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Rosie and her skin problems!

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klee

klee

Adult Guinea Pig
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Since her last full mites treatment finishing in February, her hair on her tummy had grown back nicely. Now we are in the same situation again and she is thinning on her tummy and has gone bald under her chin and she has been scratching it as she has a scab where she has scratched.
I just don't know what is causing it, this is about the 4th time since July that she has had 'mites' if this is what it is.
Do I treat again with xeno, as it doesn't appear to be fungal or do they become resistant after so many treatments?

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I just don't know what to do with her ! Any advice would be much appreciated. X
 
:( Poor Rosie, hoping someone may be along soon to advise. x
 
I am really sorry that Rosie is going through this. I have no advice though. Sorry.
 
I am not 100% sure what this is, what bedding is she kept on? as it could be a reaction to it?

As for mites, spot on is not always effective and for a stubborn mite problem injections are needed or at best Ivermectin given orally (at the vets). I don't like spot on as it can cause reactions in pigs. I am also inclined to think it could be a fungal problem as it looks scurfy but on the tummy seems unusual. Has she seen the vet about it?
 
helen105281 said:
I am not 100% sure what this is, what bedding is she kept on? as it could be a reaction to it?

As for mites, spot on is not always effective and for a stubborn mite problem injections are needed or at best Ivermectin given orally (at the vets). I don't like spot on as it can cause reactions in pigs. I am also inclined to think it could be a fungal problem as it looks scurfy but on the tummy seems unusual. Has she seen the vet about it?
Click to expand...

They are on Finacard with bed pads underneath and hay on top.
She has seen different vets at least on three occasions before when she has had it and they have just said looks like mites, on another occasion she had another bald patch on her back, but the last few times has been just around the tummy and neck. The picture is of her neck.

On the previous times xeno450 has worked and the hair has grown back, but it seems to be a recurrent problem about a couple of months later.
She has always had quite scurfy skin, but I know it can be quite common with coarse haired pigs ( she is a swiss? cross)

She is kept with 3 others and non have had the same hair loss.
 
Meant to add they were put onto shavings for about a week about a month ago as the finacard delivery didn't come in time. But surely it wouldn't be such a delayed reaction. They also have cosys for sleeping in
 
I have piggy clinic tomorrow so will ask the lady who runs it to see what she thinks it is.
 
helen105281 said:
I have piggy clinic tomorrow so will ask the lady who runs it to see what she thinks it is.
Click to expand...

Thank you :)
I have struggled to find a cavy savvy vet in my area, I have been to one exotics but for the consultation that we received it was no different to our local vet and at least double the price excluding any medication.
I just don't have any idea where I should go as those I have been recommended aren't cavy savvy.
 
You need Debbie at TEAS to see these pictures. Sounds like your piggy needs an injection rather than topical treatment. Debbie has just sorted my friend's piggy out who had a mites infestation which went horribly wrong. I am collecting her tomorrow, can't wait to see her!
 
yorkiegirl said:
You need Debbie at TEAS to see these pictures. Sounds like your piggy needs an injection rather than topical treatment. Debbie has just sorted my friend's piggy out who had a mites infestation which went horribly wrong. I am collecting her tomorrow, can't wait to see her!
Click to expand...
Lily was in a dreadful state when she arrived here. Her skin was so broken and sore that she would fit when she scratched. She also had very thickened skin on her face that was also very sore. She was treated with itrafungal for two weeks and had three panomec injections over a period of about a month. Within days of starting the treatment she began to show signs of improvement and has now fully recovered, all hair has grown back and you would never know she had had a problem.
 
This is her whole tummy. It doesn't look as bad as the picture, there is hair there but it is thinning.

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She is 7 years old if that has any influence!
 
Ok I spoke to Karen today who runs the piggy clinic I volunteer at and she thinks this may be fungal related and has suggested that you ask the vet to take a sample for testing from both the affected area and a clear area. In the meantime, it would be good to do a round of antifungal baths in a shampoo like Nizoral or Alphosyl. The mite treatment she has already had may not have been effective but it would not be wise to give her anymore Ivermectin at this stage.
 
This doesn;t look like a classic fungal to me but it's worth ruling out by skin scraping culture.

I would also consider investigating for
a) hormonal problems such as cystic ovaries - not every case presents with the classic hair loss on the flanks....and maybe even thyroid
b) Has her weight increased? Could their be fluid retention in the abdomen causing her tummy to be in contact with the ground more? This would suggest maybe a heart problem.

HTH
x
 
Hi have been asked to clarify, clinic was manic today so I didn't fully take in what was being said.

The vet should do skin scrapes of affected area, and do two scrapes, from different affected parts, and look to see if there are mites under a microscope, if yes, treat with Ivermectin injections, 3 treatments 7 – 10 days apart, absolutely no spot on. If no mites, then this is one of two things fungal skin, or the pig has reacted to the spot on, and being a swiss this is possible.

You basically needs to start a treatment plan all over again. If fungal, my choice of shampoos are fine. If this is a spot on residue reaction, the vet should consider a 7 day course of Prednisolone 1 mg per day, to break the itch/scratch cycle. Absolutely no creams to be applied. Sorry for the confusion.
 
Okay, Thanks Helen and Pebble for getting back with your useful information.
I was going to get some alphosyl shampoo yesterday but when I popped out to get some they didn't have any in stock.
I am hoping to get an appointment for her tomorrow, but I need to decide which vets to go to, are any vets able to do cultures?

