Should We Give Up?

[PatsyPanda]

We're new to guineas and got 2 boys about 6 weeks ago - we think they were about 4 months old. Sadly one got an infection and died within about 4 weeks. We went back to the pet shop and they had what they thought was another boy of the same group. We thought we'd give it a try and for the past 2 weeks it all seemed to be going well. There had been an initial bout of mega-mounting but they seemed to have calmed down.

We have a double level hutch which is in a child's playhouse so we sometimes in the day leave the hutch doors open and they can run around more. We also have a run in the garden that they've been going into most days. They seemed to be getting on well - often cuddled up together in the hide.

Then on Friday evening we were going out so they were taken out the garden and put in the playhouse a little earlier than usual. As they would be there a while, we left the hutch doors open and left them like that overnight, rather than closing them into the hutch as usual. Saturday morning, my husband discovered the original boy with a gashed mouth which needed a small op by the vet to fix. It seemed like there'd been a fight.

Last night we kept them in the hutch but on separate levels. Today we tried them together again to see. Straight away there was lots of chattering at each other and it looked on the verge of something more unpleasant so we separated them. They've been in separate runs in the garden but next to each other. There was a bit of chattering at the start but it's calmed down. There's a bit of dominance strutting too. And a bit of sniffing through the bars - not sure if there'd be teeth there were it not for the bars. But they both seem to be doing a lot of jumping about, which is a little unusual for them.

Is it worth pursuing it with them in separate runs / hutches for a few days to see if they can still get on or does the fact that they're at the injuring stage, mean it's gone too far? Could it just be a hormone spike that'll pass....till the next one?

We're due to go on holiday in a few weeks so we don't have a lot of time to work it through. Our friend is due to look after them but we don't want to leave them pigs at war.

Any thought?

 

[Mother Hubbard]

Hi Patsy, it does sound very much like they aren't going to get on, it can happen. However, I'm going to tag in @Wiebke whose very knowledgeable when it comes to bonding, re-bonding and general behaviour, she'll be able to help you with advise. I can understand that it is unsettling especially as you are going on holiday.

Fingers crossed.

 

[Wiebke]

We're new to guineas and got 2 boys about 6 weeks ago - we think they were about 4 months old. Sadly one got an infection and died within about 4 weeks. We went back to the pet shop and they had what they thought was another boy of the same group. We thought we'd give it a try and for the past 2 weeks it all seemed to be going well. There had been an initial bout of mega-mounting but they seemed to have calmed down.

We have a double level hutch which is in a child's playhouse so we sometimes in the day leave the hutch doors open and they can run around more. We also have a run in the garden that they've been going into most days. They seemed to be getting on well - often cuddled up together in the hide.

Then on Friday evening we were going out so they were taken out the garden and put in the playhouse a little earlier than usual. As they would be there a while, we left the hutch doors open and left them like that overnight, rather than closing them into the hutch as usual. Saturday morning, my husband discovered the original boy with a gashed mouth which needed a small op by the vet to fix. It seemed like there'd been a fight.

Last night we kept them in the hutch but on separate levels. Today we tried them together again to see. Straight away there was lots of chattering at each other and it looked on the verge of something more unpleasant so we separated them. They've been in separate runs in the garden but next to each other. There was a bit of chattering at the start but it's calmed down. There's a bit of dominance strutting too. And a bit of sniffing through the bars - not sure if there'd be teeth there were it not for the bars. But they both seem to be doing a lot of jumping about, which is a little unusual for them.

Is it worth pursuing it with them in separate runs / hutches for a few days to see if they can still get on or does the fact that they're at the injuring stage, mean it's gone too far? Could it just be a hormone spike that'll pass....till the next one?

We're due to go on holiday in a few weeks so we don't have a lot of time to work it through. Our friend is due to look after them but we don't want to leave them pigs at war.

Any thought?

