringe (unsweetened, basically mushed up apples, strawberry & kiwi, figuring it might add to her vit c component?). The only progress I've made is that she evidently views the bathtub as a really big sink, and so an acceptable place to eat in, so at least I can leave her in there with her food dish and water for a while, with the door closed to keep the cat out, but why, oh why, won't she eat in her cage? I'm taking the food and water dishes straight out of her cage and putting them into the tub... no alterations or additions... what's the difference?

Only thing is that she won't eat her greens now... I've offered her all of her favorites (red chard, parsley, kale, sunflower sprouts, pea shoots, field greens), and she sniffs them and leaves them, but she keeps looking at me for a treat, and I don't know what else to offer her. Any suggestions as to what an extremely picky guinea pig might be tempted by in the fresh veggie department?

Anyway, she's evidently getting some food and water into her, because she's been doing a lot of peeing and pooing. Her stools are smaller than normal, but they aren't too hard or soft, and the colour isn't weird. Totally stupid question, but their urine is supposed to be yellow right? Just a little milkier than humans?
 
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If she likes the bathroom maybe you could sit on the floor with her in the bathroom and put her food and water down on the floor close to you and she might eat that way. My piggie used to love celery. It's also good for the kidneys. Hopefully the links below will help with you choose some differenr fruit/veg. Some piggies are fussy. My sow used to eat carrots for a couple of months and then didn't want them, and then she wanted them again - they are really cheeky :)) Let us know how she gets on.

http://www.guinealynx.info/diet_vegs.html
http://www.guinealynx.info/diet_fruit.html
 
rw3399 said:
Some piggies are fussy. My sow used to eat carrots for a couple of months and then didn't want them, and then she wanted them again - they are really cheeky :))
Click to expand...

I agree, mine too. They will go bananas for one type of food for a few weeks and then nada for months, then again crackers for it... I find that the turn over is more and more frequent.... cheecky things!:Ayociexp121:
 
Well, I've just been to the grocery store... bought cucumber, bok choy, green beans, spinach-endive-arugala blend, and a couple sprouts. See how we got on with this. Also got some baby food for syringe feeding if necessary. Can guinea pigs have rice? The only green blends (pea and green bean) are mixed with brown rice flour... would that be safe to give to Pigglywink?

Try her out with this when I get home from work tonight and see if i can't tempt my little piggy. I'm at my wits end dealing with this situation... I've made so many stupid mistakes today because all I can think about is my poor babymallethead
 
Dunno with rice, sorry.
I can empathise with work situ. I was a nervous wreck at work when Rene was ill and my password at work is pig related so every time I logged on my heart would twitch...
 
I'm just lucky I work for an understanding lawyer, even if he and all of my co-workers are laughing at me for how much I've spent on vet bills for Pigglywink in the last couple weeks.
 
I'm lucky my headteacher is an animal lover. So I was able to gt paid time off for when rene went into surgery. I would have been happy with unpaid leave... My point is that I wouldn't love my boys any more if they were horses, size does not matter... Plus, the little creatures are under our supervision and care and cannot take themselves to the GP, so ethically, it's the only thing to do. :)
 
Poor little Pigglywink, I hope she gets better soon. I love her name by the way!
Not sure if its been mentioned already, but whenever my piggies or rabbits have been off their food the one thing that will always get them eating again is fresh grass and dandelion leaves..

Fingers crossed for her!
 
grass is great but in this season it's not too nutritious. What's the weather like in western Canada at this time of year?
 
I live in a temperate zone, so it's wet... very rainy... grass is dying off, but still green. I tried picking some fresh dandelion leaves for her (they grow year round here, just don't flower in the winter), but she wanted nothing to do with them. I also offered her some rye grass that I grow in a tray for Sunny (the black and white cat), but she didn't want that either. She's never been much of one for hay either, now that I think about it... hmmm...

Edit addition:

How often should I be making her eat, since she's still refusing to just eat on her own? Is there any validity to the claim that if you just leave them with food that they'll eat (ie the softened pellets and few vegs she'll still eat) in her cage, when she gets hungry enough she'll eat it?

