Will my boars be friends again!

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little munch

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Please help. I have 2 Boars, Patch and Barney. They are around 6 months old and have been fighting. Patch has always rumbled at Barney and he mounts and sprays but it has now become almost continuous. Barney will no longer tolerate this and will attack Patch when he rumbles which has resulted in injuries to Patch.

Barney is not aggressive without provocation and he never rumbles. They are now seperated side by side but squeak a lot as they seem to miss each other. This is not an ideal situation as I don't have enough room.
The vet has suggested neutering the less dominant one but I don't know which it is.
Will it be possible to house them together again?
 
Hi Little munch.Welcome to the forum :)p

Sorry to hear that you are having problem with Patch and Barney
I have boars too and they went through lots of rumbles, strutting, chasing and mounting behaviour at about the same age as your two. They were both the same age so both sorting out the pecking order. They did come through it as none of them drew blood so I didnt split them up. They get along fine now, and one is more dominant than the other and they still go through mounting & chasing when the mood takes them. This is normal boar behaviour and a sticky thread on this is linked here http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=28949&highlight=boars

I'm afraid your vet has got it wrong though on neuturing Guinea pigs. mallethead
Neutering does little to change the behavior of aggressive guinea pigs, unlike the effect it has on other types of animals. Likewise, neutering does little to curb mounting or sexual behavior. It will prevent unwanted pregnancies. There is no need or reason to neuter two boars living together. If they don't get along now, neutering won't help. As quoted from this very informative site - http://www.cavyspirit.com/neutering.htm

Also pasted this information from same site -
Please note: Males living with males (and no females) do NOT need to be neutered! It will NOT change their behavior.

When you pair up a young guinea pig with any other guinea pig (young or old), there is a chance that as he or she goes through their adolescent period (3-5 months), they will challenge the other guinea pig for top guinea pig position. This can lead to some fighting. Most of the time they figure it out for themselves. Occasionally, the fighting is extreme and they must be permanently separated. Again, remember this can happen with ANY guinea pig pair, male/male or female/female.

I hope you find this forum helpful, as we are very helpful friendly bunch of piggie slaves :)
 
Thanks for that, I will definitely avoid the neutering route! Do you think I have been too hasty in seperating?

Is it too late to house together again. They have been apart 3 days now and Patch still rumbles at Barney through the bars also ther is a lot of squeaking from both now
 
Morning :)

little munch said:
Thanks for that, I will definitely avoid the neutering route! Do you think I have been too hasty in seperating?
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I'm not sure as you have said Patch got injured and if this was the case then of course you should have separted them.
Did you read the sticky http://www.theguineapigforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=28949&highlight=boars If it got to this stage of behaviour - Quote -
Serious aggression/fighting:
If the above events do not calm down fairly quickly, this can escalate into the pigs lunging or pouncing at each other, loud rumbling, obviously vicious bites rather than nips, a concentrated mixture of most of the above warnings (snorting, obvious rearing up on their haunches as if rearing up to fight, raised hackles, loud rumbling, yawning and loud teeth clacking - this noise is unmistakeable), and will likely result in pigs causing serious damage to each other - the pigs will have to be separated immediately.

little munch said:
Is it too late to house together again. They have been apart 3 days now and Patch still rumbles at Barney through the bars also ther is a lot of squeaking from both now
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If now you are thinking your boys behaviour didnt get to this seperation stage (and only you can judge by observing them) and Patch got nipped rather than Injured (sorry trying to express best I can) and you want to try again by putting them together then obviously make sure you can be around to watch.
I have never seperated mine for that length of time but hopefully people that have will come along and add to your thread.
The only time I seperated was this Spring, when my boys were over a year old and Pepper continually kept mounting Salt - he was a pig obsessed rolleyes so I put in a grid barrier to calm things down for a few hours. I used food distraction also, but when I put them in the outdoor grass run it started again and had to do the same, this went on for about 3 days.

Also boars do get on better if they have plenty of space, make sure you have them housed in the biggest possible home you can with more than one hidey house, I find it better the hideys that have 2 exits so that one boar doesnt get cornered. My 2 love to jump up on things to get out of the way of the other.
Pepper on top, Salt peeking underneath.
DSCF6159.jpg


A big lump of hay throw in with them is a good distraction deteront too.