In relation to Pebble's suggestions:
a) On the first vets appointment for 'mites' in August last year, the vet (Not Cavy-savvy) said upon palpation that he thought her ovaries felt enlarged and potentially cystic. However, when we went to the exotics for an unrelated problem with another of the girls, they did a thorough check of Rosie and when asked said they couldn't feel any cysts.

b) She has actually put on weight, but if I look at her weight spreadsheet it has done a similar thing about August last year.
May '12: 770g August '12 820g January '13 750g 4th March '13 790g 18th April '13 856g.
They have been inside over winter and over the past few weeks they have been getting a handful of readigrass 2/3 times a week between four of them so that may have influenced their weight?

So the plan is:
Go to the vets explain the situation and it's recurrence, if they suggest mites I should ask if they can do a skin scrape and check under the microscope, and a skin culture for fungal. If mites are found I need to ask if ivermectin can be given via injection not spot on.

Also to ask for a full check incase of cysts, heart problems and explain about her weight gain? What would be the other expected symptoms with heart problems?

Will all vets have a microscope/ facilities to do a skin culture in their surgery?

Thanks x
 
Thank you for taking on board what I said, what you have suggested sounds just right. I would think mosy vets would have a microscope but the culture may take a while and may even need to be sent off. One thing to point out though is that cultures often come back negative for fungal and only show something when it's ringworm but depending what it comes back with Karen should be able to help.

Heart problems can show up as hooting, the pig being lethargic, weight loss, I have a link to an article I can send you if needed?
 
Poor Rosie, glad Helen and Pebble have gave you something to go on. Love to my favourite sheep piggie x x
 
I took the 4 girls for him to look at. He has taken skin scrapings from Rosies belly, and is culturing for fungal so should know if anything is grown by Thursday next week. He also took a sellotape slide from Esme's back as that was quite flaky, but he said it may be related to there being some skin 'glands' around that area.
He said the position of the hairloss on Rosie seemed unusual for mites plus given her past 3 xeno450 treatments since August it seems unlikely. He had a listen to her chest and didn't say he could hear anything unusual.
If the fungal culture comes back negative, we are going to look into other causes and I will ask about cysts etc.
 
Ringworm test is negative. The vet we saw isn't in today so I have to ring back tomorrow and find out what that shows.
He said it looks like Rosie has a bit of an skin infection, so has given some hibiscrub to wash her in.
How.much should I dilute it by? X
 
Will check the dilution for you x
 
Checked our bottle we had for Cookie's wound when she had fungal and it said dilute to 1:20 parts. We just washed her scabby area in it. Sorry your having a tough time piggie wise at the moment..
 
Missed off half my post earlier. The vet today is going to speak to the vet I saw initially tomorrow and see if there was anything that showed under the microscope from Esme's back- as nothing had been recorded on the computer. So that will determine whether there are mites/lice/other parasites present.
I suppose we just have to go from there.
 
Just because the ringworm test is negative does not mean this isn't fungal, it is worth considering the possibility of other types of fungal such as Candida. I will be interested to know what is seen under the microscope too, as it is possible that the spot on already given has not been effective, sometimes only injections will do.
 
Just rang up. No mites/ other creepy crawlies found under the microscope.
All the receptionist said was to use the hibiscrub, daily or every other day. I asked how much should this be diluted and she said it doesn't need to be, just rub in well on the area, leave for about 10 minutes and rinse off. Needless, to say I won't be doing that. My Mum is a nurse and she commented on how irritating it can be to human skin so no way am I putting it on neat.
Can't say I'm very happy to be honest. Especially as the vet said if it was a skin infection it was likely to be secondary to something else, they have not found a cause for it.
 
This is her today.
I tried to zoom in closer to her skin but I don't think it has really worked.







I have been ringing round/ looking up on the internet vets that deal with small mammals/exotics i.e. actively have an interest in them and I am just not getting anywhere
 
Hi, I have some advice passed to me by Karen who is Guinea Pig Health and Welfare Specialist and runs clinic in conjunction with a guinea pig savvy vet

The vet who advised Hibiscrub sort of has the right idea, but the vet nurse saying putting on neat, absolutely not, it must be diluted.

It seems that you are being given conflicting advice, and it is confusing. The only treatment needed here is an anti-fungal shampoo - Nizarol after patch testing (behind the ear for 24 hours), and Imaverol, no creams, no potions. If the vet’s idea of Hibiscrub was for any potential bacterial irritant, then diluted Hibiscrub is ok, but better would diluted Povodine Iodine 5 mls mixed to 2 pints of water, please ensure that you keep this away from the eyes, do a patch test, will turn a white coat orange on contact, but this shampoos out.

So in summary:
4 x weekly shampoos in Nizarol
After shampoo 4 x weekly Imaverol Dips, the practice of repeating every 3 days is incorrect and is overdosing the product, and that comes from the Manufacturer. Regards the Dips, it has to be one or the other Imaverol or Povodine Iodine, Hibiscrub in Karen's experience is ineffective with Candida strains.
3 week course of Daktarin Oral Gel, the dose is 0.5ml twice a day.


PM me if you need anything else.
 
As I was taking the gingers to another vets (with exotics experience) this morning for a second opinion I decided to bring Rosie along too.
Apart from weeing and pooping all over the vets towel she was very good. Again a very thorough examination, checked her chest and palpated her abdomen.
Turns out that her ovaries are quite enlarged, as well as having enlarged nipples, so we are now treating with Chorulon injections to see if that improves matters- a spay was the other thing mentioned but at seven years old and being as light as she is it is not something I would want to put her through particularly as she does not appear to be in any noticeable discomfort .
She said that there was no inflammation on the hairless area or signs of infection and rather than her being completely bald the hair is actually thinning which is found with ovarian cysts. So she has had her first injection today and squealed like a baby, then we need to go back in about 7-10 days for second and then the same amount of time for the third.
Hopefully this can sort her out.
She definitely won the vet nurses heart as she sat there chirruping as she stroked her (and made a mess of the towel rolleyes)
 
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