As well, does anyone know what the veggie is from the following description? It's purply-red and white (like red cabbage), and the texture is somewhere between cabbage and romaine lettuce? She really seemed to enjoy it tonight (only in the bathroom, of course), and I'd like to get more of it, but it doesn't say on the salad package what type of veggies it contained besides spinach, and I know it wasn't spinach.
 
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And now, better and better, diarrhea (sp?). It's not liquid, just very loose, and almost tarry in it's texture, and a lot stinkier than her normal poos. Please, anyone, any suggestions? I feel like such a horrible person that I just can't seem to help her...
 
she's getting too much fresh foods and not ebough dry. Pellets and hay are the usual remedy... Try biolapis too.
 
If she has loose poops it could either be the antibiotics or the veg/fruit. Are you giving her bio-lapis to protect her tummy from the meds? This should help with the loose poops. If she is not eating on her own yet then just syringe either critical care or baby food as she may have had too much fruit/veg in short space of time. The critical care is timothy hay based and will be good for her digestion. When re-introducing veg give small amount of one type or fruit/veg and then gradually introduce more so as not to upset her tummy again. It is often hard when any animal is ill knowing what to do for the best but it sounds like you are doing a good job. How is she today?
 
Just caught up on all of this and wanted to ask how she's doing?

Sounds like she needs a pro-biotic to help her guts with good bacteria, which is what Bio Lapis or AviPro are, but I don't know if you can get them where you are? That's why the vet suggested live yoghurt, because of the 'good' bacteria - but as has been said, yoghurt itself isn't good for guineas.

Guineas should eat a lot of hay as part of their diet as it keeps their teeth down. If she's not eating hay, are her teeth ok? If her teeth are bad it may be putting her off food - just a thought!

The important thing is to keep her guts moving i.e regular feeds / syringe feeding / grass and fluids, as once their guts stop moving it's very hard to pull them round.

Hope she's ok, thinking of you

Sophie
x
 
Just finished giving her a morning feeding... I'm still not sure that I'm doing this correctly. I've been giving her softened pellets (about 4 mL), some sweet potato baby food (2 mL), Bio-K (probiotic, non-dairy (1mL) and as much water as I could get into her (it's hard to tell because she keeps spitting it out by pushing it to the side of her mouth with her tongue), (probably about 5 mL). Is that enough for one feeding? And how often do I need to be doing it if she won't eat?

Anyone have any suggestions for how I can get to try hay? I've always provided her with some, but she's never eaten much.

Total current situation:

Peeing a lot (or more), yellow-white urine
Pooing barely at all, soft and sticky when she does
Eating only when hand fed, although no resistance at all to being hand fed
Not drinking much water
One eye is producing a pus-like substance and seems more inflamed than the other (which looks normal)

All of this is the same as last time I took her to the vet, and I've contacted them by phone. They told me that there isn't anything more that they can do and that I need to let nature take its course.

She's no longer on antibiotics, and hasn't been for three days, and I've been giving her Bio-K (soy based formula) for the probiotic issue. Also, been giving her humans chewable vitamin C mixed with her mushy food (syringe fed).

Somebody earlier said something about vit B for increasing appetite... what type of vit B, and how much?

Oh, sorry, and the vet had a good look at her teeth when she was out for the x-ray... he said that everything looked good... no indication of scraping on the tongue or cheeks, and her teeth seem to line up properly.
 
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If she is no better and has not been on any meds for 3 days I would probably be thinking about getting a second opinion from a different vet. I don't mean to worry you but she still sounds quite poorly. What did he say about her eye? Is her nose running. If so is it clear? Can you hear any rattling from her nose/chest? I'm asking because if she is still not eating and her eye is runny, she might have the start of a urti - upper respiratory tract infection. The other possibility could be that she has poked herself in the eye with some hay. Have you checked to see if there is anything in her eye? If it starts to cloud over she will have to go back to the vets. Boil some water, leave it to cool and then clean any muck from the eye. Try giving her the vitamin c without the water. By crushing the vitamin c and adding it to water, the strength of it is being reduced. See if she will take it herself. Otherwise try crushing it and sprinkling it on to cucumber or something like that and see if she will take it that way. Has she lost much weight? I would advise weighing her now for the next couple of days. When syringe feeding/hand feeding her I would give her as much as she is willing to take. At least that way you know that she has some food inside her.
 
