When to separate?

Fozzy44

Fozzy44

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I’ve had my 2 boars for about 3 months. They were about 12-13 weeks when I bought them. They live outside in a large double storey hutch. There has always been a bit of grumbling between the 2 of them but nothing bad.

Recently tho the smaller of the pair (Loki) has been mounting the bigger one (Frodo) constantly. Usually Frodo responds to this with a bit of rumblestrutting and then they’ll both behave and be nice to each other. But today while I was out freshening up their cage I saw Loki mount Frodo to the point that Frodo actually fell over and then they had a bit of a scuffle and Frodo chased Loki upstairs. I’ve had a look at them both and can’t see any marks/bites/scratches on either of them. But within an hour I’ve seen them do this twice. I’m worried that they’re going to have a fight and hurt each other.

I know that a bit of mounting, grumbles, strutting and chasing is normal boar behaviour especially with the hormonal surges they have at this age but at what point should I be worried? I’m obviously not able to see them all the time because they’re outside. I have nowhere to bring them inside.

I’m really concerned about them. Any advice is greatly appreciated!
 
Tagging @Wiebke in for you in this one, I have no experience with boys unfortunately
 
sport_billy said:
Tagging @Wiebke in for you in this one, I have no experience with boys unfortunately
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Thanks! I’m just worried that something is gonna happen while I’m at work or something because they’re getting worse with each other. It’s so upsetting, I just want them to get along 😢
 
Fozzy44 said:
I’ve had my 2 boars for about 3 months. They were about 12-13 weeks when I bought them. They live outside in a large double storey hutch. There has always been a bit of grumbling between the 2 of them but nothing bad.

Recently tho the smaller of the pair (Loki) has been mounting the bigger one (Frodo) constantly. Usually Frodo responds to this with a bit of rumblestrutting and then they’ll both behave and be nice to each other. But today while I was out freshening up their cage I saw Loki mount Frodo to the point that Frodo actually fell over and then they had a bit of a scuffle and Frodo chased Loki upstairs. I’ve had a look at them both and can’t see any marks/bites/scratches on either of them. But within an hour I’ve seen them do this twice. I’m worried that they’re going to have a fight and hurt each other.

I know that a bit of mounting, grumbles, strutting and chasing is normal boar behaviour especially with the hormonal surges they have at this age but at what point should I be worried? I’m obviously not able to see them all the time because they’re outside. I have nowhere to bring them inside.

I’m really concerned about them. Any advice is greatly appreciated!
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Hi!

Please take the time to read our teenage guide. It will take you through all the aspects in detail, including temporary separations (usually 1-2 days to allow the hormone spike to die down as long as you aren't doing it all them time, which can add to a destabilisation) and how to work out whether a bond is still viable or not.
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
 
Wiebke said:
Hi!

Please take the time to read our teenage guide. It will take you through all the aspects in detail, including temporary separations (usually 1-2 days to allow the hormone spike to die down as long as you aren't doing it all them time, which can add to a destabilisation) and how to work out whether a bond is still viable or not.
Boars: Teenage, Bullying, Fighting, Fall-outs And What Next?
Click to expand...

I had read that and I know that it says some of the behaviour is normal boars trying to establish dominance. I’m just worried because they’re outside pigs, I can’t see what they’re up to all the time and there’s no way I can bring them inside. The hutch can be separated into 2 floors, and each have a floor to themselves but they wouldn’t be able to see the other pig at all. I don’t want to jump the gun and separate them too early and ruin the chance of them being together, but equally I’d never forgive myself if they had a fight and one of them got hurt.
 
Bring each boar out for floor/cuddle time and observe their behavior. My two boys were in a similar situation, and as soon as they were away from each other, they perked up noticeably. I did end up separating mine, but think very thoroughly before separating, boars usually can't be rebonded if you change your mind.
 
Hi - I have had boars for a while and recently an upset as 1 passed (1 of 2 brothers) and we recently brought a younger one in. The 2 brothers when young would often display rumblestrutting (more when younger) but teeth chattering most nights when food was given & one of them wanted prime spot! There was only 1 time an incident occurred where Domino ended up with a bloody nose clearly from a tustle but even then, when I found that the next day they were calm with one another. Having a little ruck, a nip even or constantly trying (unsuccessfully) to be top banana usually ends in nothing. In a way you have to let them get on with it, unlessof course you really feel they are at it constantly (reading @Wiebke posts) & need separating. But don't necesarilly assume a scuffle with Boars is the start of separation because it might not be.
Gregory (my new addition) is on the hump big time...I've placed a teddy in the pen for him to hump instead of Domino but again, any little nips, chattering & rumble strutting are normal & they need to work it out....or worst case be separated.
My 2 boars tried to establish dominance for 4 1/2 years to no avail.....so tried each evening when they were brought in from.their outdoor run. Sometimes its just the way it is and as long as nobody is getting hurt, I'd see how they go for a bit. Boys eh!
 