Rumble, strutting and swaying hips is more of a courtship expression where highly charged Guinea pigs hormones are taking over. Its when the other piggie has had enough of being bombarded with the advances that fall outs begin. However Guinea pigs are very demonstative in their behaviour - and this is normal, and as long as one isnt getting too distessed or injured it can just be observed.

Hope other people can add their experiences too.
:)
 
when my boars had a fight which drew blood, after one started mounting and chattering i put them in a run with grass hay dry food and veg, then gave them a bath together, they have never even chattered since!

I also disinfected the hutch, and filled that with food afterwards.

If they fight again, badly i would separate them, and either find them another boar for a friend, or nueter and find a lady-friend!

x
 
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Thanks for all your advice. I tried them together in the run today but Patch just will not quit and they ended up chattering at each other and became aggressive again. Also Patch keeps making a weird "clacking" noise. Does anyone know what this is?

I may try the bath and see how that goes.
 
Yes, try the bath thing.

I had a pair who fought and had to be separated; after that, they were very nervous of each other - they would share my lap, but there was no way they would have been happy in a shared cage. They lived side-by-side, which seemed to suit them pretty well.

If they have not actually fought, as in drawn blood, then I would persevere. At the end of the day, you have to do what is right for your boys - they do like the company of other pigs, but if they are not happy together (as, sadly, my Tom and Jez were not), then side-by-side is a good compromise.
 
I only have sows, so this may not be relevant. However, I did notice with my two sows that I kept together from birth, the adolescent age (around where your boys are now) was the age of loud squabbles and fights. Though it never got to the point of separation and no one ever drew blood, for a couple of months we had regular loud piggy arguments- sometimes several times a day. Once they got a bit older, they settled in again and we had far less fighting.

After one of this pair died, we introduced another sow to the remaining sow... what helped the most was to totally dismantle and scrub down the cage. The older sow was very set on defending 'her' cage from the intruder (although she was quite happy to be with the new pig on neutral territory.) Once we removed her scent from the cage and the cage accessories she didn't see it as 'hers' anymore and didn't feel the need to defend it from the new pig. After that they moved in quite happily (and actually get along better than the original pair that lived together from birth.) If there are dominance issues around the cage, scrubbing the whole thing down and making it 'new' might be a fresh start for them.
 
Thanks. I don't think it is a territory thing as Patch is still rumbling at Barney from his seperate cage. Barney seems quite miserable now so I think I may neuter him and get him a girlfriend. Patch on the other hand has become more outgoing and friendly since the seperation so maybe he would prefer to be alone.

I will try the bath and cage scrub first though and try to reunite them!

Thanks again:)
 
little munch said:
Thanks for all your advice. I tried them together in the run today but Patch just will not quit and they ended up chattering at each other and became aggressive again. Also Patch keeps making a weird "clacking" noise. Does anyone know what this is?

I may try the bath and see how that goes.
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It's not a good noise and they do this before they lunge. Personally I think once blood is drawn it's over.

I have had 2 failed bondings now one was boars and my sow and boar 2 days ago I had to separate, which was devastating but once you get over the initial they aren't going to live together it's not so bad. The sow was constantly bullying, and wounds although not bad were being inflicted.

Chattering, lunging, hackles up all not very good signs. Fury balls, normally mean a serious fight is or about too take place I step in at this point. I prefer to avoid bloody wounds when possible!

Good luck with your boars, I have heard bathing some pigs can work although I didn't try it, as I beleive the problems would have continued. :(

Also I have heard about a thing you get for dogs that you plug in it calms them, I hope someone can tell us what the name is? ?/
 
Thanks for all your advice. I will give it another go on neutral territory. Patch's injuries were scratches around his face and ears so don't know if this counts as drawing blood. If Patch would stop the rumbling I'm sure they would be OK.
 
little munch said:
Thanks for all your advice. I will give it another go on neutral territory. Patch's injuries were scratches around his face and ears so don't know if this counts as drawing blood. If Patch would stop the rumbling I'm sure they would be OK.
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My boar had a bite under his lip. I would say if they are going into balls of fury don't hold your hopes too high. My two failed pairings did this!

If you think theres still a chance I would try again, I reintroduced both my failed pairings before giving up.

Good Luck xx
 
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