Desperate for help with 2 failed bondings

[Beans&Toast]

Unfortunately I've ended up with 2 single pigs separated after a failed bonding and I'm desperate to know if anyone thinks there is any hope at all to salvage this bonding.

I got Coconut, an 18 month sow, approx 6 months ago, for my 3 year old sow, Biscuit, who was left solo after her sister passed away.

Coconut was rescued from a terrible hoarding situation with little food and water and is understandably very scared and fear-aggressive.

First bonding session at home ended with Coconut lunging for Biscuit after rumbling at her and chasing for a few minutes, I had to throw a towel over them and separate. I let them live side by side and talk to each other through a divider. After a week Coconut seemed to calm down so I tried bonding again. Biscuit immediately tried to bond with Coconut, grooming herself infront of Coconut to show she's friendly, however Coconut was on edge the whole time, couldn't relax and seemed very scared. This resulted in her again lunging for Biscuit and I had to separate before Biscuit got attacked.

I had to put the divider back, and this time I had to cover it with a blanket so Coconut couldn't see Biscuit as this was causing her to get worked up and stressed.

They've now been separated by a covered divider for over a month and I'm worried about them both being lonely. I simply don't have the facilties or space to get them both a friend and have 4 pigs, so my only options are 1, keeping them both single which seems such a lonely life for them. 2, try again to bond them if anyone thinks it's at all possible, or 3, I'd have to find Coconot another home and try find a suitable friend for Biscuit.

Should I give Coconut another few months to calm down and feel more safe then try another bonding session? Or accept that I've tried twice and it didn't work out?


Any advice welcome!

 

[Wiebke]

Unfortunately I've ended up with 2 single pigs separated after a failed bonding and I'm desperate to know if anyone thinks there is any hope at all to salvage this bonding.

I got Coconut, an 18 month sow, approx 6 months ago, for my 3 year old sow, Biscuit, who was left solo after her sister passed away.

Coconut was rescued from a terrible hoarding situation with little food and water and is understandably very scared and fear-aggressive.

First bonding session at home ended with Coconut lunging for Biscuit after rumbling at her and chasing for a few minutes, I had to throw a towel over them and separate. I let them live side by side and talk to each other through a divider. After a week Coconut seemed to calm down so I tried bonding again. Biscuit immediately tried to bond with Coconut, grooming herself infront of Coconut to show she's friendly, however Coconut was on edge the whole time, couldn't relax and seemed very scared. This resulted in her again lunging for Biscuit and I had to separate before Biscuit got attacked.

I had to put the divider back, and this time I had to cover it with a blanket so Coconut couldn't see Biscuit as this was causing her to get worked up and stressed.

They've now been separated by a covered divider for over a month and I'm worried about them both being lonely. I simply don't have the facilties or space to get them both a friend and have 4 pigs, so my only options are 1, keeping them both single which seems such a lonely life for them. 2, try again to bond them if anyone thinks it's at all possible, or 3, I'd have to find Coconot another home and try find a suitable friend for Biscuit.

Should I give Coconut another few months to calm down and feel more safe then try another bonding session? Or accept that I've tried twice and it didn't work out?


Any advice welcome!

I would think that seeing the strong reaction that your girls have likely made up their mind by now.

Coconut will need an experienced home that can work on settling her down and bring her out. Whether she ever will accept a companion is not a given. It's not going to be a quick process. next door companionship during that time can help her to relax but it is of course not quite as fun for the neighbour.

What gender is your other pair?

 

[Beans&Toast]

I would think that seeing the strong reaction that your girls have likely made up their mind by now.

Coconut will need an experienced home that can work on settling her down and bring her out. Whether she ever will accept a companion is not a given. It's not going to be a quick process. next door companionship during that time can help her to relax but it is of course not quite as fun for the neighbour.

What gender is your other pair?

Thank you for your advice.

I have the space to keep Coconut and Biscuit each in their own large space, with a divider so they are not completely alone, however I think Biscuit is a bit lonely, I've successfully bonded her with 2 other pigs in the past (who have passed away now), so unfortunately it is Coconut presenting the challenge. I also don't want to deny Coconut the chance of finding a pig she does get on with, keeping a lone pig doesn't sit right with me.

Coconut and Biscuit are both female, and both neutered. I only have 2 pigs, I was considering getting another 2, to bond one with each pig, but I don't have the space for 4 pigs.

