Splitting The Herd

Status
Not open for further replies.
ayemee

ayemee

Adult Guinea Pig
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
3,648
Reaction score
4,677
Points
1,225
Location
Nottingham, UK
A couple of weeks ago I mentioned Peaches never leaving the top of the hutch. I've now figured out why. Her and Martha really do not get on. Even when they see each other they freeze and teeth chatter.

I never noticed this before because Peaches would always be upstairs and Martha can't use the ramp so Peaches was safe up there.

I put the herd out in the run today whilst I clean out the shed. Martha and Peaches chattered at each other at first but settled down to eat. But then the tension was rising and I could sense something really wasn't right. In the end Martha chased Peaches without giving in. I seperated them and gave Peaches some cuddles to calm her down. Her little heart was pounding and she looked so scared. I weighed her to check she wasn't losing any weight through stress and luckily she has actually put on weight and not lost any.

So since this happened I've divided the run into two halves with three pigs either side. I've chosen the two trios based on who I think will work best.

Dolly and Mabel never always get along great, more tolerate each other, so I have Mabel, Amber and Martha one side. Dolly, Hattie and Peaches the other side.

Since I've divided them the silence is bliss. All relaxed, munching on hay, and Peaches isn't confined to a corner incase she encounters Martha.


If the trios work out well for the rest of the day in the run, I think I need to consider splitting the shed. This means taking the hutch out. My mum won't be too happy as she will see it as a waste of hutch. But I feel this might be the best for all of the pigs.

image.webp
 
Aw I'm sorry that you are having to split your herd but if Martha and Peaches aren't getting on, you are doing the right thing.

It's a shame you will have to remove your hutch but I'm sure it will all work out.
 
Claire W said:
Aw I'm sorry that you are having to split your herd but if Martha and Peaches aren't getting on, you are doing the right thing.

It's a shame you will have to remove your hutch but I'm sure it will all work out.
Click to expand...

Thank you. I've been trying to make it work out but I guess it's just one of those things.

I do feel a little gutted and worry if any of the pigs will miss each other if they're in the different trio? However I don't feel any of my girls have strongly bonded relationships or friendships. Plus they could still see and interact through bars if the shed was divided.
 
Last edited:
ayemee said:
Thank you. I've been trying to make it work out but I guess it's just one of those things.

I do feel a little gutted and worry if any of the pigs will miss each other if they're in the different trio? However I don't feel any of my girls have strongly bonded relationships or friendships. Plus they could still see and interest through bars if the shed was divided.
Click to expand...

It's different for every herd, but for mine I don't feel if I had to split it there are any piggies that would suffer for it. I'd keep my sister pairs and mother-daughter pairs together if they weren't the ones arguing (probably more for my sake than theirs!) and if I knew that I had a pair/group that seemed particularly close I'd keep them together too.

You've just got to go off your knowledge of your own piggies and see how it goes - swapping the girls over might need to happen till you find the best setup for all your piggies, but I think they'll be just fine. Especially if they can see each other, but I would watch out for any shenanigans between the two that don't like each other, you don't want their animosity setting off the other girls and causing them to argue, too. Hopefully they'll have enough to be getting on with with their own trios so fingers crossed they'll mellow out if they can't actually get to each other!
 
ghostbusterbunny said:
It's different for every herd, but for mine I don't feel if I had to split it there are any piggies that would suffer for it. I'd keep my sister pairs and mother-daughter pairs together if they weren't the ones arguing (probably more for my sake than theirs!) and if I knew that I had a pair/group that seemed particularly close I'd keep them together too.

You've just got to go off your knowledge of your own piggies and see how it goes - swapping the girls over might need to happen till you find the best setup for all your piggies, but I think they'll be just fine. Especially if they can see each other, but I would watch out for any shenanigans between the two that don't like each other, you don't want their animosity setting off the other girls and causing them to argue, too. Hopefully they'll have enough to be getting on with with their own trios so fingers crossed they'll mellow out if they can't actually get to each other!
Click to expand...


That's true. All is still settled in the trios for now. Although I think Peaches is now telling Dolly and Hattie that she is in charge of them both. She wants first pick of the hay! So she's acting a lot more like her old self since the division.

Splitting the shed will be a challenge. The hutch needs to come out and I need high bars between them. Mainly because Mabel can jump very high.

I just feel so rubbish right now. I should have done something sooner but I just wanted things to have a fair chance to work.
 
ayemee said:
That's true. All is still settled in the trios for now. Although I think Peaches is now telling Dolly and Hattie that she is in charge of them both. She wants first pick of the hay! So she's acting a lot more like her old self since the division.

Splitting the shed will be a challenge. The hutch needs to come out and I need high bars between them. Mainly because Mabel can jump very high.

I just feel so rubbish right now. I should have done something sooner but I just wanted things to have a fair chance to work.
Click to expand...