Darcey15 said:
Hi - I have had boars for a while and recently an upset as 1 passed (1 of 2 brothers) and we recently brought a younger one in. The 2 brothers when young would often display rumblestrutting (more when younger) but teeth chattering most nights when food was given & one of them wanted prime spot! There was only 1 time an incident occurred where Domino ended up with a bloody nose clearly from a tustle but even then, when I found that the next day they were calm with one another. Having a little ruck, a nip even or constantly trying (unsuccessfully) to be top banana usually ends in nothing. In a way you have to let them get on with it, unlessof course you really feel they are at it constantly (reading @Wiebke posts) & need separating. But don't necesarilly assume a scuffle with Boars is the start of separation because it might not be.
Gregory (my new addition) is on the hump big time...I've placed a teddy in the pen for him to hump instead of Domino but again, any little nips, chattering & rumble strutting are normal & they need to work it out....or worst case be separated.
My 2 boars tried to establish dominance for 4 1/2 years to no avail.....so tried each evening when they were brought in from.their outdoor run. Sometimes its just the way it is and as long as nobody is getting hurt, I'd see how they go for a bit. Boys eh!
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I’m really hoping they’ll sort it out and calm down. They use to always grumble at each other when one was in the bedroom part and the other came into it. But they sorted it out and agreed which hidey belongs to who and now they don’t seem to argue over the bedroom bit anymore. They’ve just started having these little tussles downstairs now 😕
I think I’m probably over worrying because they’re outside and I can’t keep an eye on them as closely as I’d like to.
 
Fozzy44 said:
I had read that and I know that it says some of the behaviour is normal boars trying to establish dominance. I’m just worried because they’re outside pigs, I can’t see what they’re up to all the time and there’s no way I can bring them inside. The hutch can be separated into 2 floors, and each have a floor to themselves but they wouldn’t be able to see the other pig at all. I don’t want to jump the gun and separate them too early and ruin the chance of them being together, but equally I’d never forgive myself if they had a fight and one of them got hurt.
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Can you create a grid divider that you can insert ASAP for a day or two if things look tense?

Outdoors piggies are more difficult because you can observe them less. Generally our advice is not to interfere unless there are full on fights.
Do your boys have roaming time in a cooler room during winter where you are observing them more easily or they hutch only piggies?
 
Wiebke said:
Can you create a grid divider that you can insert ASAP for a day or two if things look tense?

Outdoors piggies are more difficult because you can observe them less. Generally our advice is not to interfere unless there are full on fights.
Do your boys have roaming time in a cooler room during winter where you are observing them more easily or they hutch only piggies?
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They come into the kitchen (with the heating off and the door open) for a bit of a run around during the day. They’re mostly ok in the run, but the kitchen/diner is the full width of the house and they’re too busy doing mad zoomies from one end to the other so they haven’t got time to argue with each other.

Today when I went out Frodo was downstairs and Loki was upstairs. They seem to have split themselves up for a bit of a time out.

The only way to separate the hutch would be to close off the ladder, meaning one is upstairs, one is downstairs.

I really wish I could bring them in to be honest but I’ve had to move back in with my mum and she’s a hard no on having them in the house because she’s pretty much terrified of anything smaller than a cat
 
Fozzy44 said:
They come into the kitchen (with the heating off and the door open) for a bit of a run around during the day. They’re mostly ok in the run, but the kitchen/diner is the full width of the house and they’re too busy doing mad zoomies from one end to the other so they haven’t got time to argue with each other.

Today when I went out Frodo was downstairs and Loki was upstairs. They seem to have split themselves up for a bit of a time out.

The only way to separate the hutch would be to close off the ladder, meaning one is upstairs, one is downstairs.

I really wish I could bring them in to be honest but I’ve had to move back in with my mum and she’s a hard no on having them in the house because she’s pretty much terrified of anything smaller than a cat
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If your boys have worked out to give each other space, and your hutch has hideys, hay and water on each floor, then that is perfectly fine. The worst of the problems arise where boars cannot get away from each other and where owners cannot accept that piggies can be happier with having separate quarters instead of living up to the myth of being snuggly cuddle-uppers. it doesn't mean that they do not have a bond; just that theirs is not the kind of bond that you'd necessarily expect. ;)
Having regular roaming time work off extra pent-up energy is also helpful in diffusing problems to some point.
 
Hopefully the problems your boars are having will simply pass. My boys went through a "time" too. Buttercup would consistenly nip Ginger on his face/body, follow him, grumble, rumble, mount on him ALOT....I got scarred through that period between them but it was temporary and one day they just stopped and haven't started since...it was when they were about 9 months old so I think it was just a young age thing...
 
