Post op arguments

dannif_piggies

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In some need of some urgent advice please. Willow had a lump removal yesterday and Misty was with her the whole time apart from during the op, and yesterday was absolutely fine, was even helping Willow with grooming and keeping her clean. In the last 10 minutes from what I've noticed, they seem to be VERY heightened, willow is now lunging at Misty despite Misty being submissive and backing into a corner. What is the best thing to do? Currently willow is timed out on my lap to calm down as I was worried about her scar breaking open. Help please!
 

VickiA

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I’m wondering whether while Willow was recovering yesterday there was a bit of a silent power play with Misty grooming her. Now she is feeling like she needs to reassert herself and has decided to ensure that Misty knows she’s bottom of the pecking order again. With any luck it will calm down again.
 

dannif_piggies

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I’m wondering whether while Willow was recovering yesterday there was a bit of a silent power play with Misty grooming her. Now she is feeling like she needs to reassert herself and has decided to ensure that Misty knows she’s bottom of the pecking order again. With any luck it will calm down again.
We thought this but Willow actually started grooming herself, Misty was backing into the corner and running away but the willow frantically lunged and they got in a tussle. We are placing c&c dividers in, to allow Willow time to recover without the stress and we'll see how things go from there
 

dannif_piggies

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Okay so the morning after, and last night Willow was quite persistently biting at the bars, Misty wasn't bothered and just stayed in her house. Willow also is laying by the bars quite frequently to mark her boundary.

Where do I go from here? How long will it be okay to keep them divided? At the moment are they a broken bond, or just a bond with difficulties? I'm really conscious of getting this bond back strong if I can and so I don't want to do anything to destroy it further.

Thank you
 

DougalandDiego

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Sorry to hear you’re having such a stressful time with your two girls. I can’t offer any advice as I’m not sure if it’s better to wait until Misty has fully recovered to re-introduce (I’m sure you will get some advice soon!) but for a normal fall out the forum recommend a two day separation then introduction on a neutral territory and then deep clean their cage before you put them back in. I hope Misty makes a quick recovery!
 

Siikibam

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Okay so the morning after, and last night Willow was quite persistently biting at the bars, Misty wasn't bothered and just stayed in her house. Willow also is laying by the bars quite frequently to mark her boundary.

Where do I go from here? How long will it be okay to keep them divided? At the moment are they a broken bond, or just a bond with difficulties? I'm really conscious of getting this bond back strong if I can and so I don't want to do anything to destroy it further.

Thank you
When you separate you go by the underpig’s behaviour rather than top pig. If Misty isn’t bothered and seems quite happy then it may be a case of a shaky bond. You could try bonding them again but be ready with a towel. I don’t know if I would....let others with more experience of girls answer. Also have a read of the guide linked below.
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs
 

dannif_piggies

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Sorry to hear you’re having such a stressful time with your two girls. I can’t offer any advice as I’m not sure if it’s better to wait until Misty has fully recovered to re-introduce (I’m sure you will get some advice soon!) but for a normal fall out the forum recommend a two day separation then introduction on a neutral territory and then deep clean their cage before you put them back in. I hope Misty makes a quick recovery!
Thank you for your message, it's Willow that's had the op which is why I'm so surprised how forward and confrontational she's being, if I was her I'd be chilling and snuggling up 🤣
 

dannif_piggies

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When you separate you go by the underpig’s behaviour rather than top pig. If Misty isn’t bothered and seems quite happy then it may be a case of a shaky bond. You could try bonding them again but be ready with a towel. I don’t know if I would....let others with more experience of girls answer. Also have a read of the guide linked below.
Dominance Behaviours In Guinea Pigs
Thank you for your message, I was there with a towel last night for sure! I'm going to give them a few days out, allow Willow to continue to recover, maybe there was an element of fear aggression if she's feeling under the weather. They were such a bonded pair two days ago and now this 😩
 

dannif_piggies

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Just an update, I did try rebonding last night, Misty was quickly accepting the dominance position, being humped by willow, and every so often she would try to challenge it but then become submissive. Things were looking positive, and over the duration of the bonding both willow and Misty had cleaned themselves, and Willow had laid down. Things kept flaring up with dominance and teeth chattering, and then calming again, but then out of no where, after being together for about 40 minutes, they completely scuffled. 😩😩

I think it's a case of can't live with each other but can't live without. Their cage has been kept divided, which will give me time to figure out what to do with their living space.