Oh no, don't feel rubbish!

These things happen! With some piggies it's a temporary falling out that can last a few weeks and all of a sudden all is well. With others you can give all the time in the world and they'll still hate each other. You gave them time to see if it would work out and neither piggy has come to any harm - so everything from now on will be just fine!

Don't beat yourself up about it!

Your trios will take a little while to sort out their own pecking order now their group has changed so just give them time to sort that out. Provided there's no nasty behaviour, they'll sort themselves out very soon! It's good that Peaches is telling them she's the boss, she's clearly got a dominant personality (which might explain the falling out with Martha if she too is quite a dominant little lady!) so she can let that shine now if Dolly and Hattie are more chilled out and happy to go with the flow! It's good that she's looking more like herself to you now - it's a very positive sign that splitting them was the right thing to do.

Chin up, it's looking really good!
 
Don't feel bad. Sometimes it's good to leave them to it for a while as sometimes they sort things out in a week or two, but it sounds like they've had plenty of time to sort things out, and it's just isn't working.

Is the hutch on legs? I ask because if one trio can have the hutch with the underneath of it included in their run space, and perhaps the other trio have the other side with some houses, perhaps your Mum won't be so annoyed?
 
Right decision - and please don't feel bad! Not all sows get on with each other. I have been through enough group splits myself or bondings that didn't work out. In the end, all is down whether the piggies get on or not. That is not something you can predict or control. Splitting a group is never a happy decision.

Our pet groups are an artificial construct, and unlike in a wild setting, guinea pigs usually don't have the space to move away from the group and find another boar to found their own minigroup. the best we can offer is create two minigroups according to who gets on best with who.

You have done what is necessary and will hopefully enjoy the resulting peace and quiet as all piggies in the group will relax.
 
ghostbusterbunny said:
Oh no, don't feel rubbish!

These things happen! With some piggies it's a temporary falling out that can last a few weeks and all of a sudden all is well. With others you can give all the time in the world and they'll still hate each other. You gave them time to see if it would work out and neither piggy has come to any harm - so everything from now on will be just fine!

Don't beat yourself up about it!

Your trios will take a little while to sort out their own pecking order now their group has changed so just give them time to sort that out. Provided there's no nasty behaviour, they'll sort themselves out very soon! It's good that Peaches is telling them she's the boss, she's clearly got a dominant personality (which might explain the falling out with Martha if she too is quite a dominant little lady!) so she can let that shine now if Dolly and Hattie are more chilled out and happy to go with the flow! It's good that she's looking more like herself to you now - it's a very positive sign that splitting them was the right thing to do.

Chin up, it's looking really good!
Click to expand...

Thank you. It is nice to see her being more herself. When she's aroud Martha she cowers away and just wants to hide. It stresses her out and totally changes her behaviour.

Critter said:
Don't feel bad. Sometimes it's good to leave them to it for a while as sometimes they sort things out in a week or two, but it sounds like they've had plenty of time to sort things out, and it's just isn't working.

Is the hutch on legs? I ask because if one trio can have the hutch with the underneath of it included in their run space, and perhaps the other trio have the other side with some houses, perhaps your Mum won't be so annoyed?
Click to expand...

No the hutch isn't on legs :( the shed divided in half with the floor space gives them plenty of space still. So that's what I'll have to look at doing.
 
Wiebke said:
Right decision - and please don't feel bad! Not all sows get on with each other. I have been through enough group splits myself or bondings that didn't work out. In the end, all is down whether the piggies get on or not. That is not something you can predict or control. Splitting a group is never a happy decision.

Our pet groups are an artificial construct, and unlike in a wild setting, guinea pigs usually don't have the space to move away from the group and find another boar to found their own minigroup. the best we can offer is create two minigroups according to who gets on best with who.

You have done what is necessary and will hopefully enjoy the resulting peace and quiet as all piggies in the group will relax.
Click to expand...

Thank you. It's not an easy thing to go through and I feel so stressed! I'm still unsure if the trios will work out but I'll have to just keep an eye on them and see. I don't ever want to split Mabel and Amber as they are the most closely bonded couple of pigs.

I just can't get my head around how Martha has changed Peaches behaviour so much. She normally sticks up for herself but with Martha, Peaches just gets scared.
 
It is sad. Like you I wanted one happy herd, but ended up having to split one of my sows away from the others and getting her a boar-friend instead. She's been living in the sow-herd for a year, but fell-out and that was that. I don't think she had ever been completely comfortable with them. It happens, and it IS a shame, but on the plus side you do have the space to make it work xx
 
ayemee said:
Thank you. It's not an easy thing to go through and I feel so stressed! I'm still unsure if the trios will work out but I'll have to just keep an eye on them and see. I don't ever want to split Mabel and Amber as they are the most closely bonded couple of pigs.

