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Neutering: just some angry rumbling

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BonBon2010 said:
My view is, who are we to mutilate an animal when we don't need to? I know your trying to keep it as natural as possible, but to remove a sensitive part of an animals anatomy when not necessary is wrong.. I have this same argument with horses.. the mare gets to keep her womb, whilst the stallion looses his jewels.. the mare is often worse for trouble making than the stallion.. it's nature and we twist it to suit us..
I will never put any of my guinea pigs through this, and will never put them in a position to ever need it.. they are perfectly happy in their little groups, and the females do not miss having a male around especially when they've never had one..
My youngster (pony) had a rig op (one ball had not descended and was stuck under his kidney) last year, and was really poorly for two weeks.. his back leg swelled up to more than twice it's size, he couldn't walk, I had to force him to, as it was supposed to help keep the swelling down and reduce the chance of blood clots.. he was that ill one night -if I'd been told how bad he was I'd have got the vet out, as a fellow livery sat with him but didn't tell me as a bit of tlc brought him back down to earth - he was soaked with sweat, trembling and breathing really heavy through the stress and pain he was going through.. that was a necessary pain though as it was had ended up cancerous if left up there, and I'd already given him 2 years to drop it..
That was a horse, now imagine how a guinea pig feels? Sorry but I have my view and I have viewed it.. Who are we to mess with nature?
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When a mare is in season, yes some can be a pain, but it's a huge op for a mare, horses take a lot longer to recover and a mare would need completely knocking out and if a horse doesn't get up within a certain amount of time she's at risk of dieing. However, a colt or stallion can be gelded standing up and is a very quick procedure. Keeping a colt entire to adulthood would mean he has to live alone, as he'd get every mare and filly pregnant, and would fight with other stallions. Even if you managed to turn a group of stallions out together over a large amount of land, the slightest whiff of a female and they're off. Have you ever tried to seperate 2 fighting stallions? I have, and had the broken collarbone and ribs to prove it. Unless bought up to respect people from a small foal, a stallion is very hard work, and you have to be very, very experienced to know how to handle a stallion. The behavioural traits too, and knowing how to deal with them. I had a rig come into the rescue, only a section A, 4 years old. Had all the stallion traits, would never have made a childs pony and was a pain in the arse. My 17.1hh ex racer gelding was a doddle compared to him. 11hh and he could drag me along, and I'm not small. So he had the surgery, took them forever to find a walnut sized testicle and then take the other off, and he turned into a different pony. Yes, we had the nipping that needed to be sorted, but now he's a childs second pony. Would never have been anything other than a glorified lawn mower if he'd not. He's now got a stimulating life.
I have had a hormonal mare, yes she was a right pain when she was in season, would be a pain to saddle, but for the rest of the time, and the season only lasts a few days she was a sweetheart.

Sorry, now back onto guinea pigs.
 
flintstones said:
What about if you had a dog or cat? Yes it is natural for animals to reproduce but the fact of the matter is there are thousands of animals in rehoming centres all around the world and there just aren't enough homes. Some of these animals are destroyed as the amount of unwanted animals is so high. Surely it's kinder to control the problem (ie neutering/spaying).

"last year 7,743 dogs in the Uk were destroyed in pounds."

source: http://www.dogsos.co.uk/#/death-row-dogs/4524189856
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My view is solely on small animals alone, I'm just stating the effect it had on my pony and comparing what the pain thresh hold is for a Cavy.. it's more with the guinea pig being such a small animal, more can go wrong and it's a lot harder to find a savvy vet where I live too.. it's not that long since a vet i used to go to described the Guinea pig as a 'disposable pet' when I took a female with bumble foot who was really poorly (she only just survived)..
The one I took Humbug to, had to look up in a book what was wrong with her and still mis-diagnosed her..
Everyone has a right to have their own views, i'm going off now, as I only wanted to state my feeling, if i've offended anyone, sorry
 
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I can't understand with all this high technology around these days, why on earth isn't it possible to chemically castrate animals these days so ops aren't needed?

Does anyone know?
 
Poppy'sMum said:
I can't understand with all this high technology around these days, why on earth isn't it possible to chemically castrate animals these days so ops aren't needed?

