Yes, it should be OK, specially at their own young age. How old are they now exactly? They may be putting on weight simply on a good diet.
At this stage you still have to be patient and wait.
Engel's Herd
- Thread starter Engel
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Yes, it should be OK, specially at their own young age. How old are they now exactly? They may be putting on weight simply on a good diet.
At this stage you still have to be patient and wait.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Well let's hope that's the reason for weight gain! Fingers crossed.
They'll be 10 weeks old tomorrow. (They were born August 29th or so I'm told)
They were on a muesli mix with lots of grains and seeds. Now they're on a grain free Timothy based pellet (science selective) with unlimited grass hay. From what I could gather they were fed a lot of apples. When I asked they said anything veggie wise they cooked but couldn't give examples. They said no to lettuce and carrot. Because of this I'm treating them as if they've never had veggies and adding one new thing at a time. I know my weekly veg is ok on their tums but thinking of trying them with a variety using the guide to keep things interesting
Well let's hope that's the reason for weight gain! Fingers crossed.
They'll be 10 weeks old tomorrow. (They were born August 29th or so I'm told)
That is another 4-6 weeks to go; so it is a little bit early for showing, frankly.
Most sows have their first season between 4-6 weeks of age; and your piggies' weights are in the lower half of the normal weight range and not in the upper for their age. Concentrate on giving them a happy, active and enriched life on a food diet in the meantime.
Enrichment Ideas for Guinea Pigs
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Have you got a guide for pig weights? Id like to know what range is normal for their age and gender. More out of curiosity really as I don't know what they should way at this point. I know it's all on an individual basis but I think if anything it'll be interesting to see where they should be.
I'm not surprised that they're in the lower part considering the essentially crap care and diet they had before. (Excuse my language but the more I learn the more I'm appalled by where they came from
)I'll look at the enrichment thread thanks. A pile of hay seems to be the most exciting thing for them at the moment (I mean really exciting).
Have you got a guide for pig weights? Id like to know what range is normal for their age and gender. More out of curiosity really as I don't know what they should way at this point. I know it's all on an individual basis but I think if anything it'll be interesting to see where they should be.
I'm not surprised that they're in the lower part considering the essentially crap care and diet they had before. (Excuse my language but the more I learn the more I'm appalled by where they came from
I'll look at the enrichment thread thanks. A pile of hay seems to be the most exciting thing for them at the moment (I mean really exciting).
No, we don't have one; simply because it is not worth the paper it is printed on. As long as your two are healthy and active and continue to put on weight until they are between 4-6 months old during the initial fast growing phase, they are doing perfectly fine. Their weight gain and growth will slow down when it has reached a certain point and from then on happen more in spurts but this point happens at a different point for every piggy depending on its start in life. Very fast growing youngsters will suddenly stop growing at a rather young age when they hit that point early while smaller youngsters and piggies on not too rich a diet will keep growing steadily for longer.
On a good diet, every piggy will reach its optimal weight and size before adulthood; some do it sooner and others later. Average applies to only about half the youngsters; owners will worry unnecessarily about the other half. DEFINITELY a can of worms better not to opened! Especially as the normal weight range in adult piggies is even wider...
Weight - Monitoring and Management
But smaller pups are usually a bit slower to start procreating; that is the only relevance in my remark re. them being on the smaller side of average.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Understood. Hopefully it'll work in my favour then. Providing the weight gain is steady I neednt worry.
I will mention though that Oreo and Chunk had another brother which had already gone to his home the week before. (He was sexed as a she and the couple took the 2 girls which are now 1 boar and 1 sow). It actually turns out Chunk was the runt of the litter. Or was bullied away from food. Idk though. He's come on leaps and bounds since being here
The larger the litter, the greater the chance of a major weight and size variance as the food supply even in the womb is actually not quite evenly distributed. He will likely always remain on the slightly smaller side but that is in now way a hindrance to leading a happy , fulfilled and long life, as some of my own boars prove.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
I was told there was 4 in the litter but I don't know if they meant surviving pups. I don't mind if he's on the smaller side as long as he's happy and healthy. From looking at pictures Chunk was the smallest while Oreo was the biggest. The other 2 weren't anywhere as big as Oreo. Oreos like the monster of the group bless her. Even now she eats way more than Chunk
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Today I spoke to the vet about neutering Chunk which she said she can do but strongly suggests spaying Oreo instead as there's more reproductive issues in sows than boars generally speaking like pyometra, cancers ect.
