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Breathing Difficulties

Janey

Janey

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Adult Guinea Pig
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Since I had her Maisie's breathing has always seemed laboured to me, and of course when I got her I had her checked out - no crackling or other noises, no other symptoms. After listening to her heart again today and looking her over, we discussed it and the vet has suggested a scan of her heart and lungs as she suspects a condition called pericardial effusion. Apparently this is where the gap between the fibrous lining that surrounds the heart and the heart itself can fill with liquid, meaning that the heart can no longer expand and contract as much as it needs to in order to pump the blood around the body. We both noticed that Maisie's feet were looking quite purple today and this could be the reason why - as her blood isn't being oxygenated enough. Poor little piggy. She's booked in for the scan on Monday. If the scan shows this is the case, the fluid can be drained, providing there is enough of it. This will require a heavy sedation though - not quite as much as a GA, but a significant amount. If there is only a little fluid, we can go down the route of medications to help disperse it, in order to prevent any oedema.
 
Janey said:
Since I had her Maisie's breathing has always seemed laboured to me, and of course when I got her I had her checked out - no crackling or other noises, no other symptoms. After listening to her heart again today and looking her over, we discussed it and the vet has suggested a scan of her heart and lungs as she suspects a condition called pericardial effusion. Apparently this is where the gap between the fibrous lining that surrounds the heart and the heart itself can fill with liquid, meaning that the heart can no longer expand and contract as much as it needs to in order to pump the blood around the body. We both noticed that Maisie's feet were looking quite purple today and this could be the reason why - as her blood isn't being oxygenated enough. Poor little piggy. She's booked in for the scan on Monday. If the scan shows this is the case, the fluid can be drained, providing there is enough of it. This will require a heavy sedation though - not quite as much as a GA, but a significant amount. If there is only a little fluid, we can go down the route of medications to help disperse it, in order to prevent any oedema.
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Poor girl! I hope that all goes well for her! Good that you have got access to a good vet!
 
Thanks Wiebke. Without the scan, things aren't going to improve. If the vet is right and there is enough liquid there to drain, I'll be a nervous wreck about her having the anaesthetic, but I have to put my trust in the vet and hope Maisie is ok.
 
Maisie had her scan today, and although I haven't spoken to my vet yet (she's going to call me tomorrow to discuss how it went today), the vet nurse who discharged Maisie, was able to tell me that there wasn't any fluid around her heart, so no sedation needed thankfully. The nurse did say that the left ventricle of the heart was 'within normal limits' which suggests to me it might be a little bigger than expected, but I don't know what that could mean as yet. She also said it could be a lung problem / asthma - I didn't know piggies could have asthma, but again will know more tomorrow when I talk to my vet.
 
So the outcome of speaking to my vet today, leaves us with two options. 1) Do nothing, as vet thinks Maisie doesn't seem to be bothered / affected by this issue, or 2) try an inhaler for a week, as she feels it is one of two things causing the laboured breathing. At some point in the past (before I had her) Maisie possibly had an infection which has left her with reduced lung function or she has piggy asthma / allergies.

I want to try the inhaler to see if it'll improve things for Maisie, but just the process of trying to hold a mask over her face for up to 2 minutes could prove very stressful for her and would defeat the whole object of the exercise. Any thoughts anyone?
 
Bump
 
Could the inhaler meds be added to a nebuliser @Janey? If so you could make a nebuliser chamber (pet carrier covered in towels/blankets) and then set up the nebuliser. I have a cheap nebuliser from Amazon I use just for the piggies.
 
VickiA said:
Could the inhaler meds be added to a nebuliser @Janey? If so you could make a nebuliser chamber (pet carrier covered in towels/blankets) and then set up the nebuliser. I have a cheap nebuliser from Amazon I use just for the piggies.
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Thanks @VickiA I don’t know the answer to that. Never come across a nebuliser before - from what you’re saying, is it an enclosed box that they sit in and the drug is somehow pumped into that instead of using a mask?
 
I just put the piggy in a pet carrier covered in towels and instead of using the face mask I use the pipe to nebulise directly into the carrier.
 
VickiA said:
I just put the piggy in a pet carrier covered in towels and instead of using the face mask I use the pipe to nebulise directly into the carrier.
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Thanks again Vicki, I’ll ask the vets about it.
 
@Janey My vet used to laugh every time I took Anselmo to see her because of his pet carrier. I used it as his nebulisation chamber covering it in cling film so the solution couldn't escape. She called it his 'rain cover'.

It's much easier than a mask. Instead of attaching a mask to the pipe you just poke it through a hole in the cling film into the box.

Then they get the full impact of the solution. When I used to open the door to let him out it was like he was emerging through the doors on Stars in your Eyes! All foggy!
 
Jaycey said:
@Janey My vet used to laugh every time I took Anselmo to see her because of his pet carrier. I used it as his nebulisation chamber covering it in cling film so the solution couldn't escape. She called it his 'rain cover'.

It's much easier than a mask. Instead of attaching a mask to the pipe you just poke it through a hole in the cling film into the box.

Then they get the full impact of the solution. When I used to open the door to let him out it was like he was emerging through the doors on Stars in your Eyes! All foggy!
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Thanks @Jaycey. I've got to wait until Friday now to speak with my vet about whether I can use the inhaler meds in a nebuliser. If I can, then I'll definitely be trying it, as it'll be a LOT easier on Maisie pig.
 
