Gut stasis - stress? Help!

[JenniC1234]

Hello! Some of you may remember my posts about little Omar, who sadly died due to heart failure last week.

His cage mate, Dennis, has had a time of it: he was only with Omar for a couple of weeks before Omar died, so we found him a new compatible friend asap (luckily, a neighbour had a solo boar of the same age looking for a home). Sadly, after just a day together, it became clear that that boar actually had an awful UTI (and was urinating blood, before refusing to urinate at all), so his previous owner took him back last night so she could care for him in familiar surroundings.

I've been conscious that this is a huge stress for Dennis, so I've been extra-attentive to him last night and today - and I noticed that he hadn't poo'd since mid-morning. Better safe than sorry, I took him for an emergency vet appointment, where they diagnosed gut stasis. They've given injectable emeprid, injectable metacam and another gut-mobility drug orally (they didn't have it in stock in injectable form), with oral medications to follow-up.

Oddly, his weight is exactly the same as normal, and he hasn't stopped eating - in fact, even on the way back from the vet, he was eating hay. That said, I'll obviously get going with critical care etc.

The vet couldn't find any physiological reason for the gut stasis, so I can only presume it's the stress of losing so many companions in such a short space of time. I don't know what to do for the best: should I try and see if his (UTI-infected) previous companion could return? Would that cause happiness or further stress? Is there anything else that could help? Any guidance would be greatly appreciated

 

[JenniC1234]

I've now spoken to the (former/current?) owner of his companion, who's apparently making an unexpectedly good recovery from his UTI - but she's not happy for them to go back together for another week or so in case it stresses her boy out (so Dennis definitely won't have his (very new) friend back for another week or so). I don't know what to do for the best!

 

[Wiebke]

I've now spoken to the (former/current?) owner of his companion, who's apparently making an unexpectedly good recovery from his UTI - but she's not happy for them to go back together for another week or so in case it stresses her boy out (so Dennis definitely won't have his (very new) friend back for another week or so). I don't know what to do for the best!

Hi

Hang on in there. Concentrate on Dennis and his at the most partial GI stasis ('stasis' means that the gut has stopped working in parts but these days is used as as a term to describe any form of bloating from the mild (what Dennis seems to have) to the severe.

Please be aware that the bloating could be secondary, caused by a problem outside the gut through pressure on the gut or pain radiating into it.

Health issues in especially older piggies or those with underlying problems are not uncommon since the stress of losing a mate lowers the immune system temporarily.

Fingers firmly crossed for both boys!

 

[JenniC1234]

Hi

Hang on in there. Concentrate on Dennis and his at the most partial GI stasis ('stasis' means that the gut has stopped working in parts but these days is used as as a term to describe any form of bloating from the mild (what Dennis seems to have) to the severe.

Please be aware that the bloating could be secondary, caused by a problem outside the gut through pressure on the gut or pain radiating into it.

Health issues in especially older piggies or those with underlying problems are not uncommon since the stress of losing a mate lowers the immune system temporarily.

Fingers firmly crossed for both boys!

Thank you so much, Wiebke, for your help and insight - it's hugely valuable, especially when there isn't a piggy-savvy vet within easy reach! I only knew to ask for the injectable medications after reading posts on this forum, which I have no doubt will help.

A further question, if I may: Dennis seems active and is independently eating good quantities of hay. He's also drinking from his bottle and helping himself to critical care from a saucer I've put in the cage. I'll check his weight on the scale tomorrow morning, of course, but I'm guessing that if he's independently eating and drinking enough to stabilise his weight (which I'll only know for certain tomorrow am!), I don't need to syringe-feed critical care in addition?

I'm also guessing that, going by the forum guides, I should treat this as mild bloat (the vet said it wasn't bloat, but I suspect it is a mild case) and stay away from any fresh veggies (just giving hay + pellets [he's on the science selective grain free]) for a few days?

 

[Wiebke]

Thank you so much, Wiebke, for your help and insight - it's hugely valuable, especially when there isn't a piggy-savvy vet within easy reach! I only knew to ask for the injectable medications after reading posts on this forum, which I have no doubt will help.

A further question, if I may: Dennis seems active and is independently eating good quantities of hay. He's also drinking from his bottle and helping himself to critical care from a saucer I've put in the cage. I'll check his weight on the scale tomorrow morning, of course, but I'm guessing that if he's independently eating and drinking enough to stabilise his weight (which I'll only know for certain tomorrow am!), I don't need to syringe-feed critical care in addition?

