• Discussions taking place within this forum are intended for the purpose of assisting you in discussing options with your vet. Any other use of advice given here is done so at your risk, is solely your responsibility and not that of this forum or its owner. Before posting it is your responsibility you abide by this Statement

Aggressive And Pulsing - Help! Emergency Or Not?

Status
Not open for further replies.

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
Hello all,

My pigs (Weasley, the long haired one and Potter, the short haired one) have had a massive mood swing this evening and have gone from sleeping peacefully in the same igloo to suddenly trying very aggressively to dominate one another. Seperated them for a few minutes then brought them back together for a shared meal and they seem to have settled. However both are now being very lethargic (a lot more so than they have before after any dissagreement) and are pulsing from their lower left sides. The larger one is also popcorning every so often and has sneezed a few times. I checked and his nose is dry and there does not appear to be any mucus build up nor any eye/ear leakage that would lead me to expect an infection.

They have pulsed before which I put down to deep breathing, and had the larger one at the vet a few days ago for similarly aggressive behaviour (he ripped a good chunk of correx off the cage whilst I was at work and was still chewing away at the bars behind when I got home) and they couldn't find anything up with him.

Both are eating and pooping fine, but both play with their bottle so not sure if drinking has increased as most often ends up on the floor, seems a normal amount when observed though, and have never pulsed this badly before (it's happened in the past but much molder and I just put it down to heavy breathing whilst asleep) so I'd considered bloat as Weasley has had thia before but they show no discomfort with their bellies being touched.

I've tried to attached a wee video of them having a wee rest just now but it won't upload. Either way, is this something I need to be worried about? I'm just concerned they've done each other some harm but there are no visible injuries and I'd want to get them to an emergency vet asap if this is a sign of anything.

Thanks all in advance!
 

Wiebke

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
76,195
Reaction score
52,755
Points
3,466
Location
Coventry UK
Hello all,

My pigs (Weasley, the long haired one and Potter, the short haired one) have had a massive mood swing this evening and have gone from sleeping peacefully in the same igloo to suddenly trying very aggressively to dominate one another. Seperated them for a few minutes then brought them back together for a shared meal and they seem to have settled. However both are now being very lethargic (a lot more so than they have before after any dissagreement) and are pulsing from their lower left sides. The larger one is also popcorning every so often and has sneezed a few times. I checked and his nose is dry and there does not appear to be any mucus build up nor any eye/ear leakage that would lead me to expect an infection.

They have pulsed before which I put down to deep breathing, and had the larger one at the vet a few days ago for similarly aggressive behaviour (he ripped a good chunk of correx off the cage whilst I was at work and was still chewing away at the bars behind when I got home) and they couldn't find anything up with him.

Both are eating and pooping fine, but both play with their bottle so not sure if drinking has increased as most often ends up on the floor, seems a normal amount when observed though, and have never pulsed this badly before (it's happened in the past but much molder and I just put it down to heavy breathing whilst asleep) so I'd considered bloat as Weasley has had thia before but they show no discomfort with their bellies being touched.

I've tried to attached a wee video of them having a wee rest just now but it won't upload. Either way, is this something I need to be worried about? I'm just concerned they've done each other some harm but there are no visible injuries and I'd want to get them to an emergency vet asap if this is a sign of anything.

Thanks all in advance!
Hi

How old are your boys and how long have they been bonded? It sounds like they are either teenagers or about to hit the teenage months.

Diaphragmic breathing (heaving sides) when it signals a serious heart problem is continuous, very noticeable at all times and in all positions and it is accompanied by a noticeable lethargy/being off because the heart is struggling to pump.

It is not just off and on breathing when your boys are lying on their sides after a bout of popcorning and facing up to each other (that is the position you see normal breathing most clearly) - yours have far too much energy and are expending it lavishly! ;)
 

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
Hi wiebke,

Thank you for the quick response, knowing that has seriously reduced my stressing, I had read other forums about heart problems and was winding myself up about it, but it does only seem to be visible when they are lying down so I'm not pretty certain it's not that thankfully!

Weasley is 3 1/2 and Potter just turned 3 :) They've been bonded ever since I got Potter 3 years ago and have only ever had to be seperated overnight twice in that time (Weasley was originally with another pig owned by my old flatmate friend which was extrenely dominant so I adopted him when i moved out for his own sake due to frequent injury and got Potter so he had a wee friend) and other than wee play scuffles are normally the best of friends.

