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Guinea pig bladder issues and penis issue

KK327

KK327

Junior Guinea Pig
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I'm in a right pickle here! Stan - 4.5 year old boar (estimate) was 1595g - yes a chonk but vet said it was the right weight for him. Started presenting with not wanting to eat as much as usual and under the weather. Went to the vet - Bayril and metacam prescribed and indicated it was likely urinary tract infection or bladder sludge - his wee was a bit cloudy - but no one’s ton picked up in the sample or the second sample that went off to the lab.

Did the five days but he still didn’t seem right so back I asked the vet to check his penis etc and horrified it was really chocked up with stuff - vet took a lot out and instructed us to clean daily at home and sent us away with more baytril and metacam. Weight loss isn’t good - he was loosing every day and fighting me on the critical care front. 5 doses of antibiotic and pain relief and probiotic in their water and syringes two hours after and grass, veg and some fruit and still not doing great.

We’ve had a good wash today and it was still a bit funky but not too bad

Toddy I’ve managed to get critical care in but I also gave him readigrass which I bought with the oat grass - he’s not eating oats or bran that I’ve put in.

Today I felt we were doing better and more enthusiastic about eating and two feeds of critical care administered - he’s munched on Cotswold sweet and Timothy but absolutely LOVED the readigrass and I thought I’ve cracked it ! He’s going to make it - then tonight he’s squeaking when pooping - that started me panicking and I googled the readigrass and now I’m terrified I’ve made things worse.

I honestly am at breaking point trying to get this right and do the best for him but I’m failing miserably. I’ve just managed to feed him something that really helped with his appetite but going to make the situation worse.

I am now distraught. Racked with guilt and honestly not sure what to do next

Any help would be so gratefully received.
 
So sorry that you’re in such a difficult situation.
I’m not a health expert so can’t really advise.
You come across as a very caring owner and because you love your boy so much you naturally worry.
You are doing the very best for him so don’t try to get yourself over stressed.

I noted from another post you made that you are not confident in your vet so I responded to that message.

Please know that I am holding you in my thoughts
 
Morning.
How is Stan today?
Are you doing daily morning weight checks?
💐
 
Merab said:
So sorry that you’re in such a difficult situation.
I’m not a health expert so can’t really advise.
You come across as a very caring owner and because you love your boy so much you naturally worry.
You are doing the very best for him so don’t try to get yourself over stressed.

I noted from another post you made that you are not confident in your vet so I responded to that message.

Please know that I am holding you in my thoughts
Click to expand...
Thank you so much. This morning medicine went in and he actually wanted the critical care which is a first - they are just giving their veg portions and clean beds done. Not a whisp of readigrass in sight and I’ll let him finish and do his weight and see what he’s doing when he sees and poor. Thanks for the support I really appreciate it
CTWC said:
Morning.
How is Stan today?
Are you doing daily morning weight checks?
💐
Click to expand...
morning twice a day weighing - he was 1312g this morning but he actually took two feeds of critical care (wanted the syringe) and ate his veg - just a bit of romaine, cucumber, carrot and tomato. he’s eating some hay but not much but chomped grass down. He’s had medicine and the second critical care has probiotics in as does his water. I’m intending to give more critical care and some water (not masses on the water front) on and off all day to flush him out. I’ve cleaned his bottom but not done the penis exposure. He was very traumatised by that yesterday and he doesn’t seem to be peeing and eeking. He’s bright and keen. Thanks for the enquiry x
 
Glad he’s doing better today. Keep going you are doing great. 😊
 
So pleased he seems brighter.💐
Just noticed you'd mentioned tomatoes how often does he have them?
 
CTWC said:
So pleased he seems brighter.💐
Just noticed you'd mentioned tomatoes how often does he have them?
Click to expand...
Not very often and only a small amount - usually between the two a cherry tomato cut into four maybe once or twice a week - atm I’m trying to give him things with a bit of calorie in but also trying to be mindful of consequences - it’s very hard

He’s just has some more critical care and they are in their indoor run currently sniffing out tiny cubes of cucumber to get him moving about. He’s pretty lively and hopefully with lovely new hay boxes he will eat hay ! He’s eating hay at the moment.