I'm also guessing that, going by the forum guides, I should treat this as mild bloat (the vet said it wasn't bloat, but I suspect it is a mild case) and stay away from any fresh veggies (just giving hay + pellets [he's on the science selective grain free]) for a few days?

If he is eating and stable (please weigh first thing every morning for day to day comparison) then, let him be. To be honest, it doesn't sound like full-on bloating to me, either - they are painful and come with loss appetite. Personally, I think the real cause may lie elsewhere outside the gut so you do not need to change the diet and upset the apple cart further unnecessarily.

Please accept that I can only comment based on your own perception and interpretation of the situation but I am neither qualified nor do I have direct access to your piggy.

Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support Levels

 

[JenniC1234]

Just an update for anyone who stumbles across this (I always try to update my threads, because I always find it helpful when other posters do!): Dennis has made it through the night with a prodigious number of poos (we're at 35 since 6am). I've given him his next doses of Cisapride and Emeprid, he's eaten 30ml of crit care (and plenty of hay, by the looks) independently overnight and his weight is a mere 2g less than it was yesterday morning. It seems like the small pocket of gas is moving downwards, so I'm continuing with massage & electric toothbrush every few hours to help ease it out. I think we're not out of the woods yet, but there are some positive indications! (I lost my very first piggy to severe, acute bloat that came out of nowhere, so I'm extra-cautious now!)

 

[JenniC1234]

(of course - none of this answers why this is happening in the first place! Dennis is a bit of a "black box": I've only had him a couple of weeks, and he came from a miserably neglected home [his nails were so long they were curled up on top of his feet, he'd apparently been subsisting on what looked like chinchilla food, etc.], so who knows what health issues are lurking under the surface there! My philosophy is that, if I can offer him a safe, happy home for even a few weeks, it's an improvement on his previous situation, poor love)

 

[Truffolo]

Perhaps it has been the transition from chinchilla food to proper food that has temporarily thrown his digestion. Of course, hay is what he needs to eat. It is very interesting following lovely Dennis's treatment. He is lucky you took him in. Great to hear that things are moving along Wishing Dennis a quick recovery

 

[LucyP]

35 poos in a couple of hours sounds positive! He’s really landed on his paws with you- here’s to happy days ahead for him in a loving home.

 

[weepweeps]

Good luck Dennis. Keep munching.

 

[Wiebke]

(of course - none of this answers why this is happening in the first place! Dennis is a bit of a "black box": I've only had him a couple of weeks, and he came from a miserably neglected home [his nails were so long they were curled up on top of his feet, he'd apparently been subsisting on what looked like chinchilla food, etc.], so who knows what health issues are lurking under the surface there! My philosophy is that, if I can offer him a safe, happy home for even a few weeks, it's an improvement on his previous situation, poor love)

View attachment 287626

I agree that it is likely the feed change that is at the bottom of digestive issues because the gut needs time to grow the digestive specialists up to sufficient numbers.

That is why we have all these warnings about introducing any new foods gradually in increasing quantity as part of a mix over the course of 3-4 days.

The good news of this is that his current problems are temporary and unlikely to repeat.

Just give him a little more time and he will come right over the coming weeks and months on a correct diet and in your good care.

He is such a striking cutie with his Zorro mask!

 

[JenniC1234]

Don't worry - I did change over the food gradually, mixing (my) grain-free pellets with his previous food in ever-increasing proportions over about 10 days (he also came to me with hay mites, poor thing, so it was easy to tweak his food mix separately from my other pig while he was in quarantine). Honestly, I've been so incredibly careful with him! I can hear his gut gurgling when I give him a vibraty massage, and he's still eating hay & cc in great quantities, so fingers crossed!

