• Discussions taking place within this forum are intended for the purpose of assisting you in discussing options with your vet. Any other use of advice given here is done so at your risk, is solely your responsibility and not that of this forum or its owner. Before posting it is your responsibility you abide by this Statement

Bob's got a runny nose and a bad breath smell...

Status
Not open for further replies.

happycath

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Apr 22, 2009
Messages
440
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Eastbourne, East Sussex
Hi all,

Over the last couple of days Bob has developed a slightly runny nose and a distinctive 'bad breath' type smell around his head area - I've got a vet appointment for 9.30 tomorrow, but just wondering if anyone has any ideas or advice? Does this sound like a URI? He seems ok otherwise - eyes are bright, breathing a little snuffley due to runny nose but no wheezing, generally alert etc.

I've had a look through previous posts about runny noses etc but can't see anything about the bad breath smell, although I'm sure read it before?

Hope he's not too poorly he's only been with us a month :(
 
It sounds like a typical URI, but please do make sure that you mention to the vet the bad breath as this can be signs of other problems. I hope all goes well at the vets, let us all know how it goes.

x.
 
Thanks Abi_nurse, I'll make sure I mention it. Am I right in thinking that if he's given an antibiotic (is baytril antibiotic?) that he also needs a probiotic?
 
Yes Baytril is an antibiotic called enrofloxacin. It is ideal to use a probiotic as sometimes the baytril can kill off many of the piggies 'good bacteria' in the guts. So I'm sure the vet wont have a problem giving you some to suppliment in too. Just ask, should be fine.

x.
 
Please ask the vet to check for problems in the mouth/throat area to make sure that the bad breath is solely due to URI.

Weigh him daily as long as he is not well.

Look out for loss of appetite or soft poos and contact the vet asap - not every piggy takes to baytril. It should always be given together with a probiotic to keep the guts going.
 
Thanks all, very helpful.
Bob's breathing worsened this evening so I took the decision to take him to the overnight emergency vet, having watched Rocky go downhill so quickly before he passed away I'd hate to regret not having acted when I could have with Bob.
Anyway, the emergency vet listened to his head and chest with a stethoscope and said it's a URI which hasn't gone to his lungs thankfully. She gave him a good checkover and an injection of baytril. She didnt seem too concerned about the bad smell issue - she had a good look inside his mouth and said it was an infected type smell so presumably associated with upper respiratory infection.
As it's an overnight emergency vet who provide night cover for the vet I'm actually registered with they couldn't dispense any meds tonight, so my appointment for the morning still stands & they send the notes through from tonight. I'm actually glad about this because I'd like a second opinion on the bad breath/smell issue.
Bob is quiet tonight, but has had some veggies and hay.
I'll keep you updated.
 
Forgot to say - the vet I saw tonight didn't think probiotics would be necessary, I'll be firmer tomorrow when I see my registered vet. Will he be alright without them tonight?
 
good move taking him to the emergency vet, and good luck tomorrow. deffo push for the probiotics, if you ask for them they should give you them. keep us updated!
 
Firstly sorry for the slow update, I couldn't get onto the forum last night for some reason, it wouldn't load. I must apologise in advance because I've been on such an emotional rollercoaster that this might turn into quite a ramble...

I'll pick up where I left off - I took him to the vet yesterday (Mon) morning and the vet was great, listened to my concerns, answered questions, very sympathetic & quite knowledgable etc. He said he wasn't sure it hadn't gone onto his lungs, he was given another baytil injection and one of metacam. The vet thought he had "quite an infection" and the smell is a distinctely 'infected' smell and the vet said it is solely related to the URI. Vet was quite concerned so we made another appointment to go back this morning (Tues) for more injections & a check up. He did give me some probiotics because I asked for them.

Yesterday evening he was still very snotty and his breathing was very noisy and laboured, very upsetting. No worse than the morning, but no better either. Then out of nowhere he had a nosebleed, poor little chap. I dabbed it as best I could, it bled a small amount for about 10 minutes then stopped itself. He really looks like he's been in the wars now because I don't want to stress him out by trying to clean the dried blood off too much! When it first started I panicked and phoned the emergency vet who was very kind but said there wouldn't be much she could do, as he had already had meds that day, but call back if it didn't stop. Thank goodness it did.