She's a very poorly little piggy, but I just don't know what else to do for her. The vets don't know what to do either. She's seen two different vets, and the only option for a third opinion isn't feasible (too far away). The vets main concern right now seems to be with getting her eating again, as she's lost about a quarter of her body weight in the last month (went from 1.01 kg to 0.77 kg). It's very serious... very bad... I know this.

The issue with the eye started at the same time as the foot infection, and she hasn't developed any respiratory symptoms. She sneezed once in the last two weeks (when her nose got too close the water), but she's not producing anything from her nose, isn't having any problems breathing, and her other eye is perfectly fine.

I don't want to keep taking her back to the vet so that they can tell me how serious it is (I know it's serious, why else am I taking her to the vet?), or telling me that there really isn't anything they can do. We've ruled out pretty much everything with her body, skeleton, etc. We know she has some kind of infection that she's still trying to fight off, and I'm not willing to have another go-round with the antibiotics at this point, as they seem to have made her worse rather than helping her... yay, her foots cleared up and now she's dying, so at least she'll leave a beautiful body for me to cry over.

Sorry, I'm just frustrated with the vets... the first one she saw (that put her on the antibiotics), I don't think she really knew what she was doing, and it made things worse for my Piggly, rather than better, and the second vet admitted that she's pretty far gone and there isn't a great deal he can do at this point. He ruled out mouth problems as to the cause of not eating, checked out her GI tract to make sure food was making it into her somewhere along the way, and suggested what I could do to try to help her digestive process get started up again.
 
I'm sorry things are difficult for you and for Pigglywink. I'm sure I speak for everyone on the forum by saying that we will help you as much as we can. There is something over here in the UK called Metatone which I think some of the people on here have used for their piggies. It is like a pick you up tonic for people who are run down or have been poorly and it helps give the body a boost. Are you able to get this? The only thing is I don't know what dose you would give.
 
I bought some Metatone for the pigs (as a standby!) at the weekend but have now started taking it myself! It's got B12 in it which helps stimulate the appetite.

I have a very poorly pig who has lost lots of weight, similar to yours, and wasn't eating, and the vets gave him a shot of B vitamins to kick-start his appetite. It's a short term fix but it did get him eating again...

I really feel for you, it's awful when they're ill and you don't know what to try for the best. It sounds like you're doing everything you can - get as much food down her as possible, lots of fluids, and keep trying. As long as she's still trying, there's hope.

Keep us posted

Sophie
x
 
Daktarin Oral Gel

Hi Rachel

I had a similar problem when my piggie refused to eat following antibiotics for a respiratory infection.
Vedra at Cambridge Cavy Trust thought it likely that the antibiotics had left her susceptible to thrush in the mouth and that she was having difficulty eating hay because her mouth was sore. She was prescribed Daktarin Oral Gel (available from the chemist) and within a couple of days was eating normally again.

Have a look at Peter Gurneys advice http://www.oginet.com/pgurney/mouthinf.htm

"The dose for the oral gel is a dab in the mouth three times daily for a week, reduced to twice daily for another week. Sometimes it may be necessary to continue for one more week at the dose rate of once a day."

Hope this helps - I know how upsetting it can be.
 
How would I get this in her mouth? Would soaking a Q-Tip with it and then putting it in to dab on either cheek work? I love my Piggly ever so much, enough to spend all my money on vet bills and special tempting foods and medicines... but not quite enough to stick my finger in her mouth for removal (I don't even love my human kid that much).
 
Sorry forgot to say how to get gel in mouth without losing fingers! I wrapped piggie firmly in a towel to stop any wriggling (just so that head is visible) place her back against your chest. Squeeze about half an inch of Daktarin out of the tube and administer it on the back of a small metal tea spoon. I didn't find this easy, but when she opened her mouth slightly I was able to gently paste some of the gel on her front teeth which caused her to start licking and swallowing. Daktarin is available from the chemist without prescription.

http://www.diddly-di.fsnet.co.uk/Syringe-feeding.htm

http://www.guinealynx.info/tips.html

http://www.allcures.com/shared/product.asp?id=9431
 
Thanks... I'll be going to the pharmacist at lunch... uh, eep... NOW... and find an equivalent medication here in Canada. Also borrowed some videos from a friend so I can just veg on the couch with Piggly tonight and have something to do (it's hard to read a book with a piggy in your arms).