 

[JenniC1234]

Well, we're neither better nor worse with poor Dennis - after his mammoth poo session this morning, his output has slowed to two poos since lunchtime. He's still eating and drinking, though. I noticed he did seem more swollen, but the next dose of emeprid and cisapride seem to have taken it down somewhat. There's definitely gas on one side of his stomach (sounds hollow when tapped), but I'm not really sure what else can be done other than to watch and wait. I've even given him a small amount of gripe water (Woodwards, the vet said it was ok) to really throw the kitchen sink at it

 

[Truffolo]

Poor fellow, he seems to be responding to the medications but then going backwards a bit in between them. I wonder if your vet would have a way of bridging the medication gap. It's great that the massage is helping. Hopefully he will establish a routine and his digestion will regulate itself. I hope Dennis gets better soon

 

[JenniC1234]

Well, we're neither better nor worse with poor Dennis - after his mammoth poo session this morning, his output has slowed to two poos since lunchtime. He's still eating and drinking, though. I noticed he did seem more swollen, but the next dose of emeprid and cisapride seem to have taken it down somewhat. There's definitely gas on one side of his stomach (sounds hollow when tapped), but I'm not really sure what else can be done other than to watch and wait. I've even given him a small amount of gripe water (Woodwards, the vet said it was ok) to really throw the kitchen sink at it

Actually, I've not given the gripe water - I'm wary of the sodium bicarb in it doing more harm than good! Poor Dennis is having a snooze in a corner now, having done a handful of tiny poos. Fingers crossed - but I think it's back to the vets tomorrow am at latest

 

[LucyP]

You’re doing a great job.

Re the points above, if you do discuss the frequency of meds with them, our pig has been on liquid ranitadine 3 times a day when their bloat was a bit worse. Emprid was given twice a day. We then reduced as things got better. I’m not saying that’s needed here, as every case is different I know, but it might be worth asking.

 

[CTWC]

Hope all goes well today

 

[JenniC1234]

Thanks, LucyP + CTWC! Just back from the vets now: sadly not an overly piggy-savvy vet, who seemed to think that just Metacam would solve the issue. After quite some debate, I've left with some fresh supplies of cisapride + emeprid, but he wasn't necessarily thrilled to prescibe them! I do think Dennis is doing slightly better today (we're 8 hours since his last dose of meds and he's nowhere near as puffed up as he was yesterday), so we might be heading in the right direction (although I daren't tempt fate!) Thanks all for the support x

 

[Truffolo]

Thanks, LucyP + CTWC! Just back from the vets now: sadly not an overly piggy-savvy vet, who seemed to think that just Metacam would solve the issue. After quite some debate, I've left with some fresh supplies of cisapride + emeprid, but he wasn't necessarily thrilled to prescibe them! I do think Dennis is doing slightly better today (we're 8 hours since his last dose of meds and he's nowhere near as puffed up as he was yesterday), so we might be heading in the right direction (although I daren't tempt fate!) Thanks all for the support x

Sorry to hear that the vet wasn't guinea pig savvy. That does make things tricky. Well done for getting the gut stimulants again. Wishing Dennis a speedy recovery

 

[JenniC1234]

Continued good news with Dennis - we're now 8 hours since his last dose of emeprid + cis, and he doesn't *yet* seem to be bloating up again, and he's still pooping. This is the longest span so far, so if we can make it to his next scheduled dose just before midnight without a major drop off in poop production (or a major increase in bloatedness), I'll be happy. Although I'm wary of counting my chickens!

One critical care tip that I've not seen anywhere else, that has helped me: Dennis likes the taste, but is sometimes too lazy to go to the bowl I've made for him (and I want to avoid syringe-feeding unless necessary, as he hates it so much). What I've found works incredibly well is using a chunky stick of hay to scoop up a "blob" of critical care, that he then licks and nibbles off (then repeat). It seems a bit more "natural" to him than eating off a spoon, and has the benefit of getting some extra hay in him too!

A question to the more experienced members: the vet insisted that Dennis wasn't *bloated*, just suffering from *gas* and *digestive discomfort*. I'd been working on the basis that mild bloat *was* the same thing as gas? Or is it something different? Obviously, severe acute bloat is a different (or rather, worse) beast, as I know only too well from my late Bubbles (for him, sadly, the name was only too apt).

 

[JenniC1234]

Just a quick update if anyone stumbles on this thread in the future: Dennis has now been off the medication for 4 days with no symptoms (yay!). He's had an individual mint leaf with no ill effects, and today a small slice of celery, which caused him to puff up a bit, so I guess we've found a trigger food to avoid! I'm giving him a bit of fibreplex to cover all bases, but he's back to normal, to all intents and purposes.

Now to focus on his mental wellbeing: his original "replacement" friend seems to still be struggling with his UTI, so I'm throwing the kitchen sink at enrichment (hay in bags, hay in tubes, piles of hay, hidden pellets, etc.) until his friend is recovered and we can re-bond them. But so far, a happy ending for his physical health, at least!