Does anyone know?
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Apparently it can be done. Don't know why it isn't done routinely though.
 
It's all down to the Owner's but I do have two spayed females and a neutered boars. I adopted these animals simply because they where done.

Milo only last month had blood took from his Vena Cava well under GA, that to me is more dangerous than neutering if done incorrectly it can be fatal. With anything there is a risk it is important to weigh up the pro's and con's and make an informed decision.

I doubt anyone on this forum wouldn't do there research and although many don't agree I know I have 3 very happy mixed sex pigs.
 
Tracy at Rabbit and Guinea Pig Welfare in Rugby neuters all the animals before rehoming, and that includes spaying sows. The vet she uses is fantastic and very experienced and knowledgeable. She can then be 100% sure that any animal she rehomes will never be used for breeding. It's all very well to say that they can be paired with a same sex friend before rehoming, but there are no guarantees what will happen in the future, for example, when one of the pairing dies or if they fall out. I can fully understand why most rescues wouldn't spay sows as so few vets are experienced in this operation, but it is also up to anyone thinking of setting up a rescue to find a really good vet before embarking on this. Tracy doesn't go to her local vet, she travels a 50 plus mile round trip to go to a vet she can trust. I've seen sows just the day after their op dashing around looking pretty much back to normal, just as the boars do, when the op is performed by a knowledgeable vet. I know all surgery carries a risk but that risk is very slight when using the right veterinary surgeon.
 
Poppy'sMum said:
I can't understand with all this high technology around these days, why on earth isn't it possible to chemically castrate animals these days so ops aren't needed?

Does anyone know?
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There is an implant for male dogs now, a bit like a microchip popped under the skin. I'm not sure on the horse front. But as of yet nothing i know of for cats or the small furries. Unfortunatly hormones and reproduction isnt that simple as chemically stopping it.

http://www.peptech.com/HTML/Animal_Health/Superlorin_general.html (used to suppress testosterone, not an effected for of contraception for dogs)

Sorry about your problems BonBon, you obviously had a bad time with the vets which has made you feel very very strongly about this. Dont be sorry, its good to hear everyones views about the subject.

x.
 
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I have 8 sows - none are neutered. I have 2 dogs - both are neutered (one male one female). I dont regret getting my dogs neutered and dont have any reason to ever neuter my female pigs.

I think its important to weigh up all the issues, whatever the gender and whatever the species before deciding to neuter, just like its important to think before getting any animal. I think the decision depends on the circumstances and I am sure forum members on here do research things like this beforehand.

x
 
BonBon2010 said:
My view is solely on small animals alone, I'm just stating the effect it had on my pony and comparing what the pain thresh hold is for a Cavy.. it's more with the guinea pig being such a small animal, more can go wrong and it's a lot harder to find a savvy vet where I live too.. it's not that long since a vet i used to go to described the Guinea pig as a 'disposable pet' when I took a female with bumble foot who was really poorly (she only just survived)..
The one I took Humbug to, had to look up in a book what was wrong with her and still mis-diagnosed her..
Everyone has a right to have their own views, i'm going off now, as I only wanted to state my feeling, if i've offended anyone, sorry
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Bon Bon - get a new vet!
 
BonBon2010 said:
My view is solely on small animals alone, I'm just stating the effect it had on my pony and comparing what the pain thresh hold is for a Cavy.. it's more with the guinea pig being such a small animal, more can go wrong and it's a lot harder to find a savvy vet where I live too.. it's not that long since a vet i used to go to described the Guinea pig as a 'disposable pet' when I took a female with bumble foot who was really poorly (she only just survived)..
The one I took Humbug to, had to look up in a book what was wrong with her and still mis-diagnosed her..
Everyone has a right to have their own views, i'm going off now, as I only wanted to state my feeling, if i've offended anyone, sorry
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My old vet's reason for not being very guinea pig savvy was that most people regarded them as throw-away pets so therefore he didn't see many. Well he saw even less after that comment as I didn't go back.
 