I did ask if she had any experience with neutering piggies and she said she's done a lot of castrations and spays so is very confident with it.
(I also asked about galastop for potential pregnancy termination but she said while some use it it's not licensed for that and it's known to cause complications and isn't entirely effective. I know some of you said not to bother but I thought I'd ask the vet to see what they say and what they recommend).
Has anyone spayed their pig?
How did it go?
Anything I should get in preparation? Other than critical care formula?
At what age should I consider spaying her?
The vets will be phoning me with more info later.
I did ask if she had any experience with neutering piggies and she said she's done a lot of castrations and spays so is very confident with it.
(I also asked about galastop for potential pregnancy termination but she said while some use it it's not licensed for that and it's known to cause complications and isn't entirely effective. I know some of you said not to bother but I thought I'd ask the vet to see what they say and what they recommend).
Has anyone spayed their pig?
How did it go?
Anything I should get in preparation? Other than critical care formula?
At what age should I consider spaying her?
The vets will be phoning me with more info later.
Spaying is a major operation. Neutering a boar is much less so. Most often people don’t choose to spay unless there is a medical need to. I personally would choose neutering over spaying (unless a medical necessity for a spay presents itself) any day. I’m not sure of the percentages of risk for sows getting reproductive issues.
I know in rabbits its an 80% cancer risk. i keep rabbits which must be spayed at six months of age (i have two young does who will be spayed within the next month or so) as if I don’t, it’s almost certain they’d have cancer within two years (rabbit lifespan 8-12 years) as the cancer rate is so incredibly high and it is the most nerve wracking thing to have to do.
with that said, it’s slightly less nerve wracking to do it on a young, healthy animal than surgery on a poorly animal.
There are two guides below
Neutered / De-sexed Boars And Neutering Operations: Myths, Facts and Post-op Care
Tips For Post-operative Care
good luck for whatever you decide to do
I know in rabbits its an 80% cancer risk. i keep rabbits which must be spayed at six months of age (i have two young does who will be spayed within the next month or so) as if I don’t, it’s almost certain they’d have cancer within two years (rabbit lifespan 8-12 years) as the cancer rate is so incredibly high and it is the most nerve wracking thing to have to do.
with that said, it’s slightly less nerve wracking to do it on a young, healthy animal than surgery on a poorly animal.
There are two guides below
Neutered / De-sexed Boars And Neutering Operations: Myths, Facts and Post-op Care
Tips For Post-operative Care
good luck for whatever you decide to do
Hi!
I've had 5 sows of mine spayed in the last 7 years; all aged between 3-5 years. Each has made a good recovery, even the three emergency spays. The other two were precautionary spays for hard cysts with a higher likelihood of turning cancerous in old age.
But I have also had two baby boars neutered as soon as they were old enough for the snip, again without issues.
The majority of cysts, especially in old age, are non-hormonal fluid filled ones which become a major headache only if they grow so large that they impact on other organs; they can if necessary be drained if a sow is considered too old/frail for a GA. Most cysts actually go unnoticed because they never cause any symptoms or problems.
The decision is yours. The main point is that your vet has to feel confident with whatever operation and have positive experience. A spay is less practised in the UK as it is usually a rather more expensive operation. It is also a more major operation than a castration.
Here is our neutering ops guide: Neutering operations: Considerations, post-op care and a successful recovery example
Here are our post-op care tips. By the very nature of the topic, they concentrate more on what you can and should do if there is trouble; it is not a reflection of how the majority of operations go. Tips For Post-operative Care
Siikibam
Forum Donator 2022/23
I would wait until you’re sure sow lady isn’t pregnant. If she is and ends up having a boar, then you can keep him with dad. If she had two boars, you’d be better off deciding which two work beat together.