I'm thinking of maybe going to a feed supply store and seeing if I can get a hutch for a bigger cage once Piggly's well enough for a friend... can you use them indoors? I live in an apartment (I think you guys call them flats over there?), so no yard for an outdoor set-up, but it seems to me that you can get much bigger hutches than you can get cages.

Thanks for everyone's help... I'll be sure to keep everyone posted on her progress.

Just got a phone call from the pet store I'd called about the Critical Care... they said that they can't get it for me at all. They claim that it isn't available here (not sure if they meant Canada, or BC, or Vancouver Island). I phoned a couple other stores, and they say the same thing. I've got a friend looking around in Toronto, but I'm not feeling lucky. Does anyone know of any pet supply stores online in the UK that will ship to Canada? You guys seem to have a much better selection of products and what have you for guinea pigs than we do here... stupid federal health regulations...
 
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Ah, the ongoing saga... you know, it's been so stressful, so full of ups and downs, and will be still for quite some time, I'm sure, but with all that, if someone had told me going into this, how hard it was going to be, I still don't think I could have resisted the guinea pig wheeks...

So, update... took Pigglywink to the vet again tonight, since her eye isn't any better, and actually looked worse. Called the vet at 5:45 local time, and they said they could see her at 6. Fortunately I'm only a two minute walk away from the vets (don't have a car), so took her down, and she saw a third vet this time. This vet actually pulled out the textbook to show me the entries relevant to what she was telling me... pathetic little thing... my Corporate precedents binder at work is three times as thick as that stupid thing. But I digress...

So, first off, her eye. Did a scraping and looked at it under the scope. There's lots and lots of white cells, so likely a bacterial infection. So she suggested using Polysporin Eye Ointment (just a little bit) three times a day to clean it up, and if it's not better in three days at the most, we'll need to look at maybe removing it (*I'm totally freaked out about that... has anyone had to do such a thing?*).

As for the diarrhea issue, she said that really, the absolute best thing would be to get some guinea pig poo from a healthy guinea pig and give her that, so phoned one of Keegan (my son) friends who I know has guinea pigs and asked his mom. She asked me couldn't I just take Pigglywink back and exchange her for another one, so I reminded myself that I was asking for a favour, and bit my tongue, and said that no, that wasn't an option for me. Anyway, she's going through their cage right now and is going to bring me the droppings.

Finally, gave Pigglywink a bath, because she was getting a bit smelly (poor little girl)... she didn't mind it, but she definitely wasn't overjoyed with the experience, but I wanted to clean off her bottom, especially, so I can see what type of stains she has in a little while (to tell how bad the diarrhea really is).

Put her back in her cage (where I've swapped out her little hut, which must be just riddled with bacteria by now, so I'll have to buy a new one) for a huge pile of alfalfa hay (I know timothy hay is better, but with vet bills and what not, I could get a big bag of alfalfa for the same cost as a tiny little one of timothy, but I still have timothy for her to eat). She burrows down into it so she still feels safe, and I can change it every day to keep it clean... plus I'm hoping that being surrounded by all that lovely hay might tempt her into eating a bite or two, or twenty.

Anyway, just fed her the poo... that was gross... I hope I never have to do it again...

Caught her eating her food a little bit before the great poo experiment as well, plus having a little nibble of the hay, and she ate some more and had a nice drink after the great poo experiment (I would too, if someone made me eat that, especially, as my son notes, somebody else's poo [this led into a discussion as to whether he would eat his own... it's so fun tormenting him at times]).

Anyway, I'm really hoping that she'll be doing better soon, cause I'd hate to think I made her eat that for no reason...

Now I need to go bathe... in bleach... but wanted to give everyone an update, and ask for healing wheeks to be sent to my Pigglywink...
 
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