Thanks again it makes me feel less alone and a bit less frightened
 

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I only asked as they can be quite acidic I think I read once.
We are all here for you it can be emotionally draining looking after these wonderful bundles of love can't it 💕
 
He just cried when he was having a wee but he’s eating hay
CTWC said:
I only asked as they can be quite acidic I think I read once.
We are all here for you it can be emotionally draining looking after these wonderful bundles of love can't it 💕
Click to expand...
oh I’ll take any guidance and I’ll certainly lay off the tomatoes ! Thank you for thinking of us xx
 
Can I ask is there any way you can tell if your guinea pig has a stone rather than sludge apart from an xray ? Do they present different symptoms ? I’m going to email the vet now to ask for X-rays - he’s not in today but back tomorrow so he will see it then - Stan is fairly bright and taking the critical care and munching now on some grass - he’s not hunched or sunken eyed. I know it’s hard to tell and I’m clutching at straws - thanks
 
I think an X-ray or ultrasound is the only way to definitely know for sure.
 
weepweeps said:
I think an X-ray or ultrasound is the only way to definitely know for sure.
Click to expand...
I've mailed the vet to ask if he does it or if I have to go to Piddle Valley which has an exotic vet. I rang them today and they said I would need the notes sent over from my vet to them (my vet suggested them) but the Vet in question is not back for a week! Mine is in tomorrow so I am hoping he can x ray him!
 
KK327 said:
I've mailed the vet to ask if he does it or if I have to go to Piddle Valley which has an exotic vet. I rang them today and they said I would need the notes sent over from my vet to them (my vet suggested them) but the Vet in question is not back for a week! Mine is in tomorrow so I am hoping he can x ray him!
Click to expand...
🤞🏻. I hope you can get an answer soon.
 
Sorry to be a pain but is this suitable for my piggy with either UTI or bladder sludge/stone. I’m terrified to give him the wrong thing ! Thank you
 

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I’m catching up with your thread.

Make sure you only weigh once a day. It should be done first thing in the morning before you give him any critical care or veg. This is then the most accurate.

If you weigh more than once a day or weigh after you’ve fed then all you are doing is picking up fluctuation and the weight of what he has eaten - it makes the weight checks inaccurate.

Has his weight stabilised day to day when you compare the first weight check of the day to the first weight check of the previous day? or is he still losing weight day on day?

Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support

I would not feed any fruit or carrot at all.

You say probiotics in his water? Do you mean you are actually adding it to their drinking bottle? If so then please don’t - nothing should ever be added to their water bottles. Only add a bit of probiotic to water which you are going to syringe directly to him or add it to syringe feed (if you are using a syringe feed which isn’t already fortified with it. Some already have probiotic added in which case you don’t give additional probiotic).

An x ray is the only way to see stones.
I’ve added a guide below which details the different types of bladder issues a piggy can have:
- faecal bacteria getting into the urinary tract which is opportunistic and will usually clear up easily with antibiotics
- sterile cystitis which is not bacterial so antibiotics won’t help. Characterised by repeated uti symptoms but it can’t be cured and only managed with glucosamine and pain meds during flares. Flares often set off by changes to the diet. They can get over it but it takes years.
- stones/sludge: something’s off balance in the diet or a genetic predisposition to cause stones. Stones bash the bladder and can allow bacterial infection within the bladder (cystitis). Usually need surgical removal of stones or sludge. Review of the diet also needed.
Wiebke's Guide to Pees and Stones

Oat hay is ok but as a small treat occasionally. Timothy or meadow hay should be the main hay
A Comprehensive Hay Guide for Guinea Pigs (incl. providers in several countries)
 
Piggies&buns said:
I’m catching up with your thread.

Make sure you only weigh once a day. It should be done first thing in the morning before you give him any critical care or veg. This is then the most accurate.

If you weigh more than once a day or weigh after you’ve fed then all you are doing is picking up fluctuation and the weight of what he has eaten - it makes the weight checks inaccurate.

Has his weight stabilised day to day when you compare the first weight check of the day to the first weight check of the previous day? or is he still losing weight day on day?

Weight and Weight Loss Explained: BMI, Weighing, Poos and Feeding Support

I would not feed any fruit or carrot at all.

You say probiotics in his water? Do you mean you are actually adding it to their drinking bottle? If so then please don’t - nothing should ever be added to their water bottles. Only add a bit of probiotic to water which you are going to syringe directly to him or add it to syringe feed (if you are using a syringe feed which isn’t already fortified with it. Some already have probiotic added in which case you don’t give additional probiotic).

An x ray is the only way to see stones.
I’ve added a guide below which details the different types of bladder issues a piggy can have:
- faecal bacteria getting into the urinary tract which is opportunistic and will usually clear up easily with antibiotics
- sterile cystitis which is not bacterial so antibiotics won’t help. Characterised by repeated uti symptoms but it can’t be cured and only managed with glucosamine and pain meds during flares. Flares often set off by changes to the diet. They can get over it but it takes years.
- stones/sludge: something’s off balance in the diet or a genetic predisposition to cause stones. Stones bash the bladder and can allow bacterial infection within the bladder (cystitis). Usually need surgical removal of stones or sludge. Review of the diet also needed.
Wiebke's Guide to Pees and Stones

Oat hay is ok but as a small treat occasionally. Timothy or meadow hay should be the main hay
A Comprehensive Hay Guide for Guinea Pigs (incl. providers in several countries)
Click to expand...
Hi

Thank you for your reply.