So we went back to the vet this morning for another baytril injection & another metacam injection. The vet said it is very good that he is relatively bright considering the infection he's got. He also suggested a few drops of olbas on a tissue near the cage to help clear the congestion he's suffering with, so I've done that. He's laying near by so obviously doesn't hate the smell.
However, the additional problem we have now is that he is not eating and drinking because he is so blocked up and irritated that he is breathing through his mouth (sort of gasping) and therefore anything in his mouth makes him cough. This started yesterday really, although he did take a few small springs of parsely from me last night, he seems to be struggling to eat hay or nuggets, and doesn't show interest in the usual veggies. He has lost weight :( The vet obviously said not to syringe feed as he is breathing through his mouth, the last thing he needs is wet food on his lungs... But I'm struggling to get anything at all into him today, not even parsely. I'm hoping the olbas will have started to do its job when I go to try another feed in a minute. The vet also gave me some critical care to offer him today, as the hay content might tempt him. It hasn't yet but watch this space! He showed some interest in the nuggets and hay earlier, but coughed the nuggets out and gave up with the hay. I'm encouraged that he wants to eat, but worried that he can't.

Any other suggestions for clearing congestion or encouraging him to eat? If we can unblock his nose he'll breathe through it - if he's breathing ok he'll hopefully eat! I'm concerned that we'll have an even bigger problem on our hands if he doesn't eat soon.
Fingers crossed, sorry for the ramble xxxxx
 
I'm really sorry i cant be more helpfull, but if you mush up the pellets (pour boiling water over them and leave to cool) This might tempt him, as it is a familiar smell but in an easier form to eat.

Sorry i cant help more. Hope he gets better soon! :(
 
Thank you Connie, that's a really good point about familiar smell. Not sure how much he can smell at the moment but worth a try :)
Poor little sausage, I'm willing him to get better, I've even begged him :( I feel so awful that we should have caught it sooner and now he's really poorly because we didn't. Trying to keep positive but I'm a bit up and down - a bit like him really.
 
If he has a URI it may also be worth getting him some diuretics to clear the fluid, from the vets. Keep him warm, pop a snuggle safe heatpad in his cage or a warm hot water bottle wrapped in a towel under his bedding.

If he doesn't like the taste of Critical Care then try him with some softened pellets (boiled water on them, then leave to cool before giving) offered on a spoon.

Hope he picks up soon :)
 
I second giving some diuretics like frusemide.
http://www.guineapighelpline.com/WarningRespiratoryDifficulties.pdf

Trying to hand feed is also good; your care can make all the difference - guineas pigs need to breathe first, drink second and only eat third. When the breathing is laboured, you need to help with the drinking and eating. Don't forget fluids; and add some vitamin C as well (1/8-1/4 dissolved supermarket tablet).

If baytril doesn't work, try zithromax (azithromycin). It is a very strong antibacterial antibiotic that can be given to guinea pigs as a last ditch effort.
This is the vet who has researched it, if your vet wants to ask for confirmation and more details: Simon Maddock http://www.inorthamptonshire.co.uk/profile/457491/Northampton/Cat-and-Rabbit-Care-Clinic/
Zithromax has saved Hywel's life.

I'm keeping my fingers firmly crossed for Bob!
 
Last edited:
Thank you SO much for all your advice and support.

Just had another unsuccessful attempt at encouraging him to eat. He won't take anything voluntarily and anything I put in his mouth he splutters and spits out.
On the plus side he is still fairly bright - obviously not like normal, but if I go over and move things about or try to stroke him, he's up & investigating. He was trying to escape from the table when I was offering him all of the various foods/drinks! It was a buffet of critical care, mushed up pellets, parsley, carrot, water, dioralyte and cut up hay! He still turned his nose up though. He just doesn't want anything in his mouth. He managed a small strand of hay this afternoon on his own (never been so pleased to see normal behaviour...) but that's all at the mo.