Give them some time and let tempers cool down some more before you try another re-intro. The reaction is normal after an alteraction (I get the same if two of my groups meet accidentally), but it also doesn't sound like totally hate each other's guts and want them for garters, to be honest.
It sounds like one of the boys felt invaded through the night, which can result in an emphatic reaction. Bites to the mouth are mostly a defence reaction when a piggy feels cornered and caught. But it doesn't sound like they had a full-on boar fight with deep bites to the rump, which is very much and very definitely the end of the line.

Otherwise, it sounds like they are quite happy to be next door neighbours with their own territory each and plenty of interaction through the bars. A number of forum members have these "can't live together and can't live apart" firmly bonded pairings. That would for me be an acceptable plan B, especially as you can adapt your space and do not have access to a rescue that offers boar dating under supervision to find "Mr Right". Your options always very much depend on your local options and making the best out of them and your own set-up. The important bit is that both boars can stay in contact and give each other the stimulation that they need.

" Biting" And What You Can Do
Boars: Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?

 

[CheeseMommy]

Hi there, when I first introduced my boys Huevos and Salsa, they got along at first. However, one night I found that Salsa had a big gash on his face. We separated them and got him stitches. (It stressed Salsa to be in the cage next to him, so we kept him in a different room.) We kept them separate for two weeks while his stitches healed. Once they were, it was time for a reintroduction. Piggies have a unique language and short memories, so re-introduction is necessary when there are bad fights that draw blood.

You have to introduce them on neutral territory (the floor) with lots of hay, food, and water to distract them. Their "dance of dominance" can last all day, so let them be together and chatter teeth/hump each other etc. Do not separate them unless they draw blood. It may seem aggressive and scary to you, but this is how they sort things out in their hierarchy and it is NORMAL. Once it's time to put them up, make sure to totally sanitize their hutch of ALL smells... wash EVERYTHING. And make sure there is two of EVERYTHING (two hideys, two water bottles, two pellet bowls, two hay sources), so they have no excuse to bicker. Then reintroduce them to their home. The first few days will be rocky, but they will eventually work everything else out. Just remember: don't separate them unless one is bleeding.

I'm happy to report that I did this with Huevos and Salsa, they now live very happily together!

It sounds like your hutch might not be guinea pig friendly. Maybe you could post pictures so we can give you some advice? Some hutches are made for chinchillas or rabbits, that can cause injury or fighting with piggies. Especially if they have multi-levels or are two small.

Your last resort is separating them. But, it can be done successfully and they can live peacefully and happily side-by-side, getting to see each other through the bars. However, if you follow my advice carefully, you shouldn't have to!

Remember: be patient with them.

 

[PatsyPanda]

Thanks for the replies. Good to hear that all is not lost, neccessarily.

The hutch is a 4ft x 2 storey with a run between the levels. It opens into a 5 x 5ft playhouse. We did have 2 hides but one got soaked in the garden pen and we thought they were both sleeping happily in the sleeping area, so didn't rush to replace it. So maybe now there's 2 again, they'll be happier.

My hubby was about to put in place fixed pipe runs from the playhouse to the garden so they can come and go as they please. So if they can get on, they'll be well provided for piggies.

 

[PatsyPanda]

Oh and particular thanks for the behaviour guide. Very helpful for a newbie!

 

[PatsyPanda]

Well one day into life back together and so far, so good. Lots of chittering at each other and a few tussles but nothing too major. We reintroduced them in the house first and then towards the end of the afternoon we've moved them out into the garden as they always seem happier on grass. 2 of everything in both locations.

I'm just wondering if we should put them out in the hutch tonight or keep them in the inside pen (a large 6 panel, hexagonal)? Hutch pictures attached if it helps. We're going to put a hidey in the bottom level so there's somewhere else to sleep other than the upstairs bit. They've been sleeping in the hutch since the fight but with the ramp closed so Salty was upstairs and Murray downstairs. I'm slightly wary of leaving them there all night as it was the scene of the fight and we won't know what's going on. But we'll have to do it sometime I guess?

Any views on what's best?