Very underweight gp

TanCharlie

TanCharlie

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Hi all, so we recently got 3 new gp's, we were told they were all 8 months old. 2 of them weight 500-600g and are quite ligand appear healthy. 1 is very small and only weighs 265g, we suspect he's not anywhere near 8 months in age. We did take him to a vet and the vet said he appeared to be newborn and taken away from his mum, but didnt actually give us much advice on what to do. His teeth do not appear to be fully grown and he is struggling to eat much. He eats the stalks on spinach leaves and will eat hay. We have tried mashing the pellets in warm water, but he refuses that. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
 
Welcome to the forum

So the vet has confirmed that this piggy is just a young baby and not that there is anything medically wrong?
If so, then he should grow in his own time with a good hay based diet (unless there are health issues).
If there are health issues with him then you must step in with syringe feeding him as well as seeing if there is an actual diagnosis for any illness.

(At his weight it is correct that he should have been removed from his mum - baby boys can get their mothers pregnant from 3 weeks of age or 250g).

Wiebke

Thread 'Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support'

1 Weight and Weight Loss
- Why regular weight monitoring matters
- How weight changes over a lifetime
- How to weigh on your kitchen scales (with video)
- The weight loss rules
- How critical is the weight loss for my piggy?
- Possible causes for weight loss
2 Body Mass Index (BMI) or 'Heft'
- Why is understanding your piggy's weight so important?
- 'Average' weight vs. individual weight - the big trip up
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Wiebke

Thread 'All About Syringe Feeding and Medicating Guinea Pigs with Videos and Pictures'

Introduction
1 Choosing the right place to medicate/feed your piggy
2 Guinea pig whispering and asserting your authority
3 Recovery products and emergency improvisation
4 Syringe recommendations
5 Weight monitoring: your biggest ally
6 Weight loss guidelines and when to step in with feeding
7 Syringe feeding amounts/frequency advice
8 Practical medication and syringing tips (incl. missed a dose)
9 Medicating and feeding cooperative guinea pigs (videos)
10 Medicating and feeding uncooperative guinea pigs (hold pictures and tips)
11 The line between...
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Other factors to consider going forward - spinach is too high in calcium so should only be fed once a week.

As you mention three piggies and mention ‘he’, I assume all piggies are male?
In that event, please prepare that they may not be able to remain together permanently. Sadly boar trios are highly unstable and usually end with fights and separations.
If they are ok for now and assuming the little one isnt being subjected to bullying (not allowed to eat by the other two, loses weight etc) then leave them together for now but as I say, prepare that it unfortunately may not last.
Boar trios require a huge amount of space - a cage measuring 300x100cm at least.

Wiebke

Thread 'Adding More Guinea Pigs Or Merging Pairs – What Works And What Not?'

1 Singles and Pairs
Singles: Challenges and solutions for different singles situations (link)
Pairs: A closer look all possible pairings (link)
2 Trios and More by Gender
Boars
- Trios and quartets - Why better avoided
- Large Groups...
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Wiebke

Thread 'Long Term Balanced General And Special Needs Guinea Pig Diets'

1 The recommended ratio of food groups
2 Hay and fresh grass
3 Vegetables, fresh herbs and fruit with an illustrated balanced sample diet
4 Special dietary needs
- Urinary tract infections, bladder stones and sterile IC (non-bacterial interstitial cystitis)
- Diabetes and long term digestive problems
- Impaction in boars
- Pregnancy and nursing dietary tweaks (only visible to registered members who have accepted our no intentional breeding policy)...
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Hi, thank you so much for your reply.
When we first took him to the vet, he was a little sniffly and wheezy- the vet suggested that this was because they had sawdust in their cage in the place we got them from. He's not at all wheezy now, since having no sawdust, so the vet confirmed it was allergy related.
Thank you for the info about spinach, I wasn't aware of this.
They have plenty of good quality hay.
Yes, that's correct, we have 3 males and they are in a very large cage. However, we have just ordered a c&c cage, as one of the larger males has become increasingly dominant over the small piggy- constantly chasing and humping him. We haven't had any bullying issues over food, it's simply just the constant chasing and humping. He literally will not give him a second of peace. The middle male now tries to protect littlun and often squares off to the biggest piggy and shelters the littlun.
I really appreciate you taking the time to reply and add all the information. Thank you 😊
 
The constant chasing and humping can unfortunately be bullying so you’ve done right by preparing to separate.

The two who remain will need to reestablish their bond as a pair (whether you choose to keep the middle and small pig together and separate the dominant all comes down to who is going to be the best character match to form a long term bond).
Moving environment (a new home, changing cage size in an existing home etc) will cause them to reestablish their bond which takes around two weeks.
Even cleaning the cage will cause an increase in dominance so to that end we don’t recommend the full cage is cleaned in one go. A full clean removes all scent and can really upset them so only clean half the cage at a time.

The pair need a 180x60cm or 5x2 c&c cage.
A single needs a minimum of 120x60cm or a 3x2 c&c cage.

Piggies generally don’t get allergies.
Some can be sensitive to some things though - hay and bedding dust included. I’m glad his symptoms have eased.