So I just rang the vets to discuss the possibility of using a diuretic to get things moving - but as the vet believes that Bob's mucus is in his nose rather than his lungs (which I am taking a good news) he'd rather not go down that road at the moment. Could be something to consider at tomorrow's appointment apparently if things haven't improved. I didn't speak to the vet directly, but the lady I spoke to was SO helpful. She has offered me the option of taking him in to be hospitalised overnight so they can give him some 'sub cut' (?) fluids. I'm really torn & weighing up the pros and cons - pro: he'd be getting some fluids into him, con: stress from unfamiliar environment. Hmmmmm. I've got until 6.30 to decide whether I'd like to take him in (they close at 7).
She did say that I can always have him taken in tomorrow morning when I come for the appointment, if he goes downhill overnight.

I've got a little video of him struggling to breathe, I'll try to get it uploaded.
 
Has your vet given you some bisolvon powder? I have been given that on occasion; about a pinch per day.

I would strongly recommend talking about zithromax with your vet; I am not convinced that there is not another issue, like an abscess in the mouth or a throat infection, as the spitting out/not swallowing is not typical for URI. Zithromax is also the best AB for a nasty abscess.
 
Here it is. Please excuse the dried blood and general muckiness of poor Bobby's little nose, I don't want to stress him out further by putting a damp cloth on his nose to clean it up...



Oh, there's another one - this was just now. Breathing more 'clicky' but might be breathing through his nose? Can't be sure.



Sorry they're not great quality.
 
No, no bisolvon powder, will ask tomorrow morning. How would I get it into him if he isn't keen on eating or drinking?
I will mention zithromax if no improvement by tomorrow too - he's had three injections of baytril with no improvement... Due another tomorrow morning but maybe vet will be open to suggestions - he has been so far with probiotics etc.
Just been to check on the little fella - still noisey but much less 'gaspy' than in the first video. Think he is still breathing through his mouth, but maybe a combination of the two?

EDIT: forgot to say I will ask the vet to look in his mouth again to check for other possible causes. On the one hand I can understand him not wanting to block his mouth if he is breathing through it, on the other hand I'm wondering if URI is all that's going on too.
 
Last edited:
Oh dear poor little man :(

I think you may need the Zithromax, what about getting your vet to ring Simon in Northampton in the morning to discuss it?

The blood does worry me a bit. It could be he has clotted blood stuck in his nose & obstructing his breathing.

Is he in pain? If so he needs adequate pain relief otherwise he won't eat.
Could there be another ongoing problem? Such as dental problems, or fungal in his mouth making it hard/painful to eat at all.

Fingers crossed for you.
 
Thanks Poppy's Mum.
I don't believe it is the blood obstructing his breathing, both nostrils have been producing discharge so presumably not blocked. Just inflamed and fragile I suspect. The discharge is clear/creamish (better than the yellowish mucus he was producing before I'm hoping?), not blood stained. Neither of the vets I spoke to about it (emergency and normal) were too concerned about the blood, especially as it stopped itself relatively soon after starting. I might be wrong but I would expect a constantly running nose to 'dissolve' or pick up any hard congealed blood and flush it out, what do you think?

Literally just spoken to vet's practice, and on their recommendation I'm taking him in tonight so they can keep an eye on him and give him some sub cuteaneous (excuse spelling) fluids to keep him hydrated. Really scared now :( I know he'll be in the best place but it will be hard not being able to see how he is whenever I want.

Right leaving now, thank you everyone all for your advice & kind words - it means the world to have such trustworthy advice and support. I'll keep you updated.
 
Aw, poor Bob and it must be such a worry for you too :(
Sending healing vibes to him and wishing him sweet dreams - he'll be well cared for I'm sure but understand how you feel.
Be a good piggy Bob and get well very soon sweetie x>>
Hugs to mummy as well x
 
aww, really sorry to hear Bob is still struggling, fingers crossed for him here.
being in the hospital is probably best, i know i struggled with the decision for Wiggle, but i'm glad i did have him admitted in the end. I'm assuming its the St Annes hospital? If so, they are really good, and the nurses are lovely.