They've had some veggies now and are having a wee snooze all cuddled up so it seems I was just working myself up over nothing because they're usually quite a docile pair and I do worry about Weasley because of his past!

Thank you so much for putting my mind at easy, your comment was an instant calm down and greatly appreciated! :)
 

TheCavySlave

Adult Guinea Pig
Joined
Sep 30, 2016
Messages
1,375
Reaction score
1,282
Points
695
Location
Plutonian living in Surrey.
I want to say that our boys were bonded, and when we got them they had a tiny cage till we switched to a C&C and now they have a mansion. Anyway, while they were in the pet shop cage, they fought. Actual dashing around like whirlwinds. Nowadays, there's rumbling and so on but it's nothing more than adorable antics- chubby furballs being dominant!
 

Wiebke

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
76,195
Reaction score
52,755
Points
3,466
Location
Coventry UK
Hi wiebke,

Thank you for the quick response, knowing that has seriously reduced my stressing, I had read other forums about heart problems and was winding myself up about it, but it does only seem to be visible when they are lying down so I'm not pretty certain it's not that thankfully!

Weasley is 3 1/2 and Potter just turned 3 :) They've been bonded ever since I got Potter 3 years ago and have only ever had to be seperated overnight twice in that time (Weasley was originally with another pig owned by my old flatmate friend which was extrenely dominant so I adopted him when i moved out for his own sake due to frequent injury and got Potter so he had a wee friend) and other than wee play scuffles are normally the best of friends.

They've had some veggies now and are having a wee snooze all cuddled up so it seems I was just working myself up over nothing because they're usually quite a docile pair and I do worry about Weasley because of his past!

Thank you so much for putting my mind at easy, your comment was an instant calm down and greatly appreciated! :)
Sounds like they had a little tiff over something but have made peace again and have been celebrating it. Thankfully, adult boars rarely fall out permanently.

I have lost two young guinea pigs of mine to sudden acute heart failure - the really laboured, heaving breathing where the sides are working hard is unmistakable and it leaves the poor guinea pig with no energy for anything else. It is the equivalent of you desperately gasping for thin air after running up a mountain with your heart banging in your chest. THAT kind of needing the whole body to help the heart to pump. ;)

Heaving breathing as a result of heart failure, fluid filled lungs or a fluid filled chest cavity is thankfully fairly rare in my experience on the forum, as are many of the much touted heart symptoms you find online like hooting, which in most cases is just a temporarily slightly blocked nose.
However, real diaphragmic breathing is a symptom that should be seen by a vet as an emergency. it is better you ask once too often than too little.
 

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
I want to say that our boys were bonded, and when we got them they had a tiny cage till we switched to a C&C and now they have a mansion. Anyway, while they were in the pet shop cage, they fought. Actual dashing around like whirlwinds. Nowadays, there's rumbling and so on but it's nothing more than adorable antics- chubby furballs being dominant!
That's a cute way of looking at it :) glad to know I was just overreacting, sounds like your boys are quite the playful pair! I'm glad to hear they worked out their differences with the extra space :)

These two have had an ever growing c&c cage since I got them, when i moved to my current flat I got them their own bedroom so their cage is bigger than my bed. They'll take over the flat soon enough, but if all else fails a new extension it is haha!
 

Wiebke

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
76,195
Reaction score
52,755
Points
3,466
Location
Coventry UK
PS: We don't have a video upload on this forum - it is too expensive a feature, considering we run on member donations. You have to upload any video on a public setting somewhere else and then link it into your post.
 

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
Sounds like they had a little tiff over something but have made peace again and have been celebrating it. Thankfully, adult boars rarely fall out permanently.

I have lost two young guinea pigs of mine to sudden acute heart failure - the really laboured, heaving breathing where the sides are working hard is unmistakable and it leaves the poor guinea pig with no energy for anything else. It is the equivalent of you desperately gasping for thin air after running up a mountain with your heart banging in your chest. THAT kind of needing the whole body to help the heart to pump. ;)

Heaving breathing as a result of heart failure, fluid filled lungs or a fluid filled chest cavity is thankfully fairly rare in my experience on the forum, as are many of the much touted heart symptoms you find online like hooting, which in most cases is just a temporarily slightly stuffy nose. However, diaphragmic breathing is a symptom that should be seen by a vet as an emergency. it is better you ask once too often than too little.
It does look that way, they both seem happy enough now. :)

Oh no that's horrible, I'm sorry :( poor little things, twice is awful! That does make it seem much more distinct in my mind though, thank you! Doesn't seem anywhere near as bad as that, they've just worn themselves out by the sounds of it.