Wiebke

Thread 'Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?'

1 The hormonal teenage months
- What are the most difficult times?
- What are your boars' chances of making it together?
- What can help to boost your boys' chances?
- What does NOT work?
2 Fighting, bullying and when to separate
- What are the signs of a dysfunctional bond?
- How can I test whether a bond is no longer working?
- What to do if your boars had a bloody fight?
3 Life after...
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Thank you so much for all your advice.
We have a very large run aswell and have been putting them in there, when we have been cleaning out their cage. We will try cleaning out half at a time next and see how that goes.
I fear that the biggest boy has burnt his bridges with the other 2 now.
 
Oh dear will you be able to keep big one as a neighbour to the other two?🤔
 
UPDATE- dinky died and hour ago, in our arms. We took him to a different vet and she said he likely had neurological issues and was only weeks old. She said he certainly shouldn't have been sold in a shop. She said there was nothing we could have done and that we had done everything right 😪
 
I’m so sorry Dinky has left for the rainbow bridge. You did everything you could for him. Some illnesses just can’t be fixed. I think it’s probably true that he had something neurological or genetic going on. ❤️
 
Oh I’m sorry to read about Dinky - you gave him a great chance at life …..maybe he wasn’t meant to live a long life 💔
Popcorn freely at RB dear Dinky
I hope the other two can settle and become friends
Take care of yourselves as you grieve ❤️
 
Dinky we hope that you are now popcorning happily over the Rainbow Bridge and have found some lovely friends 🌈
 
Thank you so much for all your beautiful replies. We are heartbroken, but thankfully the other 2 piggies are doing amazingly well. Since Dinky left, they have been playing happily and had no bullying issues. I don't know if this can be true, but I'm wondering if the big boy was being the way he was because he knew something was wrong with Dinky- is this possible? The vet told us to prepare for them being unsettled and needing to reestablish bonds etc, but they seem to be better now.
I'm sorry, but I just don't know where else to write all of this, I'm just so upset and unsure now, about everything. Will the other 2 be ok?
 
I’m so sorry to hear this.

Piggies absolutely do know when another is unwell. However the reality is three boars together is almost always a recipe for disaster which ends in bullying/fights. So while they would have known he was unwell, the bond issues would have been there whether he was unwell or not. Sadly we see so few boar trios working out long term due to the issues they face in forming a hierarchy.

The two will continue to reform their bond as a pair - that takes two weeks. They are also teenagers so you must expect to see hormonal dominance continue. It is all a normal part of boar relationship maintenance (for their whole lives).
Follow the normal ‘rules’ for boar keeping - that is lots of space; no hides with one exit; handle the dominant first etc etc.
 
Thank you so much for your advice.
Part of me is so angry because we only originally went to get the pair, but the shop insisted we had to have 3, as that was best apparently. So, of course, I put my trust in this well known establishment, but seems like they don't actually know alot. They were also the ones who told us that each piggy MUST have at least a cup full of spinach leaves, every day.
I thank you so much for your advice and guidance, you are all giving me peace of mind x
 
I’m so sorry you received poor advice from the shop on both aspects - bonding and diet. Unfortunately we see some shops telling people poor advice especially that three boars are ok all too often - we desperately wish it wouldn’t happen and feel helpless at this end when all we can do is help pick up the pieces from the fights, fall outs and separations which occur in most cases.
Boar trios can occasionally work but generally it is in boys who are older and who have chosen each other themselves; hardly ever in pet shop babies who are just put together for sale with little knowledge and no regard for character compatibility.
It’s sows who can be kept in groups.

Spinach, kale, parsley are amongst the high calcium veggies which should be kept limited. Most calcium comes into the diet via pellets (which must be kept limited to one tablespoon per pig per day) and drinking water (which should be filtered). Too much calcium (although it isn’t quite as straightforward as that) leads to too many calcium deposit pees (some are normal though as the bodies way of excreting calcium), grit, sludge and then bladder stones (surgical removal is needed in boars).
Personally I don’t really feed pellets (mine get side pellets each on a Wednesday and again on a Sunday) so I have more leeway in the diet for other high calcium veggies

We are all here to help you further.
Again I’m so sorry you lost Dinky
 
We did actually phone the shop when we came home yesterday, as we were so upset with the whole situation. We managed to speak to a manager who was very apologetic and sympathetic. He did assure us that he would go and check all the piggies out, but whether he will, i dont know.
For now, the other 2 seem happy and content.
We have been offering pellets, but they aren't that interested in them, they seem content with their hay and then whatever greens we add.
Again, I'm so grateful for all your advice 🤗
 
Hi again.
What a lovely photo of Dinky.
Firstly never apologise for asking questions or being upset it's what this forum is for and the experts are just incredible. Secondly well done for phoning the shop they need to know what their actions have caused.
Take care of yourself and I may have missed it but what are Dinky's two friends named? 💐
 
So very sorry that you’ve been lost sweet Dinky.
You filled his short life with so much love and care which is what matters most.
He was lucky you took him.
Be gentle with yourself as you grieve.
 
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