You’re welcome. I use it at the first sign of any respiratory infections in my piggies with just saline and F10 antiseptic solution. If you have a nebuliser it increases the options available to your vets for treatment. It doesn’t get used often, but it’s a godsend when I do use it.
 
VickiA said:
You’re welcome. I use it at the first sign of any respiratory infections in my piggies with just saline and F10 antiseptic solution. If you have a nebuliser it increases the options available to your vets for treatment. It doesn’t get used often, but it’s a godsend when I do use it.
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I've recently bought some F10, ready to use, because of the mites situation with Alice and Maisie. I didn't know you could use it like that though, but good to know. I've been reading up on nebulisers today funnily enough, and saline was mentioned amongst other things.
 
Janey said:
I've recently bought some F10, ready to use, because of the mites situation with Alice and Maisie. I didn't know you could use it like that though, but good to know. I've been reading up on nebulisers today funnily enough, and saline was mentioned amongst other things.
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Just watch out @Janey - there are 2 types of F10. The F10 for use in nebuliser is the Pink antiseptic one rather than the green cleaning one. Hope that makes sense.
 
Ok Vicki, thanks again! It's the green cleaning one I have - I didn't know there was two types. Every day is a school day right now (and that's ok!).
 
Janey said:
Ok Vicki, thanks again! It's the green cleaning one I have - I didn't know there was two types. Every day is a school day right now (and that's ok!).
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I still learn new things every day on the forum. You’ve just had a steeper learning curve than most! You’re doing brilliantly x
 
VickiA said:
I still learn new things every day on the forum. You’ve just had a steeper learning curve than most! You’re doing brilliantly x
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Thank you! I hate getting things wrong, so tend to worry a lot when stuff like this crops up x
 
@Janey We all get things wrong, no matter how long we've had piggies! I had no idea when I was told to get F10 by my vet so I had to go to the place that sells it and ask, then I bought the pre mixed stuff as I didn't trust myself with doing it myself
 
Jaycey said:
@Janey We all get things wrong, no matter how long we've had piggies! I had no idea when I was told to get F10 by my vet so I had to go to the place that sells it and ask, then I bought the pre mixed stuff as I didn't trust myself with doing it myself
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I wasn't too sure either, that's why I got the premixed stuff!
 
The vet has sent an email to me which gives the impression of her not thinking a nebuliser would work, as she says 'I think having a mask is important to ensure that the medication is inhaled by the guinea pig and not lost into the air.' I don't think Maisie would tolerate a mask directly on her face, so am really disappointed, as I was hoping we could try a nebuliser.
 
If you create a nebuliser chamber the medication isn’t lost into the air. I’m a bit baffled by that response to be fair.
 
Me too Vicki. I'm just trying to think of how I can word an email to her that won't sound like I'm disagreeing with her - she is the expert after all. I just want to try and help my piggy and think it has to be worth a try. The inhaler meds she was initially talking about were to be used for asthma/allergies, so not sure if there's a medication to treat that which comes in a liquid form suitable for use with a nebuliser. The vet's been tied up today, so not been able to speak with her to ask that.
 
Janey said:
The vet has sent an email to me which gives the impression of her not thinking a nebuliser would work, as she says 'I think having a mask is important to ensure that the medication is inhaled by the guinea pig and not lost into the air.' I don't think Maisie would tolerate a mask directly on her face, so am really disappointed, as I was hoping we could try a nebuliser.
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This was an interesting point, and I wondered what the answer was too.
I asked my vet today as Zebedee is currently having Baytril via a nebuliser, and her answer was that the dose was worked out by the amount of time needed for the pig to breathe in the required amount of medication. So I use 5ml of saline mixed with 1ml of Baytril, this takes 20 mins to all be nebulised. In that time, he will inhale the required amount of medication in the misty droplets in the air surrounding him. The rest of the nebulised Baytril may be 'wasted', but it isn't wasted in the same way as if he spat out syringed medicine, and at least in a nebuliser the medicine gets straight to the affected organ.

Hope this helps!
 
Qualcast&Flymo said:
This was an interesting point, and I wondered what the answer was too.
I asked my vet today as Zebedee is currently having Baytril via a nebuliser, and her answer was that the dose was worked out by the amount of time needed for the pig to breathe in the required amount of medication. So I use 5ml of saline mixed with 1ml of Baytril, this takes 20 mins to all be nebulised. In that time, he will inhale the required amount of medication in the misty droplets in the air surrounding him. The rest of the nebulised Baytril may be 'wasted', but it isn't wasted in the same way as if he spat out syringed medicine, and at least in a nebuliser the medicine gets straight to the affected organ.

Hope this helps!
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Thank you, that's really helpful to know. I need to talk to the vet about something else, so will talk to her about this as well.
 
Just got back from the vets. I explained that I didn't think Maisie would tolerate the mask over her face, that would need to be used for the inhaler, so we moved on to discuss a nebuliser, which the vet still has reservations about. She did suggest trying an oral drug which acts in a similar way to the inhaler, ie expands the airways to ease breathing; it's called Corvental D and is a capsule. I'll need to divide each capsule into 5 amounts, and mix the powder with 1ml of fruit juice which needs to be given twice daily. I've got enough for 2 weeks, so we'll see how that goes. If it does help, we can keep using it but if there's no change then we'll try a nebuliser.
 
That sounds interesting ! with a nebuliser you would sit maizie in a box with holes in,and then place nebuliser spout in the hole ! but the capsule sounds a better idea if it works.i will watch with interest as this may help Freya.I'm glad you were able to get some answers.well done for asking.:hug:
 
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