 

[Wiebke]

Thank you for your advice.

I have the space to keep Coconut and Biscuit each in their own large space, with a divider so they are not completely alone, however I think Biscuit is a bit lonely, I've successfully bonded her with 2 other pigs in the past (who have passed away now), so unfortunately it is Coconut presenting the challenge. I also don't want to deny Coconut the chance of finding a pig she does get on with, keeping a lone pig doesn't sit right with me.

Coconut and Biscuit are both female, and both neutered. I only have 2 pigs, I was considering getting another 2, to bond one with each pig, but I don't have the space for 4 pigs.

Would you have the space to keep Biscuit with a companion and Coconut as a nextdoor neighbour?

 

[Beans&Toast]

Would you have the space to keep Biscuit with a companion and Coconut as a nextdoor neighbour?

Yes I can do this. I'm just worried that Coconut would be alone all her life? I think she seems okay just now, she runs around and zoomies when new hay and food come, I just hate to think of her on her own and wondered if she would be better going to another home where should could be bonded with other pigs.

 

[dhill_cb7]

Was there any blood? Some bonds just aren’t meant to be.

My bonded duo of boars were from a rescue with below standard of living.

My boys fought when I first got them but there wasn’t any blood. They lunged at ech other and then I separated.

I trial separated them and the submissive boar was trying to get back with the dominant one.

Sorry to hear about your situation.

 

[Beans&Toast]

Was there any blood? Some bonds just aren’t meant to be.

My bonded duo of boars were from a rescue with below standard of living.

My boys fought when I first got them but there wasn’t any blood. They lunged at ech other and then I separated.

I trial separated them and the submissive boar was trying to get back with the dominant one.

Sorry to hear about your situation.

No blood, she didn't actually get to attack her because I through the towel over her when it seemed like she was going to.

Maybe because she's still very fearful and apprehensive that's why she's wanting to fight Biscuit.

Might give her a few more months of trying to to calm her so she could be introduced to Biscuit again, I desperately don't want to have to rehome her.

 

[Engel]

I'm sorry to hear things aren't working out. I adopted 2 baby boars a few months ago and they fought. I seperated them and when I put them back together they fought again. They're currently living side by side. While direct contact is preferred sometimes that just isn't possible.

How big are their cages? Could you find biscuit a friend through rescue dating? That way Biscuit can have direct companionship and Coconut can have her own space and interact with them through the bars.

If this isn't possible then keeping them side by side with the ability to interact through the bars is ok. I wouldn't attempt reintroducing them again, you'll just stress Coconut out and could end in disaster.

 

[Wiebke]

No blood, she didn't actually get to attack her because I through the towel over her when it seemed like she was going to.

Maybe because she's still very fearful and apprehensive that's why she's wanting to fight Biscuit.

Might give her a few more months of trying to to calm her so she could be introduced to Biscuit again, I desperately don't want to have to rehome her.

Lunging and flying tackles (which are the last resort) are always defensive, fear-based behaviours.

The best you can do, is to give your new girl time; and I am not talking about a few days more. The problem with piggies like her is that you can never predict how long she needs, whether she will ever come round and whether Biscuit has by now made up her mind that she doesn't want her.

She can live next to Biscuit and a new friend and could even at some point join them but it would be no tragedy if she never got to that point, having full interaction through the bars but her own little territory. Hence my last proposal.

Not having seen the bonding or knowing her background, I cannot assess the situation properly; but from my own fair number of fear-aggressive piggies, it is always very much a play as you go along and with regular reassessments and not having any preconceptions - you have to play them by ear. It can take weeks but it can also take months or it may never happen. My recommendations are to give you that space and freedom to fill both Biscuit's need for companionship in the shorter term but also Coconut's need for space and time to hopefully come round at one point.

Whenever you bring home a piggy of your choice, you always have to plan for the case that the bonding may not work out.

 

[Beans&Toast]

Lunging and flying tackles (which are the last resort) are always defensive, fear-based behaviours.

The best you can do, is to give your new girl time; and I am not talking about a few days more. The problem with piggies like her is that you can never predict how long she needs, whether she will ever come round and whether Biscuit has by now made up her mind that she doesn't want her.