The probiotic is in their drinking water but I’m also giving him some with a syringe two hours after the bayril and pain relief. The bayril it really isn’t great for Stan in tummy terms and the vet guided me to the probiotic. It’s a complete mess - I don’t know if I’m coming or going.

The critical care is the apple and banana one - is this ok ? I have both but he doesn’t like it.


Unfortunately I only just picked this up and I’ve fed him critical care, bit of cucumber and a bit of lettuce and a syringe with water and probiotic at 4.00 am and just done medicines, some critical care which he wanted and then some water.

I weighed him just now which I know isn’t ideal as it’s after his feed but yesterday same time 1311 and today 1302.

I won’t give any fruit - again advised because if the weight loss to give him the high calorie veg and some fruit - can I just stick with lettuce (romaine), cucumber and some pepper ?

They don’t have pellets in - just dry oats - is this also wrong ? They used to have half a spoon of piggy parcels pellets for bladder health.

We started the bayril on the 26th in the evening - this is second run of five days - the prior run started 13th December.

The hay is Timothy and Cotswold sweet and a bit of oat hay - I can take the oat out if you think it will help.

I’ve washed his little bottom off and will do again later and cream his feet. I’ve changed his bed this morning - they get changed every day but I’ve been doing it twice to keep him from sitting on urine - it’s fleece bottomed to soak up better and hay.

There is blood in his urine and he cries when he is trying to go.

I am waiting on vet to read my email today.

I don’t know where I am going - if I can get xray and it’s not a stone but sludge do I try and get it flushed ? I know from Wieke postings it’s dangerous !

If it’s a stone then it’s an op - do I put him through this - my beautiful piggy is over 4 and a rescue?

I don’t want to give up on him but I’m afraid that he is suffering unnecessarily - what point do you call it a day ?

I am so traumatised from the hideous treatment we received with Squirrel that I am in a constant state of anxiety and stress.

If I lose Stan poor Waffles will be widowed again - he’s only 3. I don’t think I can do it all again but handing him back makes my heart break.

K
 
Sorry ….

Water bottles cleaned and fresh water in - this is always filtered. No probiotic.

I’ve been picking and washing grass for them twice a day is this ok?

How soon would his symptoms ease if it’s not a stone ?

Thanks again k
 
Yes - no probiotic in their drinking water bottle at all - nothing should ever be added to water bottles. It can cause changes to the water and stop them from drinking at all as well as encourage algae growth.
Only ever syringe probiotic directly to the piggy or add to syringe feed.

All About Drinking, Bottles and Dehydration

The apple and banana critical care is fine.
It’s things like certain versions of emeraid which already are fortified with probiotic.

To combat weight loss you give extra hay and syringe feed recovery food aiming for at least 60ml per day (could be as much as 100ml per day). You don’t give extra fruit or veg to make them gain weight (only stick to the one cup of veg per day as normal) as overfeeding it can then detract from their fibre (hay) intake and cause gut problems. It can lead to dysbiosis which is an overgrowth of the wrong kind of gut bacteria.
You can give an extra slice of cucumber to help with urination.

You can give a small amount of porridge oats as a calorie boost but that is usually only after they are recovered and looking to regain lost weight. The priority during illness is stopping weight loss and that is done by syringe feeding.

So he is likely on a continual downward trend wirh his weight loss - if so then you need to syringe feed more to stop it.

Not feeding pellets isn’t a problem at all - mine never get pellets anyway.

A surgical bladder flush will be needed if sludge is tightly packed in. It won’t come out on its own.

Boars need surgical removal of stones. Whether you do it is a discussion for you and your vet to have - it comes down to their experience and whether it is in his best interests.

Fresh grass is absolutely fine - not much nutrition in it now and make sure it isn’t frozen given we are expecting a cold spell

If it isn’t a stone and is a bacterial urine infection then it can take a few weeks of Antibiotics.

Blood in his urine can be a sign of stones.

If it isn’t stones but also isn’t a bacterial infection, then the antibiotics will never help and instead you would be looking at sterile cystitis which is only manageable with glucosamine and painkillers.
Sterile cystitis is a diagnosis only given by ruling out everything else first.
So yes he would need an x ray to find out whether it’s a stone/sludge
 
Is he displaying signs of pain?
What dosage of pain meds is he on?
Cat or dog version?
 
Piggies&buns said:
Yes - no probiotic in their drinking water bottle at all - nothing should ever be added to water bottles. It can cause changes to the water and stop them from drinking at all as well as encourage algae growth.
Only ever syringe probiotic directly to the piggy or add to syringe feed.