As for the termination medicine, I really wouldn’t. Even if she is, that was not a mistake made on your part. But rather where they came from.
As for the termination medicine, I really wouldn’t. Even if she is, that was not a mistake made on your part. But rather where they came from.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Yes that's the plan anyway. I'm just getting quotes and making sure I've got the right vet in advance
Well I didn't see any harm in asking and the vet echoed what you and others have said regarding termination medicine. Just wanted to make sure I explore every option thoroughly
I understand that it isn't my found but still somehow feel responsible? Which sounds strange I know.
I am sure that you will to the best for your piggies and find the right right solution. It would helps us, though, if you please could keep your questions to one thread so we have got the background together on which you are aksing them. That is more important that you may think.
None of us - since we are all doing this in our free time - can be around all the time and read everything, so it helps us if we can refresh our memory on what has been said before. it keep confusion and repetetition down for you and allows us to refer back and support you best in your individual situation with all your personal concerns.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Ah ok, that's fair enough. Is anyone able to merge this thread with my 'Oreo and Chunk' thread?
Sorry about this, it hadn't crossed my mind.
Thank you!
You can always tag somebody into your thread if you have a special question by typing @ immediately followed by the username. Click on the name when it pops up. This will create an alert when you post the thread.
PS: You are not expected to know the ins and outs or be aware that we function a bit differently to social media. However, we have found over time that the way we are doing things works best for this forum and allows us to give ongoing personalised support for however long it is needed until an issue is completely sorted, which is not something that social media can really do where it is all about starting a new post for everything.
Because these support threads can run over the course of weeks or even months, it is helpful for us to be able to refresh the memory and to keep all information together. We jump between quite a number of different threads every single day, never mind over the course of a week. Believe me when after a decade and literally thousands of different piggies passing through here it gets a bit tricky to remember everything over any length of time... But it is important for you when we can answer your questions with your own motivation and situation in mind. Quite often things are a lot more complex and there is not just one simple answer; it is often a weighing up of pros and cons as well as practicalities.
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I’ve had 2 sows spayed, one as an emergency.
Both came through well and recovered quickly.
Neutering a boar is less major surgery though.
Whatever you decide will be what you think is right for your situation.
Both came through well and recovered quickly.
Neutering a boar is less major surgery though.
Whatever you decide will be what you think is right for your situation.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
I know. I actually asked the vet has she ever neutered boars and the cost, she said she'd do it but suggested that I got the sow spayed instead as there's many health benefits to spaying. I'm not sure on statistics regarding pyo, tumors and cancer in pigs so it's something that I'm going to need to read up on. If the stats are quite high, like most sows will suffer with those problems then it's obviously a no brainer. I've got a fair bit of research first though
Siikibam
Forum Donator 2022/23
It’s not strange to feel responsible even though it wasn’t your doing. But be proud of the fact you found out and did the right thing under the circumstances, difficult as it may have been on them.
They’ll do just fine with you. Keep enjoying them and cross that bridge if/when you come to it
They’ll do just fine with you. Keep enjoying them and cross that bridge if/when you come to it
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
They're already doing a lot better believe it or not. They're also coming out of their shells more. Had a nice cuddle with chunk yesterday. He lay down in the towel and relaxed...then he peed on me, not sure if that means anything (so relaxed, fear or just needed a wee). I've started scatter feeding now and they've taken to it quite well.It’s not strange to feel responsible even though it wasn’t your doing. But be proud of the fact you found out and did the right thing under the circumstances, difficult as it may have been on them.
They’ll do just fine with you. Keep enjoying them and cross that bridge if/when you come to it
Siikibam
Forum Donator 2022/23
Peeing on you can be taken any way, and depends on the circumstances. I once took the boys into my daughters reception class for ‘show and tell’. They peed all over my leg...I still had to pick the children up
I think it may have been partly nervousness. Other times they’ve been relaxed on me and peed. They feel free enough to let it go 
Most sows have ovarian cysts but they are by no means the most common source of death.