She can live next to Biscuit and a new friend and could even at some point join them but it would be no tragedy if she never got to that point, having full interaction through the bars but her own little territory. Hence my last proposal.

Not having seen the bonding or knowing her background, I cannot assess the situation properly; but from my own fair number of fear-aggressive piggies, it is always very much a play as you go along and with regular reassessments and not having any preconceptions - you have to play them by ear. It can take weeks but it can also take months or it may never happen. My recommendations are to give you that space and freedom to fill both Biscuit's need for companionship in the shorter term but also Coconut's need for space and time to hopefully come round at one point.

Whenever you bring home a piggy of your choice, you always have to plan for the case that the bonding may not work out.

Thank you.

I absolutely have the space to keep her and do not want to rehome her at all.

My back up plan for if I didn't get on was to have them mingle through the divider, but I've had to cover the divider due to coconut getting stressed trying to get to Biscuit.

I was just starting to panic and worry that she would be on her own forever and I wasn't able to provide the best life for her. However like you say due to her background coming from a terrible hoarding situation being fear aggressive, she may never come round.

I can make space to give Biscuit a friend and still have a spacious area for Coconut on her own. And, in time if she's accepting, they could interact through the bars again with potential to join at some point if she's able to. She seems happy enough zooming around on her own for now. I'll keep trying with her.

 

[Beans&Toast]

I'm sorry to hear things aren't working out. I adopted 2 baby boars a few months ago and they fought. I seperated them and when I put them back together they fought again. They're currently living side by side. While direct contact is preferred sometimes that just isn't possible.

How big are their cages? Could you find biscuit a friend through rescue dating? That way Biscuit can have direct companionship and Coconut can have her own space and interact with them through the bars.

If this isn't possible then keeping them side by side with the ability to interact through the bars is ok. I wouldn't attempt reintroducing them again, you'll just stress Coconut out and could end in disaster.

Thank you for your advice.

The cage was 6 x 5 c and c cage. So a big space but as they don't get on now it's split so Coco has 2 x 6 and Biscuit has 3 x 6 space to live in. I think 3 x 6 is big enough to have 2 pigs in when I find a friend for Biscuit and coconut seems okay in her 2 x 6 space.

Do your 2 boys seem happy enough living side by side with company through the bars?
Coconut is only 18 months and so lively, I was sad to think of her on her own.

 

[Beans&Toast]

Lunging and flying tackles (which are the last resort) are always defensive, fear-based behaviours.

The best you can do, is to give your new girl time; and I am not talking about a few days more. The problem with piggies like her is that you can never predict how long she needs, whether she will ever come round and whether Biscuit has by now made up her mind that she doesn't want her.

She can live next to Biscuit and a new friend and could even at some point join them but it would be no tragedy if she never got to that point, having full interaction through the bars but her own little territory. Hence my last proposal.

Not having seen the bonding or knowing her background, I cannot assess the situation properly; but from my own fair number of fear-aggressive piggies, it is always very much a play as you go along and with regular reassessments and not having any preconceptions - you have to play them by ear. It can take weeks but it can also take months or it may never happen. My recommendations are to give you that space and freedom to fill both Biscuit's need for companionship in the shorter term but also Coconut's need for space and time to hopefully come round at one point.

Whenever you bring home a piggy of your choice, you always have to plan for the case that the bonding may not work out.

Also to add, the strange thing is Biscuit was very accepting of Coconut, she was trying to bond with her and groom herself with her. Even after the first almost-attack, Biscuit still was happy to be around Coconut and showed no aggression. After the 2nd lunging, Biscuit became fearful of her. Coconut is just very scared I think and needs more time.

 

[Engel]

Thank you for your advice.

The cage was 6 x 5 c and c cage. So a big space but as they don't get on now it's split so Coco has 2 x 6 and Biscuit has 3 x 6 space to live in. I think 3 x 6 is big enough to have 2 pigs in when I find a friend for Biscuit and coconut seems okay in her 2 x 6 space.

Do your 2 boys seem happy enough living side by side with company through the bars?
Coconut is only 18 months and so lively, I was sad to think of her on her own.

Yes they seem fine with it. My one boy, Basil, has been neutered recently so he'll be going to live with my sows in December (hopefully) and the other, Cyril, will be living side by side with my other boys whom he loves interacting with anyway.

That's a lovely sized cage(s) for them, they're very lucky piggies.