I'm just a bit heartbroken, I hadn't even considered this happening after an op, and it's just felt like one thing after another..

Your opinion guys, is it unfair to keep two young female piggies (age 2 and 1) apart but divided so they can see one another for their whole lives? Obviously there's various options from here, I can't take on a pig friend for each, if I do find a friend for one, I'd have to regime the other (obviously all done via rescues). I'm just so torn and obviously want the best for them 😪
 

oliviarosep97

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Hey there! Sorry to hear about your 2 girls!

I think you should keep trying to re introduce but if things never get better - keep them apart. It is unfortunate but I had a similar problem with my boys who were with each other since birth and then a few months ago I had to separate them because they just decided out of nowhere that they hated each other. Luckily I also have 2 girls so was able to give them a friend each. I did keep trying to reintroduce them but they were just lunging at each other and ripping fur out.

I don't think having them apart is unfair. They can still see, hear and smell each other so they're not really alone. May just be a case of them wanting their own space!
 

Piggies&buns

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I'm sorry to hear things haven’t worked out.
Once piggies make up their minds, they generally don’t change them back again, so I wouldn’t try to reintroduce. They will be happier as neighbours.
 

VickiA

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I’ve unfortunately had this with sows post surgery myself. I think you have to accept that for whatever reason the bond is broken. Once sows have made their minds up there’s not usually any going back from it :no:
 

Siikibam

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I’m sorry it hasn’t worked out. But as said above living alongside each other is okay. Whether you decide to surrender one and pair up another is up to you.
 

dannif_piggies

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Hey there! Sorry to hear about your 2 girls!

I think you should keep trying to re introduce but if things never get better - keep them apart. It is unfortunate but I had a similar problem with my boys who were with each other since birth and then a few months ago I had to separate them because they just decided out of nowhere that they hated each other. Luckily I also have 2 girls so was able to give them a friend each. I did keep trying to reintroduce them but they were just lunging at each other and ripping fur out.

I don't think having them apart is unfair. They can still see, hear and smell each other so they're not really alone. May just be a case of them wanting their own space!
Thank you for your message but I won't be re-trying to bond now. They've made their mind up and trying to keep them as a bond just isn't fair and would be selfish on my part, even if they ended up tolerating each other, they wouldn't be happy. Thanks for your message though ☺ I'm glad you had a solution for your boys x
 

dannif_piggies

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I'm sorry to hear things haven’t worked out.
Once piggies make up their minds, they generally don’t change them back again, so I wouldn’t try to reintroduce. They will be happier as neighbours.
Don't worry I wasn't planning on trying again now, I only tried again after separation due to the circumstances of willow having had an op and was hoping she was just angry due to not feeling 100% 😪 It is what it is though.

Do you think it's fair keeping two young pigs in their own space like that? They have full view of each other through the bars 🤔
 

dannif_piggies

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I’ve unfortunately had this with sows post surgery myself. I think you have to accept that for whatever reason the bond is broken. Once sows have made their minds up there’s not usually any going back from it :no:
Yeah I've accepted it, now just want to do what's best for them. They're obviously both young, and I'm now torn if the kindest thing to do I'm conscious that they're both young, would they be their happiest in a divided cage? 😖
 

dannif_piggies

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I’m sorry it hasn’t worked out. But as said above living alongside each other is okay. Whether you decide to surrender one and pair up another is up to you.
Thanks, it's just one of those things I guess. I just want to do what's best for them. I wouldn't want to chose who to re-home so if I do go down that route it would probably be "whoever bonds with a companion first"
The only option I have keeping them both is to keep them divided. Space isn't an issue but I'll find myself in a constant circle of "this piggy needs a friend" and at this point in my life, I don't know if I can commit to that in the future so I'd rather not take it on now 😣
 
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