Out of 70 piggies, around 60 are sows I have lost so far one sow in a spaying op (10 years ago an emergency op by an old-fashioned vet who didn't account for there being a second large cyst, so the GA was strong and she never woke up again), one to a burst cyst that hadn't been judged to be a major problem by
Feel happy if a piggy wees at you that is not totally out of their comfort zone (like on the examination table at the vet's) or when you hold them on your arm while there.
You have been christened! Piggies only do it when they are very relaxed or if they can really no longer hold it in and you haven't reacted to their individual warning signs like wiggling, pulling or tweaking clothes (or occasionally body parts of yours) etc.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
@Wiebke ok that's interesting. Do is pyometra common in sows? Is uterine cancer common in pigs like it is in rabbits?
I know it's one of those things that there's always a possibility, but statistically speaking.
Chunk didn't wiggle, nibble or anything. Literally lay down and got comfy so sounds like a good thing.
I know it's one of those things that there's always a possibility, but statistically speaking.
Chunk didn't wiggle, nibble or anything. Literally lay down and got comfy so sounds like a good thing.
Hi!
No, pyometra is pretty rare in well kept sows; it is most common in badly kept breeder sows.
I have only ever had one borderline case where the womb went wrong and that needed an emergency spay for that reason. The womb was grossly enlarged and fluid filled; it also had a potentially cancerous lump in there but she some nasty looking cysts, so good that I decided to go for a spay. But Cariad was from a backyard breeder background so there was likely a genetic disposition. We see perhaps one or two cases in a year - and that with over a thousand health and illness enquiries every year. That should give you a rough idea.
Unlike rabbits, uterine cancer in guinea pigs is RARE. We don't see any more than the odd case similar to pyometra or even less often.
Other than rabbits there is there is not the overwhelming life-prolonging need for de-sexing either gender for health or social reasons in guinea pigs, which is why it is not routinely done.
So far, the operation fatality risk has about held the balance against the advantages with a spaying op. The tide is gradually turning but we still see forum members' sows dying in the wake of a spay (about a couple this year) - at a higher rate of fatalities than in neutered boars these days because it is becoming more common, so there is more experience around. But it still all depends very much on the skill and experience of the vet you are chosing.
In the USA and Canada, there seems to be a bit more of a drive for spaying at the moment and there are several rescues that do spay their sows. There hasn't been a UK rescue with mandatory spaying and neutering policy since the start of 2014 in the UK.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
Ah ok. I'll probably just get Chunk the snip then as it's less invasive. I know that I need to wait 6 weeks until I can bring them back together. Quick question though, do I still go about bonding them as if they've never met before in a neutral environment or can I lift the divider and clean out the whole cage and watch them for a bit to see how it goes. They're still interacting quite a bit through the bars and pop Corning and wheeking. Just curious. I'm leaning more towards treating them as if they've never met before. But looking for advice
Spaying does have the advantage that you do not have to worry about potential cyst problems in older sows. But there is not the cancer risk there is in rabbits.
You always have to introduce or re-introduce guinea pigs on neutral ground in order to avoid any hostile reactions that come with invading another's piggy's territory - which can easily become a bonding killer.
Re-bonding is usually a bit quicker because the piggies can rush through some chapters of the instinctive bonding manual when it comes to the fine print but the process is still the same; and if one of them has decided that they have been happier on their own or is no longer willing to submit, you have had it. It should never be taken for granted.
Here is our bonding guide: Bonding and Interaction: Illustrated social behaviours and bonding dynamics
PS: There is one factor in the discussion re. spay vs. neutering that we haven't touched upon, and that is the time factor.
Neutering comes with a 6 weeks post-op wait until a boar is 100% safe to go with a sow because you have to wait until any semen in the tubes (which are left in when the testicles are being removed) has died off. My Tegan, the little baby in my avatar, is proof that this can still happen after more than 5 weeks post-neutering op. She was the surprise legacy of a supposedly safe boar (not one of my mine). Just to say...