Big hugs and wheeks x
 
It is St Anne's, thank you sooooo much for the recommendation they're a world apart from previous experiences with vets. I dropped the little guy off about half an hour ago, feeling positive that he's being looked after by people far more knowledgable and confident than me.
Vet said he is upping the baytril dose but not changing antibiotic yet (don't think it's off the cards entirely but he wants to persevere with baytril for now) he said he'd recently been on a course about guinea pigs (good sign :) ) where the correct dosage was discussed as manufacturers were issuing incorrect dosages for piggies? So he is upping the dose from 5mg to 25mg - does that sound right? I may have got my numbers muddled, it's been an odd day.

Thanks for the hugs guinea pig slave - I need them tonight as OH is out at a work thing! Just me and a confused-looking Rufus this evening!
 
Bless you little one. The dosage certainly does sound right. 5mg would barely touch the sides to be honest, thats more like a dog/cat dose. Piggies need a much higher dose as they metabolise the drug much quicker. I usually have any of my piggies on a 20mg/kg dose if any need it.

Sending lots of healing vibes for him. I really hope he starts to pick up soon. Hopefully, some fluids, food and some support of being in hospital will help and you will have him back home soon.

x.
 
Thanks for the reassurance on the dosage & reasoning Abi nurse - no wonder he wasn't improving. Glad he is on the right one now! Can't believe manufacturers are issuing incorrect or incomplete information, that's worrying.

It's Jim I'm seeing at St Anne's, he's great. He seems to genuinely care and be thinking of alternatives etc - rather than just treating in a routine fashion and hoping for the best, he seems to be treating Bob like the little individual that he is! When I dropped Bobby off last night he came through to the waiting room specially to have a chat - he didn't have to as I was only checking him in with the nurses but it meant a lot.

I've spoken to them this morning, Bob is stable and he ate some hay overnight that they had chopped small for him :)) and they sent someone out this morning to get some parsely to tempt him with heehee. Can't get over how lovely they are :) He's having sub - cut fluids today, and I've got to call back later this afternoon for an update.

I keep seeing his little face when I close my eyes, I was with him so intensively over the last couple of days that I miss his little face now! Keep watching the little video I posted earlier, just to get a little fix of him LOL.

Fingers crossed he keeps up the good work!
 
I am glad that you have found a vet you can hopefully trust and who can pull Bob through. Most general vets and producers underestimate the dosage for guinea pigs because they downscale from cats and don't take the unusually fast metabolism of guinea pigs into account - if they are aware of that in the first place!

Wishing you and Bob all the best!
 
Keeping Bob in my thoughts x
 
What a wonderful and caring vet, you must be very relieved. Its awful having them in hospital but he is in good hands.

Sending you lots of hugs and healing vibes and keeping everything crossed for you both. xx
 
Jim is absolutely great, i have only seen him a handful of times, he's the main partner!
I always think its funny how his name is Jim Dash and he's a tortoise specialist! :(|)

So glad Bob is doing well, keep going Bob! xx
 
Oh yeah, the connection hadn't occured to me! Glad you agree he's great - does feel reassuring to have the top guy on the case :)
Spoke to them this evening and Bob hasn't improved :( but he hasn't worsened either. He's now on the higher baytril dose of 25mg and also had an appetite stimulant today (can't remember the name of the drug...). He's only had a mouthful of parsley. And they've given him some fluids but have stopped for now because his breathing is so laboured they don't want to worsen it by filling his little body with fluid.
I'm calling back in the morning to see how he did overnight. Can't help but wonder how long he can go without eating properly before his body starts to shut down 8... I know I should be staying positive but the reality of things keeps sneaking in.
I've got everything crossed that the second higher baytril dose he had this evening will kick in tonight and there will be good news tomorrow.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top