Katie Krafter said:
Bon Bon - get a new vet!
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I live up in the sticks, can't seem to find ANY savvy vets in Derbyshire/Cheshire, I have asked a few times before here, and got no answers:( So I guess I just have to keep looking..
Thanks Abi-nurse, strangely the vet who said about piggies being disposable pets was the only one who even tried to help, and I never lost a pig (unless of course they were already too far gone, piggies are good at hiding symptoms until too late).. They're out of my area now..
 
BonBon2010 said:
I live up in the sticks, can't seem to find ANY savvy vets in Derbyshire/Cheshire, I have asked a few times before here, and got no answers:( So I guess I just have to keep looking..
Thanks Abi-nurse, strangely the vet who said about piggies being disposable pets was the only one who even tried to help, and I never lost a pig (unless of course they were already too far gone, piggies are good at hiding symptoms until too late).. They're out of my area now..
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Cavy Savy vets aren't always on your doorstep. Mine is over an hour away but it's worth it to get them the best possible vet care! xx
 
I will never put any of my guinea pigs through this, and will never put them in a position to ever need it
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Would you put them through it if it was medically necessary, though? Like the sow I had with a uterine tumour? I don't know any case where an animal has been neutered "just because" and a lot of owners, myself included, wish that they'd never HAD to be in a position to neuter out of medical necessity. Sadly, when it's the difference between life or death then there's little choice.

I'd also like to know how you'd prevent over and in breeding without neutering. With many animals a neuter is the difference between living a life with an opposite sex companion or a life of solitude.
 
flintstones said:
Cavy Savy vets aren't always on your doorstep. Mine is over an hour away but it's worth it to get them the best possible vet care! xx
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I second that :)) We have a vet on our doorstep but not happy with them, our regular vet is an hours drive away (depending on traffic) but worth the journey.
Another very good practise which has the out of hours service is a ten minute drive so we feel comfortable with our choice.
 
Same here, there is a perfectly useless vets within walking distance of my house, but I choose to use a decent one and so I travel.
 
daftscotslass said:
Would you put them through it if it was medically necessary, though? Like the sow I had with a uterine tumour? I don't know any case where an animal has been neutered "just because" and a lot of owners, myself included, wish that they'd never HAD to be in a position to neuter out of medical necessity. Sadly, when it's the difference between life or death then there's little choice.

I'd also like to know how you'd prevent over and in breeding without neutering. With many animals a neuter is the difference between living a life with an opposite sex companion or a life of solitude.
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I wouldn't breed from my sows, so don't have to worry about in breeding or over breeding, they are purely family members, and like I've already said I'd only put my piggies through the op only if absolutely necessary, and thats if..
 
BonBon2010 said:
I wouldn't breed from my sows, so don't have to worry about in breeding or over breeding, they are purely family members, and like I've already said I'd only put my piggies through the op only if absolutely necessary, and thats if..
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You missed my point. Essentially what you're saying is that it's fine if animals breed willy-nilly, as long as your animals aren't involved?
 
I dont see how it can be butchering one animal but fine to do to another, either we have no right to mess with nature regardless of the species or its ok to do imo. I do not have any neutured piggies, I probably wont unless I was to ever adopt one in the future or it was medically needed, or circumstances changed, but I'm not against other people doing it to theirs.

I dont like putting any animal through unnecessary surgery, so much so I decided to get a female dog, I honestly believed there would be no need to have her spayed as she was with me all the time and our back garden was fully enclosed, nothing prepared me for a neighbours dog jumping the fence to get at her, unfortunatly I didnt realise until it was to late and they were locked, after her pups she was spayed and if I was to have another dog in the future he or she will be done too. I would take the same approach if ever one of my boars ended up on his own, if there was no way another boar could live with him then he would be neutured to allow him a wife (or 2/3/4 if space allowed)
 
I'm walking away from this one, too many wires getting crossed and I sure as 'ell want nothing more to do with this thread.. We can't save every piggie but we can only do our best, we're not Superman, and in a way I've helped a bit by stopping my four girls becoming a statistic, and my two boys also..
And I'll continue to make what's probably a insignificant impact by taking in unwanted piggies as and when I have the space again..
 