With a spayed sow you can basically bond as soon as she has recovered from her op and the wound has fully knitted after 2 weeks in a perfect recovery. Spaying does have the advantage that you do not have to worry about any cyst or womb trouble in older age. It is the most common operation I have to have done, about on a par with lump removals when one of them is going wrong.
Neutering comes with a 6 weeks post-op wait until a boar is 100% safe to go with a sow because you have to wait until any semen in the tubes (which are left in when the testicles are being removed) has died off. My Tegan, the little baby in my avatar, is proof that this can still happen after more than 5 weeks post-neutering op. She was the surprise legacy of a supposedly safe boar (not one of my mine). Just to say...
With a spayed sow you can basically bond as soon as she has recovered from her op and the wound has fully knitted after 2 weeks in a perfect recovery. Spaying does have the advantage that you do not have to worry about any cyst or womb trouble in older age. It is the most common operation I have to have done, about on a par with lump removals when one of them is going wrong.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
@Wiebke I've got another problem.
(I started a shed post yesterday before you said about keeping everything in one thread)
I still live at home and my mum appears to be allergic to either the pigs or hay. So bad that it's affecting her breathing. They're going to have to go outside.
We have a 6x4 shed. I need a hutch. As they're not neutered yet I'm going to have to have either a split hutch or 2 seperate hutches. How will they socialise if I have to put them in different hutches?
(I started a shed post yesterday before you said about keeping everything in one thread)
I still live at home and my mum appears to be allergic to either the pigs or hay. So bad that it's affecting her breathing. They're going to have to go outside.
We have a 6x4 shed. I need a hutch. As they're not neutered yet I'm going to have to have either a split hutch or 2 seperate hutches. How will they socialise if I have to put them in different hutches?
I am very sorry that your mother has such a bad reaction. I am on year round anti-histamines myself as I get hay fever from grass pollen and hives from the urine particles in the piggies' coats. Thankfully things been stable for coming up to two decades now.
Could you create a roaming area on the shed floor that they can each access from their hutch with a grid divider so they can interact there through the divider?
You may have to re-think your arrangements anyway in case there are babies, so I would go for a temporary solutions that leaves as many options open as possible. If you end with a boar pair, you want a separate hutch and no direct contact/sight contact with sows.
Engel
Adult Guinea Pig
@Wiebke thats really tough going. Most people would have given up.
That'll be difficult. There needs to be room for an electric mower (small Flymo type) although I'm sure a strong hutch will be able to hold the weight of it if I put it on the roof?
as well as hay storage and substrate. But that is light and can be stacked.
the shed has no windows so I need to make a second door to go on the inside which is meshed to keep the dogs out yet allows air and light in for part of the day at least.
in the new year I will be getting them there own shed but money is tight at the moment with Xmas. I'm aiming to get one with an opening window and hopefully a stable type door.
would it be possible to get a 5ft double hutch and take a section away on the bottom so a pig can come down the ramp (they both use ramps) and socialise through the mesh? This does mean the pig on the bottom floor will have slightly less room but would that work?
If it does work, I'm thinking Oreo will be on the bottom so I don't have to worry about any babies with the ramp. Once we know what's going on regarding babies/neutering I can then re arrange things as they'll hopefully have a new shed to themselves then
That'll be difficult. There needs to be room for an electric mower (small Flymo type) although I'm sure a strong hutch will be able to hold the weight of it if I put it on the roof?
as well as hay storage and substrate. But that is light and can be stacked.
the shed has no windows so I need to make a second door to go on the inside which is meshed to keep the dogs out yet allows air and light in for part of the day at least.
in the new year I will be getting them there own shed but money is tight at the moment with Xmas. I'm aiming to get one with an opening window and hopefully a stable type door.
would it be possible to get a 5ft double hutch and take a section away on the bottom so a pig can come down the ramp (they both use ramps) and socialise through the mesh? This does mean the pig on the bottom floor will have slightly less room but would that work?
If it does work, I'm thinking Oreo will be on the bottom so I don't have to worry about any babies with the ramp. Once we know what's going on regarding babies/neutering I can then re arrange things as they'll hopefully have a new shed to themselves then