Wiebke said:
If your boys have worked out to give each other space, and your hutch has hideys, hay and water on each floor, then that is perfectly fine. The worst of the problems arise where boars cannot get away from each other and where owners cannot accept that piggies can be happier with having separate quarters instead of living up to the myth of being snuggly cuddle-uppers. it doesn't mean that they do not have a bond; just that theirs is not the kind of bond that you'd necessarily expect. ;)
Having regular roaming time work off extra pent-up energy is also helpful in diffusing problems to some point.
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I made sure I had at least 2 of everything when I got the boys just in case they had upsets and didn’t get along.

I think seeing Loki hounding Frodo and literally pulling him over frightened me a little bit because they’ve never been that bad before. They’ve had little niggles but nothing like that.

Hopefully with the way they’ve separated themselves today and had time to cool off a little bit they’ll be ok. They just worry me so much!
 
The teenage months are a very worrying time!

I REALLY wish more people would consider adopting an already stably paired up piggies from a good rescue instead of buying pretty little shop or breeder babies without any concern as to whether they are personality compatible or not; it would make my job so much easier... :(
 
Wiebke said:
The teenage months are a very worrying time!

I REALLY wish more people would consider adopting an already stably paired up piggies from a good rescue instead of buying pretty little shop or breeder babies without any concern as to whether they are personality compatible or not; it would make my job so much easier... :(
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Sometimes you can get lucky (My buttercup was from a pet store and then ginger was rescued) but I totally agree
 
Wiebke said:
The teenage months are a very worrying time!

I REALLY wish more people would consider adopting an already stably paired up piggies from a good rescue instead of buying pretty little shop or breeder babies without any concern as to whether they are personality compatible or not; it would make my job so much easier... :(
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I would have loved to have adopted but neither me nor my mum drive and there aren’t any rescues local to me that I could get to 🙁
 
The only rescues listed on the sites rescue locator as north west are in Macclesfield and Stoke. But I though Stoke/Staffordshire came under Midlands not North West? Only because that’s what it comes under for our ambulance services haha!
All the others I found online seem to be the other side of Manchester which would be 4+ train journeys away.
The only local rescue/adoptions I have are those within the Pets at Home shops and they only ever seem to have rabbits.
 
My trio of boars who have been together since birth to nearly 2yrs old have scuffles from time to time (more so than a pair would - in fact my pair very rarely do any humping or rumbling) but they are generally fine with each other. Boars can just be a bit bolshy with each other without really not liking each other.
 
I'm sorry you're going through that. I just had this happening as well.

I don't have any rescues around either - in my case, there are no rescues in my country that I know of -, and I ended up getting my boys from a store. They were babies and the only possible pair at the time. Hopefully, next time I'll be able to adopt from someone who's surrendering their pig(s), or even find out about some unknown rescue.
 
So I had to separate them. They ended up having a fight and causing small injuries to each other. I was terrified thinking they were going to seriously hurt each other, it really was quite frightening to see.
They both got checked over by the vets and both are ok. I managed to persuade my mum to let me bring them inside so I could keep an eye on them. They’re now in 2 120 cages ontop of each other. They were both losing weight before and have now put it back on again and both seem a lot happier since they’ve been separated. Frodo is really coming out of his shell and Loki is eating again.
I’ve been letting them out in the kitchen everyday in the run which I’ve separated in half (it’s a C&C cage 4x8 so they’ve got 2x8 each) and they’re really happy being able to see each other and interact through the bars, lots of wheeking and popcorning around. They seemed to be getting on well so I took one of the middle panels out to see how they got in together. They lasted about 20-30 minutes before they started with all the grumbles/teeth chattering really loudly/nipping/mounting/pulling each other over etc. I tried to see if it was just like rough play but then Frodo got super annoyed with Loki and pushed him over and bit his front paw.
I think they’re just happier with their own space but they like to know the other is there and interact and have a chat through the bars but not have to actually have any contact.

I’m unsure of what to do now tho. Should I leave them like this? They’re both putting weight back on, running around and seem happy enough. Or should I to get them neutered and get them a little girl friend each? I’m slightly worried that they’re both just antisocial and won’t get on with any other piggies and then I’ll have more pigs and more problems.

Sorry for the mega long post!
 
I’m far from an expert, just want to put that out there before I say anything else!
I would think that if they are happy living on their own and can still have interactions then You could leave them as they are. But I guess it depends if you have the space for more cages/hutches and can afford to have another two or more piggies then maybe it’s worth a try? They do like to be social but just like humans there must be some antisocial piggies out there!
Sorry I’m not much help, hope you can sort it out. It must be so stressful ❤️
 
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