Why shouldn't people defend their point of view when terms like "butchering" and "mutilation" are thrown around? Nobody on this thread has put their animal through it just for a giggle. Lots of the people on here who've posted against neutering are not in a situation where they have had to neuter. I'd have been interested to see opinions change if their own situations changed.

In addition, if neutering isn't one of the best solutions for animal overpopulation in rescue then what is? Out of sight out of mind?
 
Neutering isnt the complete picture. People need to be educated, its humans that have overpopulated the rescues not the animals fault. Neutering helps, but it will never completely finish the issue, people will still have a litter - 'just because they are cute' without thinking of the consequences. I'm not coming back to this thread, people are getting too rude and angry. I hope its closed soon.

x.
 
I know I am new here and not nearly half as wise as any of the forum members on piggies BUT
I dont think its anyones right to question another persons motives on the care of their pet, when they are doing what they think is clearly in the best interest of the animal. There are so many pet owners out there that simply dont care enough to even meet their animals basic needs...
And I know this isnt the same as neutering but I had my husband de-seeded lmao and he is fine :P
 
daftscotslass said:
You missed my point. Essentially what you're saying is that it's fine if animals breed willy-nilly, as long as your animals aren't involved?
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Guinea pigs are usually easy to keep separate and prevent breeding (unless you have a boar that doesn't like other boars or a sow that doesn't like other sows) so it's much different to with cats and dogs that might go wandering or escape and breed accidentally. Ok, I guess piggies could do that too, but less likely :))

So it's not as necessary.
 
daftscotslass said:
Why shouldn't people defend their point of view when terms like "butchering" and "mutilation" are thrown around? Nobody on this thread has put their animal through it just for a giggle. Lots of the people on here who've posted against neutering are not in a situation where they have had to neuter. I'd have been interested to see opinions change if their own situations changed.

In addition, if neutering isn't one of the best solutions for animal overpopulation in rescue then what is? Out of sight out of mind?
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I don't think people are saying that people do it just for a giggle (well I'm not anyway :)) but that some rescues do it as routine, when it is not necessary.

I don't think anyone has a problem with animals being neutered when they need to be.
 
Graceandowen said:
I know I am new here and not nearly half as wise as any of the forum members on piggies BUT
I dont think its anyones right to question another persons motives on the care of their pet, when they are doing what they think is clearly in the best interest of the animal. There are so many pet owners out there that simply dont care enough to even meet their animals basic needs...
And I know this isnt the same as neutering but I had my husband de-seeded lmao and he is fine :P
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This is so true :) A lot of people on forums can be really quick to judge other people, and say they are wrong. But it's not our place to say what is wrong or right, we can have our own opinions, but don't need to judge everyone who has different ones :) As long as everyone loves their animals and is taking good care of them, then we all want the same thing.
 
daftscotslass said:
Why shouldn't people defend their point of view when terms like "butchering" and "mutilation" are thrown around? Nobody on this thread has put their animal through it just for a giggle. Lots of the people on here who've posted against neutering are not in a situation where they have had to neuter. I'd have been interested to see opinions change if their own situations changed.

In addition, if neutering isn't one of the best solutions for animal overpopulation in rescue then what is? Out of sight out of mind?
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very true - well said. Butchering and mutilation are not the words i agree with being used as people love their pets and would not do that.
 
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CiaraPatricia said:
I don't think people are saying that people do it just for a giggle (well I'm not anyway :)) but that some rescues do it as routine, when it is not necessary.

I don't think anyone has a problem with animals being neutered when they need to be.
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Personally, if I was running a rescue I would feel it was the responsible thing to do, to get the animals neutered before rehoming. That way I could be sure that they would never be bred from, either deliberately or accidently.

With regard to my pets, I have had some boars castrated, but only if they haven't been able to bond with a same sex friend, or have fallen out with their cagemate. They have all recovered from the op immediately and have been back to normal straight away. I can't say any of them have looked as though they have been in any pain whatsoever.
 
furryfriends said:
Personally, if I was running a rescue I would feel it was the responsible thing to do, to get the animals neutered before rehoming. That way I could be sure that they would never be bred from, either deliberately or accidently.
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true
 
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