I just can't get my head around how Martha has changed Peaches behaviour so much. She normally sticks up for herself but with Martha, Peaches just gets scared.
Click to expand...

It is always a stressful and unhappy time for everybody/everypig involved...

HUGS!
 
Thank you all for the support :)

When I did decide on having 6 pigs, I did consider if I ever had to seperate so luckily I can still make it work somehow.

Mum at first thought I was being over dramatic, but since seeing how much more relaxed Peaches is, I think she's more up for helping me sort the shed this evening. It will have to be temporary dividers but better than nothing for now.

I'm sure Peaches will appreciate being able to sit in her hay tray again without the fear of Martha kicking her out.
 
Yeah I bet they're very much relieved :) Sometimes it's all for the best.
 
Well,

The hutch won't come out the shed. The angle is totally wrong so we need to take the side of the shed off if we want it out. So for now Mabel, Amber and Martha are in the hutch and the others on the floor space.

image.webp

However Martha has now taken to chewing the bars at the bottom constantly! It's actually breaking my heart :(

I don't want her to hurt her teeth but if I open the doors and let them all be together again Peaches will get stressed and run straight upstairs again! :(

It's heart breaking seeing Martha bar chew though...
 
Give it time, she will probably stop the chewing. It wont harm her but it's a natural response. You can always block the lower part of the bars off with something if it doesn;t settle down xx
 
Well I went down again with a bag of coriander to check on them. Martha wasn't bar chewing so that's good. :)

It's the first time I've heard Peaches wheek in so long! When I first got her she made me laugh so much with how loud she was, yet she's been so quiet recently. I opened the shed and rustled the bag and even silent little Dolly joined in the wheeking chorus! So I'm really happy at the moment.

I went down again just to check, and all were relaxing or snoozing.
 
I am with you 100% @ayemee. You've given it time, you've been observant, you've thought it all out. You've done the right thing for your girls. Not all sows will get on. There will be a re-establishing of the hierarchy in the new trios but it already sounds as though you have a happier and calmer shed, so that must be the right decision for your girls. Sure all will go well now.
 
VickiA said:
I am with you 100% @ayemee. You've given it time, you've been observant, you've thought it all out. You've done the right thing for your girls. Not all sows will get on. There will be a re-establishing of the hierarchy in the new trios but it already sounds as though you have a happier and calmer shed, so that must be the right decision for your girls. Sure all will go well now.
Click to expand...

Thank you. Yes it does seem more settled for now but I'll keep an eye on things and see how it goes.
 
So things have been ok the last couple of days. Although part of me still just wants to open the hutch doors and let them be together again. Martha still insists on bar biting and is starting to chew the wooden part of the hutch to try and get back with the others. Hattie and Amber often look through the bars at each other.

Not sure if it's my human emotions jumping into this but it's constantly on the back of my mind and making me feel guilty? :(
 
You have done the right thing for Peaches. Hopefully you can find a more permanent home solution for them. So Martha can't bar chew... Groupings of piggies and hierarchy can be difficult. How long had the unrest been going on for between the two of them?
 
sport_billy said:
You have done the right thing for Peaches. Hopefully you can find a more permanent home solution for them. So Martha can't bar chew... Groupings of piggies and hierarchy can be difficult. How long had the unrest been going on for between the two of them?
Click to expand...

Yeah I'm hoping to split the shed in half using grids of some sort. I need my dad to take the side off the shed though so he isn't going to be thrilled but not much else I can do!

Well... When they first met there wasn't any problems. But it's been a few weeks of Martha seeming to bother Peaches but just usual bickering between girls. Then the teeth chattering became more frequent and it stressed me out never mind about them and all the other pigs. It seemed to put them on edge too.

I just feel some guilt over splitting them. In my head.. They all miss each other and I want to put them back together. I know deep down splitting was probably best. But the girls inside the hutch are a little confused as to why they can't roam the shed now :(

I need to sort something out soon. Although they have plenty of space so that's good.
 
I am sure your Dad will be fine about it... Dad's are good like that they moan at first :))

It's natural to feel guilty, sometimes we put our emotions on them, I know I do often. You have made a really tough decision but put there needs first despite the turmoil it is causing you - big call, well done. Hope fully you can get it sorted soon and that will help you feel a little mpre easier with it all. I was surprised to hear Mabel could jump or climb quite high!
 
sport_billy said:
I am sure your Dad will be fine about it... Dad's are good like that they moan at first :))

It's natural to feel guilty, sometimes we put our emotions on them, I know I do often. You have made a really tough decision but put there needs first despite the turmoil it is causing you - big call, well done. Hope fully you can get it sorted soon and that will help you feel a little mpre easier with it all. I was surprised to hear Mabel could jump or climb quite high!
Click to expand...

Thank you.

Oh yes! She's quite the little ninja pig. :P
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top