 

[Truffolo]

Continued good news with Dennis - we're now 8 hours since his last dose of emeprid + cis, and he doesn't *yet* seem to be bloating up again, and he's still pooping. This is the longest span so far, so if we can make it to his next scheduled dose just before midnight without a major drop off in poop production (or a major increase in bloatedness), I'll be happy. Although I'm wary of counting my chickens!

One critical care tip that I've not seen anywhere else, that has helped me: Dennis likes the taste, but is sometimes too lazy to go to the bowl I've made for him (and I want to avoid syringe-feeding unless necessary, as he hates it so much). What I've found works incredibly well is using a chunky stick of hay to scoop up a "blob" of critical care, that he then licks and nibbles off (then repeat). It seems a bit more "natural" to him than eating off a spoon, and has the benefit of getting some extra hay in him too!

A question to the more experienced members: the vet insisted that Dennis wasn't *bloated*, just suffering from *gas* and *digestive discomfort*. I'd been working on the basis that mild bloat *was* the same thing as gas? Or is it something different? Obviously, severe acute bloat is a different (or rather, worse) beast, as I know only too well from my late Bubbles (for him, sadly, the name was only too apt).

It is rather worrying when faced with terminology in dealing with a condition as dangerous as bloat, especially when your piggy has had a tummy as hard as poor Dennis. Luckily you wisely did not drop your guard. You know about what bloat can do. It is a very unpredictable condition Your need is fantastic however and thanks to your fighting for him, Dennis is so much better and more comfortable

 

[Merab]

Glad Dennis is doing well.
Hope everything else starts to improve too and you can relax.
Look after yourself

 

[Truffolo]

It is rather worrying when faced with terminology in dealing with a condition as dangerous as bloat, especially when your piggy has had a tummy as hard as poor Dennis. Luckily you wisely did not drop your guard. You know about what bloat can do. It is a very unpredictable condition Your need is fantastic however and thanks to your fighting for him, Dennis is so much better and more comfortable

You must be very relieved and cautiously happy. I hope Dennis, and his new cage mate to be, will recover and be healthy piggies. Thank you for the tip about using hay to get a piggy to accept Critical Care

 

[Truffolo]

It is rather worrying when faced with terminology in dealing with a condition as dangerous as bloat, especially when your piggy has had a tummy as hard as poor Dennis. Luckily you wisely did not drop your guard. You know about what bloat can do. It is a very unpredictable condition Your need is fantastic however and thanks to your fighting for him, Dennis is so much better and more comfortable

That should be, your news (not need)

 

[Wiebke]

Thank you for your update. I hope that poor Dennis continues to recover.

 

[JenniC1234]

Well, I spoke too soon! I came downstairs yesterday (luckily, I was WFH) to find poor Dennis so bloated he could hardly move. A quick (panicked) dose of cisapride + emeprid took the gas down (and sparked 50! poops in 4 hours), but it's left me stumped as to what's going on.

My working hypothesis is that we've still got a way to go until his microbiome is back to full fitness, and still producing more gas than he can easily clear: it's interesting that this latest flare-up came about after I'd tried him on fresh food for the first time in a week (two days after the celery, a tiny piece of apple - sugary, I know, but one of the few foods I know for certain he ate in his previous home without issue).

I don't *think* it's an underlying pain issue: his weight is stable, he's eating plenty unaided and there are no differences in his behaviour (and weight) whether I give him metacam or not. His food intake only seems to drop off once he's very bloated - rather than the other way around.

If anyone has any suggestions of things to suggest to the vet that we can rule out, I'd be grateful: this is my 6th year of owning piggies, so I'm conscious (seemingly more so than my rather laid-back vet) of how quickly they can go downhill! Typically, I'm also going away in a month's time for a week or so, so I'm desperately keen to get this under control before then!

 

[Truffolo]

Hmm, it's a really tricky situation. I think you may have several months of this back and forth progress to go. More poop soup from a high performing colleague might help. It is really frightening how quickly it comes back. He might need to be off greens for a long time. I hope Dennis can throw this, he is a brave little fighter

 

[CTWC]

Oh no what an emotional rollercoaster

 

[Merab]

I wish I had an answer for you, but all can offer is support, hugs and prayers