All About Drinking, Bottles and Dehydration

The apple and banana critical care is fine.
It’s things like certain versions of emeraid which already are fortified with probiotic.

To combat weight loss you give extra hay and syringe feed recovery food aiming for at least 60ml per day (could be as much as 100ml per day). You don’t give extra fruit or veg to make them gain weight (only stick to the one cup of veg per day as normal) as overfeeding it can then detract from their fibre (hay) intake and cause gut problems. It can lead to dysbiosis which is an overgrowth of the wrong kind of gut bacteria.
You can give an extra slice of cucumber to help with urination.

You can give a small amount of porridge oats as a calorie boost but that is usually only after they are recovered and looking to regain lost weight. The priority during illness is stopping weight loss and that is done by syringe feeding.

So he is likely on a continual downward trend wirh his weight loss - if so then you need to syringe feed more to stop it.

Not feeding pellets isn’t a problem at all - mine never get pellets anyway.

A surgical bladder flush will be needed if sludge is tightly packed in. It won’t come out on its own.

Boars need surgical removal of stones. Whether you do it is a discussion for you and your vet to have - it comes down to their experience and whether it is in his best interests.

Fresh grass is absolutely fine - not much nutrition in it now and make sure it isn’t frozen given we are expecting a cold spell

If it isn’t a stone and is a bacterial urine infection then it can take a few weeks of Antibiotics.

Blood in his urine can be a sign of stones.

If it isn’t stones but also isn’t a bacterial infection, then the antibiotics will never help and instead you would be looking at sterile cystitis which is only manageable with glucosamine and painkillers.
Sterile cystitis is a diagnosis only given by ruling out everything else first.
So yes he would need an x ray to find out whether it’s a stone/sludge
Click to expand...
Thank you -water done, critical care will be ramped up. X-ray asap and understood re the veg. Noted re the grass thank you.

I’m sorry I’m still a bit stumped with the probiotic - should I give a 1.0ml syringe full of water/probiotic 2 hours after the Bayril.

Should I request more Bayril to keep up the antibiotic until we know. The two urine samples taken originally at the lab did not show infection. Do I get another one done?

Thanks again for the help x
 
Yes you can give probiotic via syringe 2 hours after antibiotic. Or you can add a pinch of probiotic into his syringe feed which fall 2 hours before or after a dose of antibiotic.
(What you should not do, which is how I originally read your post, is add it into their water bottles).
What probiotic are you using?

It’s up to the vet to decide whether he needs the antibiotic still.
If the urine samples showed no bacteria in his urine then you would be more likely to be looking at this being stone, sludge or possibly sterile cystitis if stone is also ruled out.
If he has a stone then a stone bashing inside his bladder can cause an infection so he may still need the antibiotic.

Is it actually blood in his urine rather than porphyrines (a dye common at the onset of cystitis)
 
Piggies&buns said:
Is he displaying signs of pain?
What dosage of pain meds is he on?
Cat or dog version?
Click to expand...
.52ml of rheumocam dog twice a day

When he wees or poos but I’m just going to sit with them for a bit and see whether things are any easier this morning
 
Piggies&buns said:
Yes you can give probiotic via syringe 2 hours after antibiotic. Or you can add a pinch of probiotic into his syringe feed which fall 2 hours before or after a dose of antibiotic.
(What you should not do, which is how I originally read your post, is add it into their water bottles).
What probiotic are you using?

It’s up to the vet to decide whether he needs the antibiotic still.
If the urine samples showed no bacteria in his urine then you would be more likely to be looking at this being stone, sludge or possibly sterile cystitis if stone is also ruled out.
If he has a stone then a stone bashing inside his bladder can cause an infection so he may still need the antibiotic.

Is it actually blood in his urine rather than porphyrines (a dye common at the onset of cystitis)
Click to expand...
Blood for sure !

Yes it was in the water - not anymore!

Pro C professional
 
He’s just doing something - hard to say if poo or wee - tiny squeak but not major
 
KK327 said:
Blood for sure !

Yes it was in the water - not anymore!

Pro C professional
Click to expand...
KK327 said:
.52ml of rheumocam dog twice a day

When he wees or poos but I’m just going to sit with them for a bit and see whether things are any easier this morning
Click to expand...

I’m glad he is on dog version.

All you can do now is keep up with plenty of syringe feeding to stop further weight loss and wait for the vet to get back to you.
 
Piggies&buns said:
I’m glad he is on dog version.

All you can do now is keep up with plenty of syringe feeding to stop further weight loss and wait for the vet to get back to you.
Click to expand...
Thank you for everything you’ve made things so much clearer than they were - I’m just waiting on the critical care to expand to its max and I’ll start the volume you’ve suggested.

I’m beyond grateful for your help

K x
 
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