I'll be calling the vet as soon as they open tomorrow to get an appointment and get them checked out as you suggest, it doesn't sound like they need the stress of a trip all the way across town to wait at the emergency vet tonight but will keep a close eye for the next few hours to be safe!
 

TheCavySlave

Adult Guinea Pig
Joined
Sep 30, 2016
Messages
1,375
Reaction score
1,282
Points
695
Location
Plutonian living in Surrey.
Guinea pigs can have bursts of dominance for no reason, ours often teeth chatter and rumble, maybe Duncan will chase Godfrey off. Which we find hilarious, as Duncan is a bit smaller and Godfrey is bigger and chubbier, but runs away from his smaller brother:))
But then I sometimes get scared of my sister, who's nine.
She's just very scary:shh:
 

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
Hey all, quick update.

Sad to say Potter got worse over the week, had him in to the vet and they suspected a back or leg injury, and due to pain he stopped eating or taking in enough water and went in to gut stasis, had him to the vet several times and they did all they could and was syringe feeding and fluids at home but couldn't get him going again and he passed away Sunday afternoon.

Weasley now having similar issues but still eating pellets veg and hay, drinking and running about which is different but extreme straining to poop and his anus seems very swolen and painful. He is passing the occasional small poop which have gone from dry, greenish and soft to fairly damp with longish tails but a much nicer deep brown colour. Vet has given him an antiflamatory injection and he's getting syringes of emiprid twice daily to hopefully clear it up. They think it may just be a reaction to Potter's death but they're doing all they can.

On behalf of Potter I wanted to thank you all for the help you offered him and for keeping me calm enough to logically care for him when he got worse. Your help was incredibly appreciated and I'm glad there is a forum like this out there to help owners take the best care of their pigs.
 

BossHogg

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jun 13, 2011
Messages
18,372
Reaction score
41,628
Points
2,115
Sorry to hear your sad news, if you haven't already done so, you can leave a tribute to your piggy in our rainbow bridge section. :(
 

Adelle

Forum Donator 2019/20
Joined
Jun 24, 2015
Messages
3,205
Reaction score
8,455
Points
1,525
I'm so sorry for your loss.

With your pig with the swollen bum and messy poos- are you sure he isn't impacted? It's when lots of poo collects in a ball in the anal sac of a male. If you turn him upside down and gently part the anal area, is there a mass of poo visible? This link should give you more info:
Impaction Recovery - How To Help Your Guinea Pig.

Hope he recovers soon x
 

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
I'm so sorry for your loss.

With your pig with the swollen bum and messy poos- are you sure he isn't impacted? It's when lots of poo collects in a ball in the anal sac of a male. If you turn him upside down and gently part the anal area, is there a mass of poo visible? This link should give you more info:
Impaction Recovery - How To Help Your Guinea Pig.

Hope he recovers soon x
Thank you for the kind words :)

Yes that was one of the first things i checked, I hadn't found anything so have had him at the vets daily for a full check up and they think he'll make a full recovery. They think it was either stress induced from the fighting, something iffy that they've eaten or a combination of both but they've put Weasley on Baytril, Matacam and a strong dose of Emeprid and he's almost back to pooing normally, and thankfully seems much brighter :D
 

CraigGlasgow

Junior Guinea Pig
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
128
Reaction score
72
Points
205
Location
Glasgow
Further update:

Have had Weasley to the vet (I recently moved so have been staying with my parents and taking him back to his old vet who always seemed much more Cavy Savy) daily since Monday for a full check up and they've been great with him. He's had a daily gut masage, metacam and I've been giving him baytril twice a day and emeprid every 8 hours and he's almost back to his old self. They've said his guts sound and feel much healthier and his poops are almost normal again, so they want to take him off the painkillers until Saturday to see if there is an underlying cause being masked, but otherwise just finish off the current med cycle and he should make a full recovery. He had some veg again last night and some forage leaves this morning which got some popcorning and a much more energetic cage lap than I've seen in a fortnight so fingers crossed he's on the mend and will do okay without his little buddy :)

Only new behaviour I've noticed is itching, but both myself and the vet have done a thorough check for mites etc and found nothing, so she suggested giving him a bath and a haircut since he's maybe just not been grooming properly whilst he's been ill, which should give us some nice bonding time too. :)

Thanks to all for your support at this time :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top